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-   -   5-11 to 7-9 (https://blackandgold.com/saints/79362-5-11-7-9-a.html)

WillMacKenzie 08-27-2016 10:25 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
I remember when faith was the only thing we had to go on. A busted arm that nobody wanted, a first time head coach (who by the way chose to be here after seeing the devastation), a patchwork defense, no home field, a next to last 7th rounder named Colston, basically an entire team where everyone else's castoffs came home to roost.

We also went 1-3 then in that preseason, and looked AWFUL in the Dallas game.

I don't much care what other teams are doing in the preseason. I believe in our coach, I believe in our players, I believe in our young defense, I believe in underdogs, cause I been one my whole life. Let's not turn our backs on this team when they need us the most. We're not Falcons fans.

spkb25 08-27-2016 10:27 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno (Post 714331)
Me too. They didn't look good last night but they didn't look as pathetic as many are saying.

I saw some encouraging signs from a very very young team. We may have the youngest starting defense in the league when the season starts. And we're probably just as young on offense without Strief and Brees.

Pittsburgh has an explosive offense (3rd best in the NFL) and they targeted our rookie CB's through the air.

We'll be fine, although another injury to Armstead is as concerning as an injury to Brees. If we lose that cat, we're in big trouble.

"We've kept things very simple up to this point and so it's not like we're out there with a great game plan and trying to trick people and throwing the kitchen sink at them." -- Drew Brees.

I'm sticking with 10-6, but I am a little bit more nervous about it now.
I hope you're right but there was nothing I saw encouraging. I saw a team that looks exactly like they have the last two seasons. This is more than likely the third straight losing season for SP...How many does it take ? I sincerely hope you're right, but we are sloppy and play poorly.

Just out of curiosity was Pittsburgh able to execute because they were throwing the kitchen sink at us?

spkb25 08-27-2016 10:32 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillMacKenzie (Post 714332)
I remember when faith was the only thing we had to go on. A busted arm that nobody wanted, a first time head coach (who by the way chose to be here after seeing the devastation), a patchwork defense, no home field, a next to last 7th rounder named Colston, basically an entire team where everyone else's castoffs came home to roost.

We also went 1-3 then in that preseason, and looked AWFUL in the Dallas game.

I don't much care what other teams are doing in the preseason. I believe in our coach, I believe in our players, I believe in our young defense, I believe in underdogs, cause I been one my whole life. Let's not turn our backs on this team when they need us the most. We're not Falcons fans.
sure if we didn't have the same coach with exactly the same results the last two seasons. your argument loses meaning because this is exactly what we have seen the previous two seasons under the same exact coach. So this is absolutely nothing like 2006, but I sure do wish you were right

spkb25 08-27-2016 10:33 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno (Post 714331)
Me too. They didn't look good last night but they didn't look as pathetic as many are saying.
33 yards in the first quarter isn't pathetic?

WillMacKenzie 08-27-2016 10:33 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 714335)
sure if we didn't have the same coach with exactly the same results the last two seasons. your argument loses meaning because this is exactly what we have seen the previous two seasons under the same exact coach. So this is absolutely nothing like 2006, but I sure do wish you were right
...but we got Rob'ed

The Dude 08-27-2016 10:40 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rell&Gold (Post 714261)
Is there any REALISTIC move that can be made to get us a pass rusher and a guard ASAP?
Yes. Minnesota has several offensive lineman in a log jam and the dude in Dallas is still around. Idk about a pass rusher though.

spkb25 08-27-2016 10:51 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillMacKenzie (Post 714337)
...but we got Rob'ed
I am talking about the offense. I could care less about the d right now. That's a whole other story. Our offense is sluggish and unable to move the ball. Go back and look at last season, the start of last season. Same ineffective ****:

409 yards
323 yards
380 yards
438 yards
386 yards
385 yards


And the thing is some of these games we weren't doing much offensively until the game was out of reach. So the other team is in prevent so of course you start moving the ball.

2011:
475 yards
382 yards
454 yards
503 yards
444 yards
453 yards

2009:
515
421
378
343
493
414

But by all means tell me how the offense is just as good as it always has been

The Dude 08-27-2016 10:53 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
It's not that bad. Running game improved. You guys act like every game we are going to play is going to be against a super bowl team. Other teams suck and have it worse than we do.

WillMacKenzie 08-27-2016 11:19 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
I never mentioned the offense specifically, because when you're ranked #1 and #2 in total offense the last two years respectively, and have landed outside the top 5 only once in a decade, I didn't think I had to.

You can compare 3-4 combined quarters through 3 preseason games to a decade of top 5 regular season offensive statistics if you'd like.

