49ers are scary good

Lord_Saint83 · 01-11-2020, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by dizzle88

I mean, it was Marcus Williams, the only consistency he shows is consistently out of position.

But yeah agreed about DA, he is Paytons "Yes Man" - that's why you dont see Payton going ballistic at him like he did with Ryan and Gregg.

The game we played was lost before it even began because of the lackluster gameplan the coaches put out there.

Unfortunately you’re right about Allen. He is the last of the old cronies left but for some reason Sean keeps him around like a stray cat that wanders onto your porch and you fell sorry for him so you feed him but now he won’t go away.

CHA_CHING · 01-11-2020, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by Lord_Saint83

Unfortunately you’re right about Allen. He is the last of the old cronies left but for some reason Sean keeps him around like a stray cat that wanders onto your porch and you fell sorry for him so you feed him but now he won’t go away.

If Payton could, he'd probably bring back Gregg Williams and most of this fan base would be happy with that. GW gets way too much credit for our SB win. They were a middle of the pact defense (didn't rank better than 21 in ANY statistical category) outside of getting a bunch of turnovers. We had a top 3 ranked offense and were in the top 5 all year on rushing. Our offense don't really get the praise it deserved for 2009. They were neck to neck with the Colts all year long.

When the turnovers didn't happen though with Williams, those teams always struggled.

I would STILL love to have Wade Phillips come in as DC. I know that is controversial opinion for some reason with fans, but I like Wade and think he could work wonders with the talent we have.

I fear we're going to be in for a rude awakening next year with Nolan gone. He is mainly to thank for why we've had great LB coverage play and a pass rush the last 3 seasons. Our defense immediately turned a corner when he came in.

dizzle88 · 01-11-2020, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by CHA_CHING

If Payton could, he'd probably bring back Gregg Williams and most of this fan base would be happy with that. GW gets way too much credit for our SB win. They were a middle of the pact defense (didn't rank better than 21 in ANY statistical category) outside of getting a bunch of turnovers.

When the turnovers didn't happen though with Williams, those teams always struggled.

I would STILL love to have Wade Phillips come in as DC. I know that is controversial opinion for some reason with fans, but I like Wade and think he could work wonders with the talent we have.

I fear we're going to be in for a rude awakening next year with Nolan gone. He is mainly to thank for why we've had great LB coverage play and a pass rush the last 3 seasons. Our defense immediately turned a corner when he came in.

Just like to add a point - in 2009 when the turnovers started to wane, the defense struggled.

In 2010, GW built the 9th ranked defense in the league, with Jo-Lonn Dunbar as our middle linebacker.

They just went back to sucking the next year.

CHA_CHING · 01-11-2020, 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by dizzle88

Just like to add a point - in 2009 when the turnovers started to wane, the defense struggled.

In 2010, GW built the 9th ranked defense in the league, with Jo-Lonn Dunbar as our middle linebacker.

They just went back to sucking the next year.

Wish I could link your post many times. I posted this very thing back in 2018 on the other Saints forum and people got really upset with me.

It's true though. The defense did begin struggling when the turnovers waned. The guys over at Black and Gold Review blogs, even did an entire blog about it years ago, showcasing that the 2009 defense really wasn't all that great.

Most of their turnovers were also built on playing crappy QBs. The first 10 weeks of the season, they played mostly mediocre at best QBs (Eli Manning, Mark Sanchez, Chad Henne, Kevin Kolb).

I also like to remind people cause it's forgotten now - KEVIN KOLB became a household name for his performance against our defense. He threw for 399 yards, 3 TDs and 3 INTs in that game. Kolb was hyped up to be the successor in Philly, then even got paid in Arizona before it became obvious that his one big game was fool's gold.

From weeks 1 to 11, the Saints averaged 2.5 to 3 turnovers a game in 2009. After week 11 though, the turnovers just completely stopped for the most part and they struggled.

We most likely lose to Minnesota in the NFCCG if they don't keep turning the ball over. They were practically handing the ball out to us with those 5 turnovers. But we struggled all through that game. 4 of their turnovers came on drives that were in our territory including Favre's last pick. We really did struggle that entire game, as our offense really couldn't get much together. Even with all those turnovers we needed OT to barely get past that team.

