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This may sound odd..

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; No way I want to ever see CGM not in a game. He’s the only WR that consistently gets open and he’s just a straight up beast on the field. 11/11 is just sick...

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Old 12-18-2019, 08:10 AM   #11
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Re: This may sound odd..

No way I want to ever see CGM not in a game. He’s the only WR that consistently gets open and he’s just a straight up beast on the field. 11/11 is just sick
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Old 12-18-2019, 08:24 AM   #12
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Re: This may sound odd..

Originally Posted by RaginCajun83 View Post
They say that every year with some position group in the draft
Hence ... "take it with a grain of salt".
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Old 12-18-2019, 10:31 AM   #13
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Re: This may sound odd..

WHAT HAPPENED TO ALL THE:

"WHY WAS (PICK A STARTER, ANY STARTER) IN THE GAME WHEN "WE" WERE UP BY 24????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!

"YOU ARE WHAT YOUR RECORD SAYS YOU ARE"
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Old 12-18-2019, 11:09 AM   #14
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Re: This may sound odd..

How about we just draft another good receiver who can get open? That would take a lot of pressure off of Michael Thomas.
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Old 12-18-2019, 02:49 PM   #15
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Re: This may sound odd..

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido View Post
Sorry, but I think you are WAY off course. Brees has always passed the ball to the open receiver. And "open" is a relative term. Thomas needs less separation than other receivers to be deemed "open". That's why he sees the ball more often. Taking Thomas away would not make the others anymore open. On the contrary, without Thomas garnering the attention the others would be more closely covered.

This isn't a Brees issue. It is an issue with the other receivers getting enough separation. Cook has been getting that separation recently, as has both Hills.
You made my point for me though. Brees will throw to Thomas with a small amount of separation. He won't do that with other guys. While this has a lot to do with the fact that Michael Thomas is reliable and catches pretty much everything thrown to him... I do think he has trust issues with receivers not named Michael Thomas. I don't want to ever see MT out in a game that is competitive. If we ever play the Dolphins or something, it'd be nice to see Brees get some work with other receivers. I'm not sure I believe that the only reason Cook is getting more passes now is because he's getting more separation. I think it has a lot to do with Brees and Cook being more on the same page and a sense of trust being established. A lot of Brees throws are based on thinking and being on the same page as his WR. He'll throw the WR open or throw the WR into YAC. Brees is very meticulous, and when it comes to his receivers he can be a bit OCD. He's not the only QB like that. For example last year, Weinz threw to Tate and Ertz. Foles liked to throw to Alshon Jeffery. I highly doubt that these receivers were getting separation differently for the different QBs. What it came down to was trust and the QB being able to be inside the WRs head. When such a high percentage of passes go to MT, developing that rapport with the other receivers can be slow. Just having one game where Brees is forced to go to someone outside of that comfort zone could help.
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Old 12-18-2019, 03:07 PM   #16
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Re: This may sound odd..

Tough topic, but the reality is guys have gotten balls tossed their way and have not come through. This is by far the worst group of WR we have had since Brees and Payton. Our 2nd best WR might actually be a QB, that's how awful they are. We will need to heavily target Hill and Harris in the playoffs to take some heat off of Thomas and perhaps someone can wake up Kamara.
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Old 12-18-2019, 03:15 PM   #17
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Re: This may sound odd..

Originally Posted by vpheughan View Post
Here's something really odd!!!! 5! That's odd!!
Really!? 5? Is that the best you can do!? Surely you mean 43!...5 indeed!
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Old 12-18-2019, 03:22 PM   #18
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Re: This may sound odd..