A more telling stat is that we were still nearly 8-8 with historically bad defense. If DA's blitzing schemes can be nearly as effective as GW's, 10-6 is a reasonable goal, being only 3 games better than 7-9. We can be even better, but I'm tempering my expectations as of late.

Trying to be encouraging, just accept it! Let your troubled mind bask in the tranquility of optimism

saintfan 08-27-2016 11:32 AM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/73...8612b87869.jpg

pherein 08-27-2016 01:18 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 714299)
It' was pretty bad last night. I looked at the schedule after the game last night and 6 games I give us being generous. I don't see Brees here after this season, he'll know how Archie felt for years at this rate. Payton got away from his bread and butter, a strong O-line.
Yeah it was pretty bad. Agree with you on alot. Th OL is ... trying to think if there is a worse word than horrible. Its to bad we cant field a good team after 3 years of so called " rebuilding", very disapointing. We are not a threat to anyone. Not going to be a good season.

spkb25 08-27-2016 01:41 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dude (Post 714342)
It's not that bad. Running game improved. You guys act like every game we are going to play is going to be against a super bowl team. Other teams suck and have it worse than we do.
33 yards in the first quarter, not that bad at all

spkb25 08-27-2016 01:46 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillMacKenzie (Post 714343)
I never mentioned the offense specifically, because when you're ranked #1 and #2 in total offense the last two years respectively, and have landed outside the top 5 only once in a decade, I didn't think I had to.

You can compare 3-4 combined quarters through 3 preseason games to a decade of top 5 regular season offensive statistics if you'd like.

A more telling stat is that we were still nearly 8-8 with historically bad defense. If DA's blitzing schemes can be nearly as effective as GW's, 10-6 is a reasonable goal, being only 3 games better than 7-9. We can be even better, but I'm tempering my expectations as of late.

Trying to be encouraging, just accept it! Let your troubled mind bask in the tranquility of optimism
I certainly will not accept unrealistic turd polishing. You can certainly place it forward, but I am going to produce honest assessments each and every time. You can **** rainbows and sunshine all day, but we are 7-9, 3 of the last 4 seasons, and if we have a winning record this season I will be surprised. Again, I hope all of you are correct, but there is absolutely nothing to point to such optimism, nothing at all.

By all means bask in BS, have at it because once the reality hits in the reg season you're likely to be hard to find around the boards.

spkb25 08-27-2016 01:47 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pherein (Post 714354)
Yeah it was pretty bad. Agree with you on alot. Th OL is ... trying to think if there is a worse word than horrible. Its to bad we cant field a good team after 3 years of so called " rebuilding", very disapointing. We are not a threat to anyone. Not going to be a good season.
This is the scary part. Jacksonville looks to be improving. How can you just keep producing crap and you have been building for three years and nothing is improving.

WillSaints81 08-27-2016 01:49 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nola_swammi (Post 714289)
Really missed those days we had Aaron Kromer as the OL coordinator. If it's not the guards ****** up the rb are fumbling. Somebody, hopefully Armsted or Unger take a strong leadership role to motivate the guards to perform better

So we're going to just cry over that instead of doing something about it. There is not just one magic answer. How about actually drafting olinemen like other teams have been doing to get better. They didn't want to draft any left over guards because the good ones were gone. Well, was Vonn Bell necessary? There were two SEC guards still in that draft when we picked in fourth.

I don't think the saints honestly planned to contend this season.

WillSaints81 08-27-2016 01:53 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
I have to ask........was the dome loud? Is the flood having a effect?

And more and more I believe the family problems at the top may actually be having an effect.

spkb25 08-27-2016 01:53 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
deleted post, willsaint81 I confused you with willmak, my bad

The Dude 08-27-2016 01:56 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 714309)
SP has had 5 wining seasons and 4 losing seasons. Can we really call him a good NFL coach?
One was a Super Bowl and another got us to the NFC title game. Better than most.
We miss Kromer and why we got rid of Evsns AND Grubbs at the same time baffles me.
I heard his pressor. Yes Payton our line does need to get better. Go do something about it.

jnormand 08-27-2016 02:00 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Championship!...(crickets chirping).....

I said championship!!!! Wahooo! Sean and Co. are just messin with everyone this preseason! (Still crickets)

Here we come Super Bowl!!!

spkb25 08-27-2016 02:04 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dude (Post 714370)
One was a Super Bowl and another got us to the NFC title game. Better than most.
We miss Kromer and why we got rid of Evsns AND Grubbs at the same time baffles me.
I heard his pressor. Yes Payton our line does need to get better. Go do something about it.
so he used to be a good head coach. agree, but I don't think he is anymore, and I sure hope I am wrong, but the team doesn't seem to have made any progress in 3 years

dizzle88 08-27-2016 02:27 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 714372)
so he used to be a good head coach. agree, but I don't think he is anymore, and I sure hope I am wrong, but the team doesn't seem to have made any progress in 3 years
Great coaches win

We are barely hovering above .500 with Payton, one more losing season and we'll be 5-5 in terms of winning and losing seasons.