The 2010 defense ranked higher in stats but the turnovers were gone and I don't know what the hell happened in the playoffs where they just collapsed to the floor.

True too about 2011. It's why I didn't believe in that team. Everyone acts like they were some robbed SB contender, but that defense was god awful. In the wildcard game vs Detroit, they gave up 28 points and Payton didn't trust them in the end to the point he went for it on 4th down twice and ran the score up to put the game out of reach.

dskyyksd · 01-11-2020, 07:00 PM

I blew a fuse when the &%$#@! Seahawks died at the one inch line against the 49ers two weeks ago, forcing the 13-3 Saints to play another damn wildcard game against the &%$#@*! Vikings. I KNEW it would screw the Saints again somehow. Nice teamwork! I hate those two teams more than any other. All they know how to do is get in the Saints' way and roll over and play dead for somebody else!

Sainters7 · 01-11-2020, 07:56 PM

Originally Posted by dskyyksd

I blew a fuse when the &%$#@! Seahawks died at the one inch line against the 49ers two weeks ago, forcing the 13-3 Saints to play another damn wildcard game against the &%$#@*! Vikings. I KNEW it would screw the Saints again somehow. Nice teamwork! I hate those two teams more than any other. All they know how to do is get in the Saints' way and roll over and play dead for somebody else!

And the Lions teasing an upset on the Packers before inevitably choking late, looked like we'd at least get a bye.. that was a frustrating day.

Yeah I knew that #3 seed F'd our playoffs too, figured we'd beat Vikings but didn't see getting through both of @GB and @SF. I'm still steamed 13-3 equaled a Wild Card, how do we always lose tiebreakers

Lord_Saint83 · 01-11-2020, 06:42 PM

Originally Posted by CHA_CHING

If Payton could, he'd probably bring back Gregg Williams and most of this fan base would be happy with that. GW gets way too much credit for our SB win. They were a middle of the pact defense (didn't rank better than 21 in ANY statistical category) outside of getting a bunch of turnovers. We had a top 3 ranked offense and were in the top 5 all year on rushing. Our offense don't really get the praise it deserved for 2009. They were neck to neck with the Colts all year long.

When the turnovers didn't happen though with Williams, those teams always struggled.

I would STILL love to have Wade Phillips come in as DC. I know that is controversial opinion for some reason with fans, but I like Wade and think he could work wonders with the talent we have.

I fear we're going to be in for a rude awakening next year with Nolan gone. He is mainly to thank for why we've had great LB coverage play and a pass rush the last 3 seasons. Our defense immediately turned a corner when he came in.

I think what people don't want anything to do with Wade is the personnel changes that will have and need to be made. Some guys won't fit and some pieces will need to be added with little cap.

CHA_CHING · 01-11-2020, 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by Lord_Saint83

I think what people don't want anything to do with Wade is the personnel changes that will have and need to be made. Some guys won't fit and some pieces will need to be added with little cap.

That's a fair point on personnel changes and a good retort.

The retort I usually get though is "his L.A. defenses were terrible!". I understand that Wade was a bit of a disappointment not turning the Rams defense into a shut down unit, but I also don't think he did any worse than Allen has with us.

But I can see your point on personnel changes and it's a good one to consider.

Lord_Saint83 · 01-11-2020, 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by CHA_CHING

That's a fair point on personnel changes and a good retort.

The retort I usually get though is "his L.A. defenses were terrible!". I understand that Wade was a bit of a disappointment not turning the Rams defense into a shut down unit, but I also don't think he did any worse than Allen has with us.

But I can see your point on personnel changes and it's a good one to consider.

True and to me pound for pound, i think Allen had more players on our d that are better than their LA counterpart at that position or will be better than Wade did in LA. But his coaching is something that will hold those guys back. Its just that we have really good positional coaches. Nolan leaving will hurt.

