Two positions

Danno · 01-18-2017, 07:34 PM

Originally Posted by ScottF

Revisiting the OP, which I believe is Alabamanian for "if we don't upgrade these positions we will suck again.

Yep, but it ain't just wisdom from Alabama, its just wisdom in general.

Keep in mind half my upbringing was in Baton Rouge and New Orleans, so I'm not just some bias Bama knucklehead who recently decided to follow the Saints. I've been on board from day 1.

But you are correct in that I believe if we don't significantly upgrade those 2 positions, we will suck again.

halloween 65 · 01-18-2017, 09:17 PM

Originally Posted by hagan714

Glaring issue
Zach Strief Age: 33
Jahri Evans Age: 33

Solution
Kevin Zeitler RG Cincinnati Bengals 26
Rick Wagner RT Baltimore Ravens 26

Keeping Zach and Jahri in an active rotation works for me. The OL would be the deepest and most talented we have had in years. maybe ever.

Huge issue and you have to take into account the saints have gotten shorter at CB will the receivers in our division and around the NFL are getting taller. Lost way to many jump balls for touchdowns. Plenty of opportunity to address the issue with solid prospects through out the draft. This is a great draft to add talent and height. Heck if the saints added 3 of these CB/FS types in this draft I could accept it.

Marlon Humphrey CB/FS Alabama 6005 196 4.49 #26 rSo
Quincy Wilson CB/FS Florida 6012 211 4.54 #6 Jr
Cordrea Tankersley CB/FS Clemson 6002 195 4.48 #25 Sr
*Marshon Lattimore CB Ohio State 6000 195 4.47 #2 rSo
Brandon Facyson CB Virginia Tech 6011 191 4.52 #31 Jr
Kevin King CB/FS Washington 6032 192 4.56 #20 Sr
Rasul Douglas, CB West Virginia 6012 208 4.46 #13 rSr
Channing Stribling CB Michigan 6011 176 4.52 #8 Sr
Treston Decoud CB/FS Oregon State 6020 4.54 208 #14 Sr
Ahkello Witherspoon CB/FS Colorado 6021 195 4.59 #23 rSr
Jeremy Cutrer CB/FS Middle Tennesse 6011 170 4.49 #8 Sr

SDE there are some good options in the draft to upgrade this position.

*Derek Barnett SDE Tennessee 6025 265 4.65 #9 Jr
Daeshon Hall, DE, Texas A&M 6052 260 4.78 #10 Sr
Solomon Thomas SDE Stanford 6021 275 4.84 #90 rSo
Taco Charlton DE Michigan 6052 272 4.87 #33 Sr,
Da’Shawn Hand DE/DT Alabama 6035 280 4.74 #9 Jr
Bryan Cox DE Florida 6031 260 4.77 #94 rSr
Trey Hendrickson DE Florida Atlantic 6036 270 4.82 #9 Sr
Tanoh Kpassagnon DE/DT Villanova 6062 278 4.87 #92 Sr
Tanoh Kpassagnon DE Villanova 6062 278 4.87 #92 Sr

1) The biggest glaring issue is SLB IMO. Sick of this failing 3 safety look

Ryan Anderson OLB Alabama 6021 253 4.67 #22 rJr

This is the only defensive player I would target and go after in the draft so far. He has been atop my list for since the season started. Saints need a SLB that is the complete package. I think this is the player that would make the biggest impact on defense. Besides Jonathan Allen Leftover fav for last years draft. Besides I really do not see many SLB in this draft We are loaded with WLB/MLB.

2) Run stuffing, double team eating NT the has the ability to push the pocket. We have gap shooters at DT already. We need some beef to keep the LB clean and free up the other DL players to make plays. Day 2/day3 has a few

Dalvin Tomlinson DT Alabama 6022 305 5.14 #54 rSr
Ralph Green III DT Indiana 6036 320 5.14 #93 rSr

If you can get the light to turn on.
Jarron Jones DT Notre Dame 6051 315 5.14 #94 rSr

Somebody has been doing lots and lots of homework.

