Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday

10-16-2016, 08:41 PM

Good to see someone is stepping up.!

jeanpierre · 10-16-2016, 09:20 PM

Originally Posted by WillSaints81

Just wow. Let's blame the defense because Payton's cute playcalling constantly puts Carolina back on the field. I have seen enough we just don't do on offense what we used to do.

A top five defense forces four straight punts. This is not a top five defense and we knew that, we said with a top 20 defense we were good enough to win. Payton is trying to hold something back on offense for whatever he has planned. I'm guessing Seattle. Thomas, Snead, Cooks, Ingram alone are good enough to win without having to kill drives with Hill, Cadet. Hill cost us two drives, yes he scores but the redzone doesn't matter, anyone on this offense can score in the redzone but they can't move the chains enough.

Originally Posted by Danno

We're 4th best in the NFL on converting 3rd downs.

Will makes a good point; we were up 21 pts and Payton decides to roll the Rookie kicker out for an ~55+ yard kick rather than convert a 4th and short...

Payton has got to put teams away; that missed field goal was a high risk and it gave Sham Newton great field position which they took advantage...

If he didn't think we could convert, then he shoulda punted as a long field goal like that wasn't necessary and a conversion and continued drive could have really put a nail in this thing and kept our defense off the field longer...

Danno is correct in so far that we do move up and down at times, but when we needed conversions and time of possession, the offense faltered and the team let the Panthers back in the game...

It starts with the coaching decisions and game management...

Crusader · 10-16-2016, 11:01 PM

Originally Posted by Danno

We're 4th best in the NFL on converting 3rd downs.

Now now, don't destroy a good story by bringing actual facts...

WillSaints81 · 10-17-2016, 12:57 AM

Originally Posted by jeanpierre

Will makes a good point; we were up 21 pts and Payton decides to roll the Rookie kicker out for an ~55+ yard kick rather than convert a 4th and short...

Payton has got to put teams away; that missed field goal was a high risk and it gave Sham Newton great field position which they took advantage...

If he didn't think we could convert, then he shoulda punted as a long field goal like that wasn't necessary and a conversion and continued drive could have really put a nail in this thing and kept our defense off the field longer...

Danno is correct in so far that we do move up and down at times, but when we needed conversions and time of possession, the offense faltered and the team let the Panthers back in the game...

It starts with the coaching decisions and game management...

We're fourth best on 3rd downs because we are a fast paced offense and have so many opportunities. I have said it before, Payton's playcalling is like gambling. And it's not just a defense that gets stops that is needed. Because of this style of offense, they need turnovers. Which we knew was gonna be hard to get this season. That SD game was a wet dream for the defense fans who crowed about Brees needing short fields to score.

I can with certainty it would be hard for the saints to give up three straight TDs and if Carolina was down 28-3 they would have certainly panicked. Nobody is out of it being down two TDs anymore. It seems though the offense only scores in the first two Qs and takes the third Q off. Offensive stats are inflated by fourth Q desperation. It's not about stats, it's about real time situations.

Six straight drives where only one TD happened. But Payton's gonna do things his way so defense has to learn to play with passion for Hill and Cadet's crappy 3 yarders.

jnormand · 10-17-2016, 01:55 AM

I'm just happy we won 2 in a row.

The Dude · 10-17-2016, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

We're 4th best in the NFL on converting 3rd downs.

And we scored 40 points against what is still a pretty damn good defense. How on earth can anyone blame the offense???? It's the offenses job to score points and that's what they do.

jeanpierre · 10-17-2016, 02:50 PM

Not just words, but action...

jnormand, RockyMountainSaint and dizzle88 like this.

WillSaints81 · 10-17-2016, 02:54 PM

Back in 2009 and 2011

Did the saints quit after going 21-0?

What about against Carolina week 17 in 2011
It was back and forth shootout early 21- even and then saints took over and pulled away.

Where is the resiliency? 21 is not enough to win now or hold a lead. We were never a great defense. Maybe we are better off playing early in shootouts and winning late on defense like that packers game both times We have forgotten really how to win and even the fans have forgotten. I saw a lot of high scoring explosive games by us in 2011 where defense did just okay.

Did anyone seem to forget Carolina almost came back against Atlanta? It does not matter what defense you have, superstars are superstars. We are not God-like on defense and we are not gonna play a half effort as a team and keep superstars from doing something. When a team pulls within 21-10 that's a wake up call that you don't sit on a lead. The Pittsburgh steelers came back down 24-7 against Denver last year but is anyone saying Denver's a bad defense? No, it is called will to win. Whether you like it or not Carolina has that emotional aptitude to win just like we had in our glory years. We didn't play many teams back then like that. We actually started the whole reason teams have formed playmakers to compete with our offense.

You don't give a team who believes they are like the patriots a window to comeback. You can't stop aggression without JJ Watt.

WillSaints81 · 10-17-2016, 02:57 PM

Those players coaches are telling those QBs "This is the saints their defense will eventually wear down, keep going at it and hope for the offense to slip up".

Also I'm not sure how turnovers work out except for maybe to give Brees more energy. But those teams have even more opportunities to get something done because shorter drives means less time taken off.

