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Sanity Zone 10-2-2013 Shut Down and Loving it.

Rating: 2 votes, 3.50 average.
Posted 10-02-2013 at 09:54 AM by xan

Sorry for not posting anything for a while. I'd offer half-hearted excuses, but it's only because there's been nothing inspiring to talk about. But joy is back!

As a college professor, I like to use examples of catastrophically bad decision-making as teaching tools. Examining the process and the reasons for failure teach us a great deal about how the world works, and how to identify when we might be in a similar situation. There is a side effect of also being very funny. It's easier to learn when there is some aspect of humor.

I have been hoping against hope that we would get to the point where there would be a shut down of the Federal Government. One can't imagine how much fun this is. I understand that for the tens of millions of Americans who will be impacted and possibly wiped out by this that it might seem that I'm callous to their suffering. But taken from the vantage that this is one of the very few immensely large scale teaching moments in nearly 6 decades, the potential for stripping away the rhetoric and deliberate misinformation about governments, markets and justice may have a greater impact on the US and possibly the world than the short term losses that may need to be endured.

We arrived at this point because of spectacularly bad judgment by many parties and over 3 decades. The confluence of anarchists, racists, class-warfare artists, corrupt politicians, and criminally acting business leaders generated this wonderful and exciting stew (I wouldn't denigrate gumbo by terming it such). I thought it would happen in 2010, but for some reason (like refusing to rip the band-aid off) we got it now. But, OH, how exquisite the torture of delay has been. The forces are now naked, the motives and machinations clear.

We are likely to only have two potential outcomes, but few things will be the same from here. Either we will become a republic much like Somalia is a republic, or we will gravitate to a Swedish/Nordic model. The polarization is too great and the dynamic has broken what little was left of the old equilibrium. Equity will win, or money will vanquish.

Regardless of the outcome, I am counting myself lucky to like in a time where I've got a private box with a valet to view the entire passion play and savor the details.

Because, this is either the Fall of Rome, or the Renaissance. How wonderful is life!!!
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  1. Old Comment
    SmashMouth's Avatar
    Well said ....

    Posted 10-02-2013 at 12:34 PM by SmashMouth SmashMouth is offline

  2. Old Comment
    Halo's Avatar
    So very true
    Posted 10-02-2013 at 08:04 PM by Halo Halo is offline
  3. Old Comment
    TheOak's Avatar
    As long as popularity and electability are the focus of our officials, public opinion will polarize parties and grind this country to a halt.... After all is said and done, this country is divided between two fundamental personality types and their polar opposite nature is not something that can be swayed easily... Its hard wiring and those that are possibly in the middle have no chance as their numbers are too small.

    If you want to see a Government's or a persons true nature, ban climate surveys (polls) and force them to act on their own volition. Completely remove their ability to demonize their opponents voices and let their decisions and actions stand on their own merit.

    The only reason conservatives and liberals go at each other is because like Pavlov's dog they have been conditioned to do so. Many a great friendship has not survived the knowledge of knowing the others political stance.
    Posted 10-03-2013 at 12:30 PM by TheOak TheOak is offline
  4. Old Comment
    homerj07's Avatar
    The Republic is dead.

    Long live the Corpocracy.
    Posted 10-03-2013 at 07:36 PM by homerj07 homerj07 is offline
  5. Old Comment
    It certainly is not a renaissance. I would love it to be so, but I'm not that naive. America's only hope is to avoid total collapse, as I don't think it will ever be near the same.

    My opinion really has nothing to do with this shutdown, though. This has been my thought process for at least the last four years. Our government has proven for a very long time that they are all about themselves, so why should we be surprised by this latest development? I know I'm not.
    Posted 10-03-2013 at 07:37 PM by burningmetal burningmetal is offline
  6. Old Comment
    WHODATINCA's Avatar
    You sound like a Nero. As bad as things have been -- I assume this last is fuel for yet more apathy. But, I will agree it is probably only the anger and passion of youth that can save us now.
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 04:59 AM by WHODATINCA WHODATINCA is offline
  7. Old Comment
    TheOak's Avatar
    The anger, passion, and ignorance of youth has never corrected the course of a ship.