SmashMouth · 01-18-2017, 09:58 PM

Originally Posted by Danno

Yep, but it ain't just wisdom from Alabama, its just wisdom in general.

Keep in mind half my upbringing was in Baton Rouge and New Orleans, so I'm not just some bias Bama knucklehead who recently decided to follow the Saints. I've been on board from day 1.

But you are correct in that I believe if we don't significantly upgrade those 2 positions, we will suck again.

hagan714 · 01-18-2017, 10:11 PM

Originally Posted by triman

After the positions I mentioned in my early post here are some other areas I would like to see addressed. I am a big fan of the big uglies. Tackle to tackle is where football games are won IMHO. Big fast athletic guys are rare and when you can draft them it is wise. Adding a hostile mobile and agile DT would give the Saints a excellent rotation. OT is not a area of need but I could see a good OL player than could play both OG and RT would solidify a good OL.

could not agree more. From what i have seen and read there are more players in the draft listed as LT that will probably end up at RT or inside at OG at the next level. Issue is there are not many options that have experience at swinging from LT to RT. I think we learned a lesson with Peat. But...

There two that are a temptation but playing time is an issue or is it?
Ryan Ramczyk OT/OG Wisconsin 6052 314 5.29 #65 rJr
Garret Bolles OT/OG/DT Utah 6052 296 4.97 #75 Jr (24)

Some players on the inside have caught my eye due to the versatility they have shown in college. Catch phrase I like for these types are
He’s not elite physical talent but “extremely intelligent,” tough and strong.

Ethan Pocic C/OG/OT LSU 6056 309 5.18 Sr #77 Sr
Dion Dawkins LOG/LOT Temple 6045 320 5.27 #66
Avery Gennesy OT/OG Texas A&M 6045 305 5.08 #65
Taylor Moton ROT/ROG W. Michigan 6052 328 5.42 #72 rSr
Julie’n Davenport OG/OT Bucknell 6055 315 5.28 #70
Tyrell Crosby OT/OG Oregon 6045 310 5.29 #73 Jr
Forrest Lamp OG Western Kentucky 6032 300 5.12 #76 rSr
Sean Harlow, OG./OT/C, Oregon State 6041 310 5.17 #77 Sr

Originally Posted by triman

Something missing since we cut Sproles is a Satellite back. Two players stick out in this draft Dalvin Cook and Christian McCafferty. Either of these two would be tremendous additions to Paytons Offense

Yeah you know I like Christian also. Cook vs McCafferty does not come down to talent but which of the two is an addition without being a subtraction.

I see Cook eating into other RB carries and causing play calling issues. Are you ready to replace Ingram type of pick I have stayed away from in round 1. Except with Elliot. Cook is no Elliot IMO.

I see McCafferty as an accent piece on down 1 and 2 not cutting into the established rotation for the most part. He is an absolute upgrade on third down. Upgrade in the return game also. I have McCafferty listed as a freak. His type of skill set at RB WR and return man come around only so often. Most knock his one cut north south running style but it is because of this style he will be feared out of the back field, out wide, in the slot or returning kicks.

I feel comfortable with comparing him to a a larger version and more versatile version of Wes Welker

There are some interesting prospects in the mid rounds for sure. For so called Jack-of-all-trades players or a Swiss army knife weapon

if you can handle the baggage and believe a second chance is just, next on my list is
Joe Mixon, RB, Oklahoma 6011 226 4.50 #25 rSo

if not
Curtis Samuel RB/WR/KR Ohio State 5110 200 4.48 #4 Jr
Wayne Gallman RB Clemson 6002 215 4.52 #9 rJr
Justin Jackson RB Northwestern 5106 190 4.52 #21 Jr
Chris Carson RB Oklahoma State 6005 215 4.52 #32 Sr

Originally Posted by triman

Fleener has been a disappointment adding another quality TE would be helpful.

Want to scare the rest of the NFL and Fleener at the same time? take a page from the Pats handbook for saving an aging QB? The freak

O.J. Howard TE Alabama 6055 251 4.57 #88 Sr

Originally Posted by triman

QB is a position that needs to be addressed soon . I could see us picking one this year.