01-11-2020, 06:24 PM	#1
Lord_Saint83 100% Blunt Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Saint Gabriel, La Posts: 2,754	Re: 49ers are scary good Originally Posted by dizzle88 I mean, it was Marcus Williams, the only consistency he shows is consistently out of position. But yeah agreed about DA, he is Paytons "Yes Man" - that's why you dont see Payton going ballistic at him like he did with Ryan and Gregg. The game we played was lost before it even began because of the lackluster gameplan the coaches put out there. Unfortunately you’re right about Allen. He is the last of the old cronies left but for some reason Sean keeps him around like a stray cat that wanders onto your porch and you fell sorry for him so you feed him but now he won’t go away. dizzle88 and CHA_CHING like this.

01-11-2020, 06:31 PM	#2
CHA_CHING 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Mobile, AL Posts: 1,159	Re: 49ers are scary good Originally Posted by Lord_Saint83 Unfortunately you’re right about Allen. He is the last of the old cronies left but for some reason Sean keeps him around like a stray cat that wanders onto your porch and you fell sorry for him so you feed him but now he won’t go away. If Payton could, he'd probably bring back Gregg Williams and most of this fan base would be happy with that. GW gets way too much credit for our SB win. They were a middle of the pact defense (didn't rank better than 21 in ANY statistical category) outside of getting a bunch of turnovers. We had a top 3 ranked offense and were in the top 5 all year on rushing. Our offense don't really get the praise it deserved for 2009. They were neck to neck with the Colts all year long. When the turnovers didn't happen though with Williams, those teams always struggled. I would STILL love to have Wade Phillips come in as DC. I know that is controversial opinion for some reason with fans, but I like Wade and think he could work wonders with the talent we have. I fear we're going to be in for a rude awakening next year with Nolan gone. He is mainly to thank for why we've had great LB coverage play and a pass rush the last 3 seasons. Our defense immediately turned a corner when he came in.

01-11-2020, 06:44 PM	#4
CHA_CHING 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Mobile, AL Posts: 1,159	Re: 49ers are scary good Originally Posted by dizzle88 Just like to add a point - in 2009 when the turnovers started to wane, the defense struggled. In 2010, GW built the 9th ranked defense in the league, with Jo-Lonn Dunbar as our middle linebacker. They just went back to sucking the next year. Wish I could link your post many times. I posted this very thing back in 2018 on the other Saints forum and people got really upset with me. It's true though. The defense did begin struggling when the turnovers waned. The guys over at Black and Gold Review blogs, even did an entire blog about it years ago, showcasing that the 2009 defense really wasn't all that great. Most of their turnovers were also built on playing crappy QBs. The first 10 weeks of the season, they played mostly mediocre at best QBs (Eli Manning, Mark Sanchez, Chad Henne, Kevin Kolb). I also like to remind people cause it's forgotten now - KEVIN KOLB became a household name for his performance against our defense. He threw for 399 yards, 3 TDs and 3 INTs in that game. Kolb was hyped up to be the successor in Philly, then even got paid in Arizona before it became obvious that his one big game was fool's gold. From weeks 1 to 11, the Saints averaged 2.5 to 3 turnovers a game in 2009. After week 11 though, the turnovers just completely stopped for the most part and they struggled. We most likely lose to Minnesota in the NFCCG if they don't keep turning the ball over. They were practically handing the ball out to us with those 5 turnovers. But we struggled all through that game. 4 of their turnovers came on drives that were in our territory including Favre's last pick. We really did struggle that entire game, as our offense really couldn't get much together. Even with all those turnovers we needed OT to barely get past that team. The 2010 defense ranked higher in stats but the turnovers were gone and I don't know what the hell happened in the playoffs where they just collapsed to the floor. True too about 2011. It's why I didn't believe in that team. Everyone acts like they were some robbed SB contender, but that defense was god awful. In the wildcard game vs Detroit, they gave up 28 points and Payton didn't trust them in the end to the point he went for it on 4th down twice and ran the score up to put the game out of reach.