    Watch Pelosi talk, she is nothing but anger and passion. An emotional vessel void of logic.
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 05:11 AM by TheOak TheOak is offline
  8. Old Comment
    WHODATINCA's Avatar
    So....you think that the peace movement ( largely lead by the young ) of the 60s had no effect on the course of the Vietnam War? And, you think the anger and passion, of not just the youth, but of all men and women of conscience had no effect on civil rights in the 60s? Without anger, passion and a stirring of conscience for abolition, I'm pretty sure slavery would still be with us.

    And, btw, Nanci Pelosi isn't young. Nor do I see her as emotional or illogical. Who I do find illogical is the Republican Party right now.

    Let's see ....they don't like a law that was legitimately passed by both houses AND ruled constitutional by the Supreme Court ( incidentally, BY the most right-wing court we have seen in generations ) and the Republican Tea Party extremists seem to want to shutdown our government over it. That, Mr. Oak, is not just illogical, it is anarchistic.

    And, the fact that these jerks continue to pay themselves, for a job they are not doing, show them to be exactly as you describe: emotional vessels void of logic --- but full of a callous disregard for the laws they are sworn to uphold.

    And, if that scowl your icon wears is indicative of your demeanor, then I recommend you turn some of that anger, and passionate disdain toward the men and women who obviously sit your side of the aisle.

    Go ahead, make my day.
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 01:52 PM by WHODATINCA WHODATINCA is offline
  9. Old Comment
    TheOak's Avatar
    Precisely the myopic response I expected. Dig deeper and you will see that your ignorance of and disdain for Republicans is very much akin to the racism you made note of. Slavery is still here, it has just taken on a different face. The government enslaves now. As far as for your view of Pelosi, if you had the capacity to see her for what she is you would surely recognize that hippies didn't end Vietnam. However if you want to try to navigate that waterway the hippies were also against Government telling them what to do and how to live.... Sounds more like conservatism than liberalism.

    Ever listen to the song "Signs" by Five Man Electrical Band? That is our present administration telling everyone how to live and what they can't do.

    SCOTUS ruled Obamacare is a tax, that is a huge contrast to what the POTUS says it is and is not.

    PS I am neither Republican nor do I live in a world where an avatar had a specific meaning. You are novel but not quite humorous.
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 02:25 PM by TheOak TheOak is offline
  10. Old Comment
    WHODATINCA's Avatar
    >The government enslaves now.

    This is the underlying issue. This is how you see it. But, dig deeper.

    Our constitution envisioned a government "BY THE PEOPLE". So, if this is true, and the people are enslaved, then it is ourselves who enslave us. The question really is who controls the government? Is it the people?

    I think I know the answer. Do you?

    And, it really doesn't matter what the POTUS SAYS about the law. What matters is what the laws says about the law. Which, in fact, is the whole point here. We have some laws. And, our representatives are sworn to uphold the laws, for better or worse, until they are legally challenged and legally changed.

    Otherwise, we really don't need a government -- we can just return to warring fiefdoms. Which I happen to think is the agenda of the Libertarian anarchists. Anything I want goes, as long as I have a gun.

    BTW, I agree with you -- hippies were not liberals.
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 03:18 PM by WHODATINCA WHODATINCA is offline
  11. Old Comment
    TheOak's Avatar
    I see your point now. In the absence of complete control all that is left is anarchy. Who might your governmental appointed custodian be? Surely you can't be left to monitor your own vices can you? Without supervision and direction you would be Genghis Khan reincarnate before kickoff on Sunday.

    You however sir come from a land where black is evil and dangerous unless it is in human form and then it is repressed.

    I surely do know the answer, it's called the media. Release a poll that shows voters respond positively to the color green more than any other and count the number of green ties on politicians the following week.

    Your but a victim of the same media. You and I have different points of view; you see a way to gain a heart, a golden road....