I really do not see much here to be honest they all need to ride the pine and learn. there is really one I would try to develop.

Davis Webb QB California 6032 227 4.86 #7 Sr

late round flyer? UDFA?
C.J. Beathard QB Iowa 6021 215 4.86 #16 rSr
Sefo Liufau QB Colorado 6032 230 4.76 #13 Sr
Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota 6031 230 4.95 #7

Originally Posted by triman

The draft is fluid affair and sometimes the picks don't follow a teams need Picking BPA is often the best long term choice. I hope that our FO will be brave and pick wisely.

Yep the best laid plans go crap real quick

I would love the saints to trade down and get

O.J. Howard TE Alabama 6055 251 4.57 #88 Sr

Then trade back up and add

*Christian McCaffrey RB/WR/KR Stanford 5115 205 4.48 Jr.

These two picks would send shivers down ever DC in the NFL.

Add size and speed to WR corp to streak down the field opening everything up without wasting anymore picks high in the draft. Much like Mechuem he would not be asked to run a complex route tree.

Jamari Staples, WR/KR Louisville 6026 195 4.45 #2 rSr

I like this kid because he is so RAW he is scary. Boom or bust? Boom sure. Bust? nah not asking much from him and he has the skill set to handle it. Vastly under rated with good hands. My favorite Louisville WR in the draft.

Now DC around the league will be throwing up.

Fleener
O.J. Howard TE Alabama 6055 251 4.57 #88 Sr
Ingram
*Christian McCaffrey RB/WR/KR Stanford 5115 205 4.48 Jr.
Cook
Willie Snead
Jamari Staples, WR/KR Louisville 6026 195 4.45 #2 rSr

hagan714 · 01-18-2017, 10:20 PM

Originally Posted by halloween 65

Somebody has been doing lots and lots of homework.

I love college football and live for the draft

it a sickness

K Major · 01-18-2017, 10:25 PM

Hagin,

What are your thoughts on Zach Cunningham (LB) - Vanderbilt? Good range? Coverage ability?

RockyMountainSaint · 01-18-2017, 10:42 PM

Originally Posted by Danno

Who You Got?

#51 and #57

If only...........

hagan714 · 01-18-2017, 10:43 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

Hagin,

What are your thoughts on Zach Cunningham (LB) - Vanderbilt? Good range? Coverage ability?

Zach Cunningham MLB/OLB Vanderbilt 6032 230 4.74 #41 rJr

I see all the traits people talk about and I agree he is gifted but.....there is always a but after I watch him. He looks to be a read and react LB to me and not as instinctive against the run as some say.Plus he just does not impress me with a hard nose LB attitude needed at MLB.

It maybe because Vandy's defense depended him so much he had no choice. Lets face it Vandy's defense did not do a great job of keeping him clean from second level blockers. That is my out for him. It is amazing what he did with the supporting cast he had.

Against the pass he has a solid floor with a high ceiling.

He is the type you really need to talk to and run through drills before picking him. Of all the players in round 1 he is a top my list as the player that needs the most double and triple checking. You will spend a lot money and time on him IMO.

If we picked him at 11 I would be

at first then I would sigh accept the pick and hold my breath till we see what we really got. IMO it would be a decent roll of the dice and bet he is better as a WLB than a MLB.

I have ranked Ryan Anderson OLB Alabama 6021 253 4.67 #22 rJr higher.

MarchingOn · 01-18-2017, 11:33 PM

Stop the run. Especially stop the runs up the middle.

Free Agent NT: lots of busts in the draft for NTs. Go FA for one proven to keep weight under control and demonstrated ability to absorb double teams.

Free Agent MLB: Go FA for proven ability to make the defensive calls that Anthony could not. And ability to tackle in the hole not just downfield.