How much longer is he going to be classed as a successful coach? We won a superbowl nearly 7 years ago and have made 3 trips to the playoffs since.

We'll see how this season plays out, preseason is not making it look promising but another non-playoff season and I absolutely have to believe Payton is on his way out.

CharityMike 08-27-2016 02:37 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
LOL at the excuses some are coming up with. Did any of you stay on the channel to hear coach's presser after the game? I did. Guess what...he knows our O line is eff'd. He actually said the lines on both sides but specifically talked about the O line saying it's worrisome. Does that give you nice warm fuzzies? His presser looked like a mid season presser and he looked worn out already. I want to believe as much as the next guy but all the signs are pointing to a looong season.

Danno 08-27-2016 03:01 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Harper said the team played without fire or passion. Thats a lot more worrisome to me than a couple holes here and there on the roster.

Has Payton lost that fire?

dizzle88 08-27-2016 03:07 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno (Post 714378)
Harper said the team played without fire or passion. Thats a lot more worrisome to me than a couple holes here and there on the roster.

Has Payton lost that fire?
I think he lost it after 2013. I just don't see the passion and fight in him anymore.

I believe Payton should be firmly on the hot seat, another losing season is not acceptable, anything less than a playoff appearance and I'd start looking at life after Sean.

The Dude 08-27-2016 03:58 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
We haven't even played a game yet. The season hasn't even started.

spkb25 08-27-2016 04:00 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno (Post 714378)
Harper said the team played without fire or passion. Thats a lot more worrisome to me than a couple holes here and there on the roster.

Has Payton lost that fire?
I don't think SP lost the fire, I think he has lost the ability to have the team respond

halloween 65 08-27-2016 04:01 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dizzle88 (Post 714380)
I think he lost it after 2013. I just don't see the passion and fight in him anymore.

I believe Payton should be firmly on the hot seat, another losing season is not acceptable, anything less than a playoff appearance and I'd start looking at life after Sean.
If he gets fired I would get rid of all his cronies to. Bill Cowher would be my choice as HC.

spkb25 08-27-2016 04:10 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dude (Post 714389)
We haven't even played a game yet. The season hasn't even started.
this preseason does not sit in isolation. It isn't like we were 9-7 and then 10-6 the last two seasons and there is reason for optimism. We have been bad two years in a row without an ounce of improvement. the oline is the worst it has ever been here, the worst. People saying these things without playing a game are because we have the last two seasons to go off coupled with this preseason.

nola_swammi 08-27-2016 04:13 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CharityMike (Post 714375)
LOL at the excuses some are coming up with. Did any of you stay on the channel to hear coach's presser after the game? I did. Guess what...he knows our O line is eff'd. He actually said the lines on both sides but specifically talked about the O line saying it's worrisome. Does that give you nice warm fuzzies? His presser looked like a mid season presser and he looked worn out already. I want to believe as much as the next guy but all the signs are pointing to a looong season.
It was pretty obvious our OL stunk but you see how he deflecting the OL with the DL? The DL actually was pushing the 1 st two drives but Ben reading that he have 1 on 1 with a rookie D Harris on A Brown burned us (how can you pressure a qb if held the ball for less than 2 seconds) then P J Williams. Give me a f***** break.

I haven't seen them develop one rookie since M Colston. Breaux was not a rookie so don't even mention him. Cooks still questionable. Ingram, how can he fully develop with that OL?

spkb25 08-27-2016 04:15 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 714391)
If he gets fired I would get rid of all his cronies to. Bill Cowher would be my choice as HC.
i'd like a tough guy like Bill, but I don't think Bill is coming back.

Danno 08-27-2016 04:20 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nola_swammi (Post 714401)
It was pretty obvious our OL stunk but you see how he deflecting the OL with the DL? The DL actually was pushing the 1 st two drives but Ben reading that he have 1 on 1 with a rookie D Harris on A Brown burned us (how can you pressure a qb if held the ball for less than 2 seconds) then P J Williams. Give me a f***** break.