Originally Posted by hitta View Post
You made my point for me though. Brees will throw to Thomas will a small amount of separation. He won't do that with other guys. While this has a lot to do with the fact that Michael Thomas is reliable and catches pretty much everything thrown to him... I do think he has trust issues with receivers not named Michael Thomas. I don't want to ever see MT out in a game that is competitive. If we ever play the Dolphins or something, it'd be nice to see Brees get some work with other receivers. I'm not sure I believe that the only reason Cook is getting more passes now is because he's getting more separation. I think it has a lot to do with Brees and Cook being more on the same page and a sense of trust being established. A lot of Brees throws are based on thinking and being on the same page as his WR. He'll throw the WR open or throw the WR into YAC. Brees is very meticulous, and when it comes to his receivers he can be a bit OCD. He's not the only QB like that. For example last year, Weinz threw to Tate and Ertz. Foles liked to throw to Alshon Jeffery. I highly doubt that these receivers were getting separation differently for the different QBs. What it came down to was trust and the QB being able to be inside the WRs head. When such a high percentage of passes go to MT, developing that rapport with the other receivers can be slow. Just having one game where Brees is forced to go to someone outside of that comfort zone could help.
He has thrown hundreds of passes to all of them throughout the season, in game and in practice. The idea that taking away Thomas will force Brees to throw to the others, thus immediately improving their chemistry is a bit ridiculous. As I said, Brees will ALWAYS throw to the best option (ie. the most open). Taking away Thomas will NOT make the others anymore open, once again, quite the opposite. They will all be getting a step up in coverage with Thomas out. The WR game will become less involved with Brees having to check down to the RB's all that more often.

I feel you are greatly underestimating Brees. And as the Foles/Jeffery comparison goes, in the five games with Foles as QB Jeffery was targeted 32 times for an average of 6.4 times per game. With Wentz he was targeted 50 times in eight games for a very similar 6.25 times per game. He was getting open at the same rate for both QB's. The same goes for Thomas. He was targeted equally by both Bridgewater and Brees as compared to the other WR's. It was because he was getting open more consistently and had nothing to do with some supposed familiarity with the others.

I repeat, the discrepancy between the total receptions by Thomas as compared to the other receivers has very little, if anything, to do with Brees and virtually everything to do with the success of those other receivers in getting as open as Thomas. Taking Thomas away isn't going to magically make them better.

To be fair, both Tre'quan and Cook have dealt with injuries at times throughout the season. Ginn, on the other hand, has no excuse. Still, they have all been getting open more often recently, but with Thomas open as well who would you throw the ball to? The greatest receiver ever in Saints history maybe?

Edit: By the way, Foles threw to Ertz exactly nine times per game ... Wentz 10.09 times per game. Pretty much the same, as well.

17-2 Baby!
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Old 12-18-2019, 03:25 PM   #19
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Re: This may sound odd..

This thread is odd.
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Old 12-18-2019, 04:38 PM   #20
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Re: This may sound odd..

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido View Post
He has thrown hundreds of passes to all of them throughout the season, in game and in practice. The idea that taking away Thomas will force Brees to throw to the others, thus immediately improving their chemistry is a bit ridiculous. As I said, Brees will ALWAYS throw to the best option (ie. the most open). Taking away Thomas will NOT make the others anymore open, once again, quite the opposite. They will all be getting a step up in coverage with Thomas out. The WR game will become less involved with Brees having to check down to the RB's all that more often.

I feel you are greatly underestimating Brees. And as the Foles/Jeffery comparison goes, in the five games with Foles as QB Jeffery was targeted 32 times for an average of 6.4 times per game. With Wentz he was targeted 50 times in eight games for a very similar 6.25 times per game. He was getting open at the same rate for both QB's. The same goes for Thomas. He was targeted equally by both Bridgewater and Brees as compared to the other WR's. It was because he was getting open more consistently and had nothing to do with some supposed familiarity with the others.

I repeat, the discrepancy between the total receptions by Thomas as compared to the other receivers has very little, if anything, to do with Brees and virtually everything to do with the success of those other receivers in getting as open as Thomas. Taking Thomas away isn't going to magically make them better.

To be fair, both Tre'quan and Cook have dealt with injuries at times throughout the season. Ginn, on the other hand, has no excuse. Still, they have all been getting open more often recently, but with Thomas open as well who would you throw the ball to? The greatest receiver ever in Saints history maybe?

Edit: By the way, Foles threw to Ertz exactly nine times per game ... Wentz 10.09 times per game. Pretty much the same, as well.
https://www.phlsportsnation.com/2019...tz-connection/

Especially pay attention to the portion about contested throws.
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