01-18-2017, 10:11 PM	#34
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: Two positions Originally Posted by triman After the positions I mentioned in my early post here are some other areas I would like to see addressed. I am a big fan of the big uglies. Tackle to tackle is where football games are won IMHO. Big fast athletic guys are rare and when you can draft them it is wise. Adding a hostile mobile and agile DT would give the Saints a excellent rotation. OT is not a area of need but I could see a good OL player than could play both OG and RT would solidify a good OL. could not agree more. From what i have seen and read there are more players in the draft listed as LT that will probably end up at RT or inside at OG at the next level. Issue is there are not many options that have experience at swinging from LT to RT. I think we learned a lesson with Peat. But... There two that are a temptation but playing time is an issue or is it? Ryan Ramczyk OT/OG Wisconsin 6052 314 5.29 #65 rJr Garret Bolles OT/OG/DT Utah 6052 296 4.97 #75 Jr (24) Some players on the inside have caught my eye due to the versatility they have shown in college. Catch phrase I like for these types are He’s not elite physical talent but “extremely intelligent,” tough and strong. Ethan Pocic C/OG/OT LSU 6056 309 5.18 Sr #77 Sr Dion Dawkins LOG/LOT Temple 6045 320 5.27 #66 Avery Gennesy OT/OG Texas A&M 6045 305 5.08 #65 Taylor Moton ROT/ROG W. Michigan 6052 328 5.42 #72 rSr Julie’n Davenport OG/OT Bucknell 6055 315 5.28 #70 Tyrell Crosby OT/OG Oregon 6045 310 5.29 #73 Jr Forrest Lamp OG Western Kentucky 6032 300 5.12 #76 rSr Sean Harlow, OG./OT/C, Oregon State 6041 310 5.17 #77 Sr Originally Posted by triman Something missing since we cut Sproles is a Satellite back. Two players stick out in this draft Dalvin Cook and Christian McCafferty. Either of these two would be tremendous additions to Paytons Offense Yeah you know I like Christian also. Cook vs McCafferty does not come down to talent but which of the two is an addition without being a subtraction. I see Cook eating into other RB carries and causing play calling issues. Are you ready to replace Ingram type of pick I have stayed away from in round 1. Except with Elliot. Cook is no Elliot IMO. I see McCafferty as an accent piece on down 1 and 2 not cutting into the established rotation for the most part. He is an absolute upgrade on third down. Upgrade in the return game also. I have McCafferty listed as a freak. His type of skill set at RB WR and return man come around only so often. Most knock his one cut north south running style but it is because of this style he will be feared out of the back field, out wide, in the slot or returning kicks. I feel comfortable with comparing him to a a larger version and more versatile version of Wes Welker There are some interesting prospects in the mid rounds for sure. For so called Jack-of-all-trades players or a Swiss army knife weapon if you can handle the baggage and believe a second chance is just, next on my list is Joe Mixon, RB, Oklahoma 6011 226 4.50 #25 rSo if not Curtis Samuel RB/WR/KR Ohio State 5110 200 4.48 #4 Jr Wayne Gallman RB Clemson 6002 215 4.52 #9 rJr Justin Jackson RB Northwestern 5106 190 4.52 #21 Jr Chris Carson RB Oklahoma State 6005 215 4.52 #32 Sr Originally Posted by triman Fleener has been a disappointment adding another quality TE would be helpful. Want to scare the rest of the NFL and Fleener at the same time? take a page from the Pats handbook for saving an aging QB? The freak O.J. Howard TE Alabama 6055 251 4.57 #88 Sr Originally Posted by triman QB is a position that needs to be addressed soon . I could see us picking one this year. I really do not see much here to be honest they all need to ride the pine and learn. there is really one I would try to develop. Davis Webb QB California 6032 227 4.86 #7 Sr late round flyer? UDFA? C.J. Beathard QB Iowa 6021 215 4.86 #16 rSr Sefo Liufau QB Colorado 6032 230 4.76 #13 Sr Mitch Leidner, QB, Minnesota 6031 230 4.95 #7 Originally Posted by triman The draft is fluid affair and sometimes the picks don't follow a teams need Picking BPA is often the best long term choice. I hope that our FO will be brave and pick wisely. Yep the best laid plans go crap real quick I would love the saints to trade down and get O.J. Howard TE Alabama 6055 251 4.57 #88 Sr Then trade back up and add Christian McCaffrey RB/WR/KR Stanford 5115 205 4.48 Jr. These two picks would send shivers down ever DC in the NFL. Add size and speed to WR corp to streak down the field opening everything up without wasting anymore picks high in the draft. Much like Mechuem he would not be asked to run a complex route tree. Jamari Staples, WR/KR Louisville 6026 195 4.45 #2 rSr I like this kid because he is so RAW he is scary. Boom or bust? Boom sure. Bust? nah not asking much from him and he has the skill set to handle it. Vastly under rated with good hands. My favorite Louisville WR in the draft. Now DC around the league will be throwing up. Fleener O.J. Howard TE Alabama 6055 251 4.57 #88 Sr Ingram Christian McCaffrey RB/WR/KR Stanford 5115 205 4.48 Jr. Cook Willie Snead Jamari Staples, WR/KR Louisville 6026 195 4.45 #2 rSr
	"We may have lost the game, but you'll be hurting tomorrow." Doug Atkins Last edited by hagan714; 01-18-2017 at 10:23 PM..