    I see the Oz behind the curtain.... And his name is not Barack Obama. Obama is the Oz you are meant to see.
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 04:10 PM by TheOak TheOak is offline
  12. Old Comment
    TheOak's Avatar
    BTW The "Law" also states that Congress will set a budget each year and stay under the Debt Ceiling.

    You live by the sword, you die by the sword.
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 04:15 PM by TheOak TheOak is offline
  13. Old Comment
    WHODATINCA's Avatar
    >Who might your governmental appointed custodian be?

    With a government, there is a government ... no custodian necessary.

    Look, you are pissed because you have lost control of your government. I get it. The answer to your loss of control is not killing off the government. At least, I don't think so, but maybe you are an anarchist. But, if you aren't then, the answer I recommend to you is to regain control. Otherwise, without a governing body, you will need a fifedom.

    But, if you believe in government, as long, as it is with the consent of the governed, the question is -- how will you regain control? Will it be anarchy? Revolution? Getting corporate money out of politics? Doing away with the Electoral College? Dismantling the Federal Reserve? There are lots of creative ideas.

    And, I like the libertarian ideals of "pull yourself up by your boot straps" and together "let's roll..." mindset. I think it is needed especially now in wresting OUR government back from the people and organizations who control it. And, so, we come full circle.

    I want to ask you, Oak -- has the media brainwashed you so much that you think you can't see the truth? Because, I don't think the media has brainwashed me so I can't see the truth, either. And, on certain points we may disagree. But, I hope we agree that we prefer a government, of the people, by the people, for the people. And, I want to direct your attention to the OZ you mention. Who owns the media?
    Posted 10-04-2013 at 04:45 PM by WHODATINCA WHODATINCA is offline
  14. Old Comment
    TheOak's Avatar
    There is no anger in me about our government. Your assumptions are incorrect again, much like believing I selected an avatar based on my perception of what my personality is.

    I hardly call those ideas "creative" as they do not address the underlying issue of voter ignorance. The media is controlled by voter ignorance. The media no longer reports the raw unadulterated news, they now feed the masses what the masses want to see and hear. They dramatize it, add a pinch of panic, plate it on which ever direction they want it to go and then serve it.

    The issue is not who controls the government, the issue is "has your government become so powerful that you need to control it"? The framers idea of Government was minimalist at best and never reaching a size where it needed to be controlled. If the Federal Government needed any controlling the Constitution does that. It is not the Government that decides on the Constitution, it is the Constitution that grants the Government its power.

    Here is the wash, unless you are deluded beyond reason you recognize that eventually there will always be a swing of ownership. The people grow restless and bored with the same government after a while. The more the Government, the more the swing. The ignorance of the people is the direct cause of the power swings. The more the people need, the more they will cast a vote for whom ever promises to fulfill that that need... But these are politicians and not leaders. They will gladly throw out empty promises that they know they will be in office before they will ever have to be held accountable for.

    Federal Government size does not equate to power, that is done through corruption. Government size only equates to inefficiency, and cost.

    You keep reverting to a lack of huge federal government equating to feuding clans... That is the media story you bet down hard on... In the absence of a huge bloated federal government then you have State Government and that is all that is needed. This is protected by the 10th Amendment, it is why Obamacare is a federal tax and nothing else. If it is not a Federal Tax then it is imposing on the States Rights to opt out.

    I do not "roll", and my boots do not have straps. You think in cliche's and that is preventing you from seeing the reality. The only person calling for or mentioning anarchy is yourself.

    The only reason California is happy is because they see their way of life being imposed on the rest of the nation... It will swing again one day and when California has the way of life of another state that is less liberal imposed on them they will be calling for less Government.

    So, again... I am not angry. I am amused. Amused by all the people chasing rainbows.
    Posted 10-05-2013 at 06:39 AM by TheOak TheOak is offline
  15. Old Comment
    WHODATINCA's Avatar
    So, your avatar choice says nothing about you, huh?

    > The media is controlled by voter ignorance.

    > the issue is "has your government become so powerful that
    > you need to control it"?
    I believe the Framers envisioned a representative democracy in which the people are imbued with the power to make changes to their representation --- if their representatives do not serve their interests.