01-11-2020, 07:00 PM	#5
dskyyksd Registered Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 73	Re: 49ers are scary good I blew a fuse when the &%$#@! Seahawks died at the one inch line against the 49ers two weeks ago, forcing the 13-3 Saints to play another damn wildcard game against the &%$#@*! Vikings. I KNEW it would screw the Saints again somehow. Nice teamwork! I hate those two teams more than any other. All they know how to do is get in the Saints' way and roll over and play dead for somebody else! Sainters7 likes this.
dskyyksd Registered Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 73

01-11-2020, 07:56 PM	#6
Sainters7 Registered Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 48	Re: 49ers are scary good Originally Posted by dskyyksd I blew a fuse when the &%$#@! Seahawks died at the one inch line against the 49ers two weeks ago, forcing the 13-3 Saints to play another damn wildcard game against the &%$#@*! Vikings. I KNEW it would screw the Saints again somehow. Nice teamwork! I hate those two teams more than any other. All they know how to do is get in the Saints' way and roll over and play dead for somebody else! And the Lions teasing an upset on the Packers before inevitably choking late, looked like we'd at least get a bye.. that was a frustrating day. Yeah I knew that #3 seed F'd our playoffs too, figured we'd beat Vikings but didn't see getting through both of @GB and @SF. I'm still steamed 13-3 equaled a Wild Card, how do we always lose tiebreakers
Sainters7 Registered Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 48

01-11-2020, 06:33 PM	#3
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,518	Re: 49ers are scary good Originally Posted by CHA_CHING If Payton could, he'd probably bring back Gregg Williams and most of this fan base would be happy with that. GW gets way too much credit for our SB win. They were a middle of the pact defense (didn't rank better than 21 in ANY statistical category) outside of getting a bunch of turnovers. When the turnovers didn't happen though with Williams, those teams always struggled. I would STILL love to have Wade Phillips come in as DC. I know that is controversial opinion for some reason with fans, but I like Wade and think he could work wonders with the talent we have. I fear we're going to be in for a rude awakening next year with Nolan gone. He is mainly to thank for why we've had great LB coverage play and a pass rush the last 3 seasons. Our defense immediately turned a corner when he came in. Just like to add a point - in 2009 when the turnovers started to wane, the defense struggled. In 2010, GW built the 9th ranked defense in the league, with Jo-Lonn Dunbar as our middle linebacker. They just went back to sucking the next year. CHA_CHING likes this.

01-11-2020, 06:42 PM	#7
Lord_Saint83 100% Blunt Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Saint Gabriel, La Posts: 2,754	Re: 49ers are scary good Originally Posted by CHA_CHING If Payton could, he'd probably bring back Gregg Williams and most of this fan base would be happy with that. GW gets way too much credit for our SB win. They were a middle of the pact defense (didn't rank better than 21 in ANY statistical category) outside of getting a bunch of turnovers. We had a top 3 ranked offense and were in the top 5 all year on rushing. Our offense don't really get the praise it deserved for 2009. They were neck to neck with the Colts all year long. When the turnovers didn't happen though with Williams, those teams always struggled. I would STILL love to have Wade Phillips come in as DC. I know that is controversial opinion for some reason with fans, but I like Wade and think he could work wonders with the talent we have. I fear we're going to be in for a rude awakening next year with Nolan gone. He is mainly to thank for why we've had great LB coverage play and a pass rush the last 3 seasons. Our defense immediately turned a corner when he came in. I think what people don't want anything to do with Wade is the personnel changes that will have and need to be made. Some guys won't fit and some pieces will need to be added with little cap.

01-11-2020, 06:48 PM	#8
CHA_CHING 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Mobile, AL Posts: 1,159	Re: 49ers are scary good Originally Posted by Lord_Saint83 I think what people don't want anything to do with Wade is the personnel changes that will have and need to be made. Some guys won't fit and some pieces will need to be added with little cap. That's a fair point on personnel changes and a good retort. The retort I usually get though is "his L.A. defenses were terrible!". I understand that Wade was a bit of a disappointment not turning the Rams defense into a shut down unit, but I also don't think he did any worse than Allen has with us. But I can see your point on personnel changes and it's a good one to consider. Lord_Saint83 likes this.