01-18-2017, 10:20 PM	#35
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: Two positions Originally Posted by halloween 65 Somebody has been doing lots and lots of homework. I love college football and live for the draft it a sickness halloween 65 likes this.

01-18-2017, 10:25 PM	#36
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,589 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Two positions Hagin, What are your thoughts on Zach Cunningham (LB) - Vanderbilt? Good range? Coverage ability?

01-18-2017, 10:42 PM	#37
RockyMountainSaint Mmm That Smell! Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Metairie Terrace Posts: 3,073	Re: Two positions Originally Posted by Danno Who You Got? #51 and #57 If only...........

01-18-2017, 10:43 PM	#38
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: Two positions Originally Posted by K Major Hagin, What are your thoughts on Zach Cunningham (LB) - Vanderbilt? Good range? Coverage ability? Zach Cunningham MLB/OLB Vanderbilt 6032 230 4.74 #41 rJr I see all the traits people talk about and I agree he is gifted but.....there is always a but after I watch him. He looks to be a read and react LB to me and not as instinctive against the run as some say.Plus he just does not impress me with a hard nose LB attitude needed at MLB. It maybe because Vandy's defense depended him so much he had no choice. Lets face it Vandy's defense did not do a great job of keeping him clean from second level blockers. That is my out for him. It is amazing what he did with the supporting cast he had. Against the pass he has a solid floor with a high ceiling. He is the type you really need to talk to and run through drills before picking him. Of all the players in round 1 he is a top my list as the player that needs the most double and triple checking. You will spend a lot money and time on him IMO. If we picked him at 11 I would be at first then I would sigh accept the pick and hold my breath till we see what we really got. IMO it would be a decent roll of the dice and bet he is better as a WLB than a MLB. I have ranked Ryan Anderson OLB Alabama 6021 253 4.67 #22 rJr higher. K Major likes this.
	"We may have lost the game, but you'll be hurting tomorrow." Doug Atkins

01-18-2017, 07:34 PM	#31
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,713	Re: Two positions Originally Posted by ScottF Revisiting the OP, which I believe is Alabamanian for "if we don't upgrade these positions we will suck again. Yep, but it ain't just wisdom from Alabama, its just wisdom in general. Keep in mind half my upbringing was in Baton Rouge and New Orleans, so I'm not just some bias Bama knucklehead who recently decided to follow the Saints. I've been on board from day 1. But you are correct in that I believe if we don't significantly upgrade those 2 positions, we will suck again.