    >The ignorance of the people is the direct cause of the power swings.
    So in your mind -- if Americans were smart -- the conservatives would be elected 100% of the time?

    >State Government ... is all that is needed.
    Could be confused with feudal clans.
    Or, simply, secession. I see you live in Texas.

    I am not calling for anarchy -- so just cut that **** out. It is disrespectful.

    And, re: CA is "happy" -- have you ever been to California? This state is not happier or unhappier than any other state.

    Honestly Oak, for the most part, your logic eludes me and your perceptions simultaneously confuse and amuse. The question arises -- how did he get there from here? But, hey dude, rock on with your bad self.
    Posted 10-05-2013 at 06:40 PM by WHODATINCA WHODATINCA is offline
  16. Old Comment
    WHODATINCA's Avatar
    Regarding the blog we are discussing, I just want to say that the Republicans holding our government hostage because they don't agree with a legally passed law -- makes them traitors -- and responsible for increasing our debt which they say hypocritically say they care about.

    According to the economic consulting firm IHS Global Insight the government shutdown is costing us about $1.6 billion a week, $300 million a day, or $12.5 million an hour.

    Money for nothing: Government shutdown costs $12.5 million per hour - NBC News.com
    Posted 10-05-2013 at 06:45 PM by WHODATINCA WHODATINCA is offline
  17. Old Comment
    And Obamacare will permanently bankrupt all other forms of insurance, as well as social security. Which means unless you're rich, you're going to be thoroughly screwed if you plan on ever retiring.

    When you only look at short term problems, you are likely to only find short term solutions, which when you stop and think about it, is not a solution at all. That's how we end up with Obama care.
    Posted 10-06-2013 at 12:20 AM by burningmetal burningmetal is offline
  18. Old Comment
    xan's Avatar
    Even the Heratige Foundation, the biological mother of the Affordable Health Care Act, can't make the preposterous claim that the law will bankrupt insurance companies. RomneyCare in Massachusetts sees near universal coverage and more than adequate profits for payers. Insurance company profits are increasing in states in which the ACA law has been in place before the Oct. 1 start date. The biggest fear of opponents is not that the law will cause problems but that people will be happy with it, and they hate this President so much that it would be galling to them for it to succeed. You don't have to like this President, but you do not get to make sh up and promote fiction and bad policy without being called on it. At least not in this blog.
    Posted 10-06-2013 at 11:50 AM by xan xan is offline
  19. Old Comment
    WHODATINCA's Avatar
    Thank you, Xan.

    IMO, the reason conservative logic is difficult to follow is because they have disengaged themselves from the facts. That makes debate chaotic, incomprehensible, exhausting and, often, futile. Fox News gives the assist here.

    A study by Fairleigh Dickinson University study shows Fox News viewers are the least informed ( What you know depends on what you watch: People learn most from NPR, Sunday Morning Shows, The Daily Show; least from MSNBC, Fox News ). The poll asked questions about international news (Iran, Egypt, Syria and Greece were included) and domestic affairs (Republican primaries, Congress, unemployment and the Keystone XL pipeline.)

    The pollsters found that people who don't watch any news were able to get 1.22 of the questions on domestic policy right. But, someone who watched only Fox News would be expected to answer just 1.04 domestic questions correctly -- a figure which is significantly worse than if they had reported watching no media at all.

    If strategically this was a football game -- I say the Republican chatter sounds alot like the Cowboys pre-game today. They need a reality-check. The Broncos will no doubt give it to them.
    Posted 10-06-2013 at 04:22 PM by WHODATINCA WHODATINCA is offline
  20. Old Comment
    xan's Avatar
    Regardless of one's political stripes, when presented with information that is in direct contradiction to one's expectations, one will discount thay information and hold on tighter to the initial position. It's called the backfire effect and it can even cause people who are normally proficient in a task not to be able to perform the task if they believe the task will result in proving themselves out of step with reality.

    Explains a lot on both sides of the aisle.
    Posted 10-06-2013 at 04:40 PM by xan xan is offline
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