I haven't seen them develop one rookie since M Colston. Breaux was not a rookie so don't even mention him. Cooks still questionable. Ingram, how can he fully develop with that OL?
Rookies we've developed...
Jordan
Davison
Richardson
Galette
Cooks
Armstead
Ivory
Strief
Harper
Stinchcomb
Bushrod
Anthony
Morstead
J Graham
A Johnson
Kikaha

saintshrimp 08-27-2016 04:28 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Well it's finally good to see you guys seeing the light. I've been saying it all along last year and this year. lot of people said I was nuts good to see you guys saw the eye doctor .

lee909 08-27-2016 04:55 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spkb25 (Post 714390)
I don't think SP lost the fire, I think he has lost the ability to have the team respond
Im fully with this. Not been the same since the suspension. I sadly think its time to move on,but move on everywhere including a owner. Both Benson age and family issues mean he isnt running the team like needed and Loomis is on a very long leash for a man that has drafted so poorly and though a great bean counter has given out terrible contracts.

If the playoffs are not made id want change all round the coaches,front office and even Brees as if the team is blown up you may aswell take that step too. That $25ml a year could pick you up a pair of guards,pay Unger and get pay a good chunk of another top piece.

You give a above average QB a line like(two good guards) Armstead-G-Unger-G-RT and weapons like Cooks,Snead,Thomas and Ingram and they'll do well enough

nola_swammi 08-27-2016 04:57 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danno (Post 714404)
Rookies we've developed...
Jordan
Davison
Richardson
Galette
Cooks
Armstead
Ivory
Strief
Harper
Stinchcomb
Bushrod
Anthony
Morstead
J Graham
A Johnson.
Kikaha
Jordan, I stand corrected yet a number one pick should be NFL ready
Davidson is incomplete only second yr
Richardson same as Davidson
Galette you see how that turned out
Cooks same as Jordan
Armstead I stand corrected, saints haven't developed a player since 2013
Ivory read Armstead
Strief are you f**** serious
Harper during Colston era, anyway I was corrected by Armstead
Stinchcomb was before Colston
Bushrod read Harper
Anthony how are they developing him after they switch him
Morested came out booming kicks
J Graham that was a Drew Bree's development since DB been in the league he utilize tight end
Kikaha shuffle board haven't been in league yet to be determined

vpheughan 08-27-2016 06:06 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Define: Above Average QB, Andy Dalton?

AsylumGuido 08-27-2016 06:32 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillMacKenzie (Post 714332)
I remember when faith was the only thing we had to go on. A busted arm that nobody wanted, a first time head coach (who by the way chose to be here after seeing the devastation), a patchwork defense, no home field, a next to last 7th rounder named Colston, basically an entire team where everyone else's castoffs came home to roost.

We also went 1-3 then in that preseason, and looked AWFUL in the Dallas game.

I don't much care what other teams are doing in the preseason. I believe in our coach, I believe in our players, I believe in our young defense, I believe in underdogs, cause I been one my whole life. Let's not turn our backs on this team when they need us the most. We're not Falcons fans.
I don't know, Will. I am a regular member of a Falcons forum and these whiney-assed people around here sound exactly like Falcons' fans.

AsylumGuido 08-27-2016 06:36 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by halloween 65 (Post 714391)
If he gets fired I would get rid of all his cronies to. Bill Cowher would be my choice as HC.
Bill Cowher isn't coming back to coaching.

AsylumGuido 08-27-2016 06:37 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by saintshrimp (Post 714408)
Well it's finally good to see you guys seeing the light. I've been saying it all along last year and this year. lot of people said I was nuts good to see you guys saw the eye doctor .
You are nuts.

jnormand 08-27-2016 06:45 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 714436)
I don't know, Will. I am a regular member of a Falcons forum and these whiney-assed people around here sound exactly like Falcons' fans.
Lmao! I don't throw in the towel till we're mathematically eliminated from the post season...even then I still watch and hope they win.

We haven't even started the regular season and everyone is freaking out... understandably, but still! We're undefeated right now in the regular season.

CharityMike 08-27-2016 06:51 PM
Re: 5-11 to 7-9
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nola_swammi (Post 714401)
It was pretty obvious our OL stunk but you see how he deflecting the OL with the DL? The DL actually was pushing the 1 st two drives but Ben reading that he have 1 on 1 with a rookie D Harris on A Brown burned us (how can you pressure a qb if held the ball for less than 2 seconds) then P J Williams. Give me a f***** break.

I haven't seen them develop one rookie since M Colston. Breaux was not a rookie so don't even mention him. Cooks still questionable. Ingram, how can he fully develop with that OL?
I have no argument with anything you said. Pitt running the no huddle the entire first half was definitely not expected im assuming.

As to what Harper said, anybody with eyes who watched that could tell they didn't play with passion. When the head coach looks defeated from the 3rd preseason game already, that is way more troubling IMO.

The most passionate player on the field was Mauti. He was playing like a man trying to get a job, which is what I expected to see more of but was left wanting.


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