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01-18-2017, 09:17 PM	#32
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: Two positions Originally Posted by hagan714 Glaring issue Zach Strief Age: 33 Jahri Evans Age: 33 Solution Kevin Zeitler RG Cincinnati Bengals 26 Rick Wagner RT Baltimore Ravens 26 Keeping Zach and Jahri in an active rotation works for me. The OL would be the deepest and most talented we have had in years. maybe ever. Huge issue and you have to take into account the saints have gotten shorter at CB will the receivers in our division and around the NFL are getting taller. Lost way to many jump balls for touchdowns. Plenty of opportunity to address the issue with solid prospects through out the draft. This is a great draft to add talent and height. Heck if the saints added 3 of these CB/FS types in this draft I could accept it. Marlon Humphrey CB/FS Alabama 6005 196 4.49 #26 rSo Quincy Wilson CB/FS Florida 6012 211 4.54 #6 Jr Cordrea Tankersley CB/FS Clemson 6002 195 4.48 #25 Sr Marshon Lattimore CB Ohio State 6000 195 4.47 #2 rSo Brandon Facyson CB Virginia Tech 6011 191 4.52 #31 Jr Kevin King CB/FS Washington 6032 192 4.56 #20 Sr Rasul Douglas, CB West Virginia 6012 208 4.46 #13 rSr Channing Stribling CB Michigan 6011 176 4.52 #8 Sr Treston Decoud CB/FS Oregon State 6020 4.54 208 #14 Sr Ahkello Witherspoon CB/FS Colorado 6021 195 4.59 #23 rSr Jeremy Cutrer CB/FS Middle Tennesse 6011 170 4.49 #8 Sr SDE there are some good options in the draft to upgrade this position. Derek Barnett SDE Tennessee 6025 265 4.65 #9 Jr Daeshon Hall, DE, Texas A&M 6052 260 4.78 #10 Sr Solomon Thomas SDE Stanford 6021 275 4.84 #90 rSo Taco Charlton DE Michigan 6052 272 4.87 #33 Sr, Da’Shawn Hand DE/DT Alabama 6035 280 4.74 #9 Jr Bryan Cox DE Florida 6031 260 4.77 #94 rSr Trey Hendrickson DE Florida Atlantic 6036 270 4.82 #9 Sr Tanoh Kpassagnon DE/DT Villanova 6062 278 4.87 #92 Sr Tanoh Kpassagnon DE Villanova 6062 278 4.87 #92 Sr 1) The biggest glaring issue is SLB IMO. Sick of this failing 3 safety look Ryan Anderson OLB Alabama 6021 253 4.67 #22 rJr This is the only defensive player I would target and go after in the draft so far. He has been atop my list for since the season started. Saints need a SLB that is the complete package. I think this is the player that would make the biggest impact on defense. Besides Jonathan Allen Leftover fav for last years draft. Besides I really do not see many SLB in this draft We are loaded with WLB/MLB. 2) Run stuffing, double team eating NT the has the ability to push the pocket. We have gap shooters at DT already. We need some beef to keep the LB clean and free up the other DL players to make plays. Day 2/day3 has a few Dalvin Tomlinson DT Alabama 6022 305 5.14 #54 rSr Ralph Green III DT Indiana 6036 320 5.14 #93 rSr If you can get the light to turn on. Jarron Jones DT Notre Dame 6051 315 5.14 #94 rSr Somebody has been doing lots and lots of homework.

01-18-2017, 09:58 PM	#33
SmashMouth I donated, did you? Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Mandeville, LA Posts: 38,044 Blog Entries: 29	Re: Two positions Originally Posted by Danno Yep, but it ain't just wisdom from Alabama, its just wisdom in general. Keep in mind half my upbringing was in Baton Rouge and New Orleans, so I'm not just some bias Bama knucklehead who recently decided to follow the Saints. I've been on board from day 1. But you are correct in that I believe if we don't significantly upgrade those 2 positions, we will suck again. K Major likes this.

01-18-2017, 11:33 PM	#39
MarchingOn 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 387 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Two positions Stop the run. Especially stop the runs up the middle. Free Agent NT: lots of busts in the draft for NTs. Go FA for one proven to keep weight under control and demonstrated ability to absorb double teams. Free Agent MLB: Go FA for proven ability to make the defensive calls that Anthony could not. And ability to tackle in the hole not just downfield.

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