Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

I like Winston. I think we are in a way better place right now than we wouldve been trading for Watson. They just need to trust him and open the playbook up a little. Our defense should be at least close to top 5.

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

That's the question " The Playbook". How much will PC calls or DA of the O ? Myself , I definitely let PC call. If Allen calls the O-plays it's going to be limited. Allen didn't fair well in his last HC job. All the talent in the word want mean a thing if managed wrong. Got to see how he does with the keys of the kingdom
that was aired to him. Running in the middle of the pack want cut it to me.

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

It’s quite simple. Drew Brees is the superior football player. Jameis has more arm talent. He has the size. He has the mobility. However, Brees flourished in every aspect of the game once he came to New Orleans. Because Jameis has more natural talent he of course has a higher ceiling. It’s a ceiling I hope he reaches. If he can’t live up to Brees I won’t hold it against him. It’s only a handful of QB’s in history who can.

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

You covered a couple different points here JP. Some I agree with some not. My take(s):

While I appreciate his helping us in winning our first playoff game, I never could fully get behind Brooks. To me he never had his head/attitude in the game. His smiling on the sidelines after throwing an Int was the final
straw for me. Nice story about him and your daughter. Though.

You mention the scrutiny Brees played under; was your point that Winston has not had scrutiny? If so I disagree. I think he’s had more. Also not sure about your apologists insulating him comments.

It wasn’t until late in his career that Brees had subpar receivers. Thomas, Meacham, Henderson, Colston, Stills, Snead, Graham, Shockey, Cooks, Sanders (not to mention great receiving backs) all were quality players that could/did play for other teams.

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

By nearly all accounts Brees exceeded his perceived ceiling (After all, Drew is too short to see over his centers a** :)), and Jameis could as well have a similar career.

Once you get to the NFL everyone has a high skill floor, the ceiling development depends a lot on the player. Contrasting Drew Brees vs JaMarcus Russell highlights what happens when work ethic out performs unrefined raw talent.

Speculation gets players into the league, application determines how successful they are, and luck determines how long they stay.:bng:

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

For me, the smiling on the sideline while I can see how it upset some, for me, he was just trying to be positive and even keel...

As I said he and Haslett lost me when they threw KT under the media bus; Can't speak to his drive and will to win other than the results...

Yes, that was a genuine moment at Best Buy I appreciated for both...

Really didn't mention any scrutiny Brees faced, just said that most fans were not aware of the seriousness of his injury at that time; most of that came out later...

As I do read, share articles that I view in the Twittersphere, I've seen several apologists' takes and my impression is that there's a concerted effort...

One of my factual, statistical criticisms replying to some articles is if you take away the Packers, Redskins games, Winston averaged one (1) PaTd/GM...

Also mention Winston only had one game over 250PaYds and that really riles and ruffles feathers and Payton is blamed for not turning Winston loose...

That's not consistent winning football...

Brees had an effective rookie Marques Colston, an ineffective Joe Horn (cut after 2006), and Devery running deep while Brees could air it out then...

Brees didn't have many of those mentioned receivers until you get to the SuperBowl year and after, and yet he put up 4400 to 5000 PaYds early on...

Meachem was a bust for a first round pick; in fact he showed up his rookie year out of shape - a receiver; was an early and often critic of that draft pick...

Snead and Lance Moore were both UDFAs that developed into effective underneath route runners and chains movers, but disappeared on other rosters...

Shockey made some plays, he didn't have the impact in this explosive offense that was expected; his fan popularity was more noteworthy than production...

The best receivers Brees had were Colston, Cooks, and Thomas - and that wasn't all at the same time; their play overlapped each just a few seasons between them...

Brees only got recognition when he broke all time passing records and was infamously snubbed from an MVP in 2011 because Rodgers had a higher QBR...

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

Where did you ever get the idea that Dennis Allen would ever make the offensive calls? That has never been a consideration.

:confused:

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

Re: The Jameis Winston Doubters Parallel the Drew Brees Doubters of 2006
 

I see. Your “Let's see Winston play under the same scrutiny as other NFL QBs” statement threw me off a little as I feel he’s had great scrutiny. For example he was shredded all over the media for his 30 INT season and people overlooked that he also had 5,000+ yards and 33 TDs that year. By comparison Bret Favre didn’t get near the grief for his 29 INT season in 2005 that had less than 4,000 yards and only 20 TDs. Manning had a worse statistical year than Winston’s early in his career too and he wasn’t knocked as hard as Winston was.

I also think Brees got recognition because the first year he came here he led us to our first NFC championship appearance. And while You are correct that If you take out Winston’s two best games (out of only 6 1/2) he didn’t have great numbers, but he also wasn’t the TO machine he had the label of being. It’s not like any of his replacements did any better.

Plus let’s take a look at Drew’s first year here. If we pull out his two best games (Dallas and Tampa) he had 18 TDs in 14 games. That’s just over 1/game. Very similar to Jameis. Plus he had 11 INTs in those 14 games. That’s worse than Winston’s 2 INT in 4 1/2 games (He threw one against the Redskins game we are throwing out). Just food for thought.

I also think Colston, Horn, and Henderson were better than what Winston had to work with last year.