Rell&Gold · 10-17-2016, 02:58 PM

How do we know Sean was calling plays & not Pete?...IJS

10-16-2016, 08:41 PM	#11
Threaded by QBREES9 Moderator Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: New Haven Ct Posts: 23,989 Rating: (0 votes - average) Good to see someone is stepping up.!
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10-16-2016, 09:20 PM	#12
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday Originally Posted by WillSaints81 Just wow. Let's blame the defense because Payton's cute playcalling constantly puts Carolina back on the field. I have seen enough we just don't do on offense what we used to do. A top five defense forces four straight punts. This is not a top five defense and we knew that, we said with a top 20 defense we were good enough to win. Payton is trying to hold something back on offense for whatever he has planned. I'm guessing Seattle. Thomas, Snead, Cooks, Ingram alone are good enough to win without having to kill drives with Hill, Cadet. Hill cost us two drives, yes he scores but the redzone doesn't matter, anyone on this offense can score in the redzone but they can't move the chains enough. Originally Posted by Danno We're 4th best in the NFL on converting 3rd downs. Will makes a good point; we were up 21 pts and Payton decides to roll the Rookie kicker out for an ~55+ yard kick rather than convert a 4th and short... Payton has got to put teams away; that missed field goal was a high risk and it gave Sham Newton great field position which they took advantage... If he didn't think we could convert, then he shoulda punted as a long field goal like that wasn't necessary and a conversion and continued drive could have really put a nail in this thing and kept our defense off the field longer... Danno is correct in so far that we do move up and down at times, but when we needed conversions and time of possession, the offense faltered and the team let the Panthers back in the game... It starts with the coaching decisions and game management...
	It's not that my way is the right way, I just make the right way my way...

10-16-2016, 11:01 PM	#13
Crusader Resident Swede Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Märsta, Sweden Posts: 8,033	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday Originally Posted by Danno We're 4th best in the NFL on converting 3rd downs. Now now, don't destroy a good story by bringing actual facts... RockyMountainSaint likes this.

10-17-2016, 12:57 AM	#14
WillSaints81 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 4,273	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday Originally Posted by jeanpierre Will makes a good point; we were up 21 pts and Payton decides to roll the Rookie kicker out for an ~55+ yard kick rather than convert a 4th and short... Payton has got to put teams away; that missed field goal was a high risk and it gave Sham Newton great field position which they took advantage... If he didn't think we could convert, then he shoulda punted as a long field goal like that wasn't necessary and a conversion and continued drive could have really put a nail in this thing and kept our defense off the field longer... Danno is correct in so far that we do move up and down at times, but when we needed conversions and time of possession, the offense faltered and the team let the Panthers back in the game... It starts with the coaching decisions and game management... We're fourth best on 3rd downs because we are a fast paced offense and have so many opportunities. I have said it before, Payton's playcalling is like gambling. And it's not just a defense that gets stops that is needed. Because of this style of offense, they need turnovers. Which we knew was gonna be hard to get this season. That SD game was a wet dream for the defense fans who crowed about Brees needing short fields to score. I can with certainty it would be hard for the saints to give up three straight TDs and if Carolina was down 28-3 they would have certainly panicked. Nobody is out of it being down two TDs anymore. It seems though the offense only scores in the first two Qs and takes the third Q off. Offensive stats are inflated by fourth Q desperation. It's not about stats, it's about real time situations. Six straight drives where only one TD happened. But Payton's gonna do things his way so defense has to learn to play with passion for Hill and Cadet's crappy 3 yarders.

10-17-2016, 01:55 AM	#15
jnormand 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: The Free State of Idaho Posts: 5,740	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday I'm just happy we won 2 in a row. Crusader likes this.

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10-17-2016, 11:45 AM	#16
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,055	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday Originally Posted by Danno We're 4th best in the NFL on converting 3rd downs. And we scored 40 points against what is still a pretty damn good defense. How on earth can anyone blame the offense???? It's the offenses job to score points and that's what they do.
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10-17-2016, 02:50 PM	#17
jeanpierre Site Donor 2018 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 43,543 Blog Entries: 39	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday *Not just words, but action...* Twitter jnormand, RockyMountainSaint and dizzle88 like this.

10-17-2016, 02:54 PM	#18
WillSaints81 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 4,273	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday Back in 2009 and 2011 Did the saints quit after going 21-0? What about against Carolina week 17 in 2011 It was back and forth shootout early 21- even and then saints took over and pulled away. Where is the resiliency? 21 is not enough to win now or hold a lead. We were never a great defense. Maybe we are better off playing early in shootouts and winning late on defense like that packers game both times We have forgotten really how to win and even the fans have forgotten. I saw a lot of high scoring explosive games by us in 2011 where defense did just okay. Did anyone seem to forget Carolina almost came back against Atlanta? It does not matter what defense you have, superstars are superstars. We are not God-like on defense and we are not gonna play a half effort as a team and keep superstars from doing something. When a team pulls within 21-10 that's a wake up call that you don't sit on a lead. The Pittsburgh steelers came back down 24-7 against Denver last year but is anyone saying Denver's a bad defense? No, it is called will to win. Whether you like it or not Carolina has that emotional aptitude to win just like we had in our glory years. We didn't play many teams back then like that. We actually started the whole reason teams have formed playmakers to compete with our offense. You don't give a team who believes they are like the patriots a window to comeback. You can't stop aggression without JJ Watt.

10-17-2016, 02:57 PM	#19
WillSaints81 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 4,273	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday Those players coaches are telling those QBs "This is the saints their defense will eventually wear down, keep going at it and hope for the offense to slip up". Also I'm not sure how turnovers work out except for maybe to give Brees more energy. But those teams have even more opportunities to get something done because shorter drives means less time taken off.

10-17-2016, 02:58 PM	#20
Rell&Gold 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington, D.C Posts: 2,891	Re: Kenny Vaccaro turns down day off, requests defensive players come in to watch film on Monday How do we know Sean was calling plays & not Pete?...IJS

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