Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 (Post 962876)

What?!?!?! No "11-6" declaration from The Almighty, The Great, The All-Knowing, Eternal Optimistic, himself???

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 (Post 962874)

Although not a guarantee... it is likely a Sean Payton trade happens in the offseason, netting us at least one first round pick.

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962872)

Kinda outta nowhere in a thread about head coaches, but good to know he lives in your head rent free.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 962875)

No doubt Thomas has a sprawling 40 acres estate in :dunce:'s head. :D

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 962880)

LOL! As a matter of fact, as my son and I were leaving the Dome Monday night I told him, "We should still have the division wrapped up at 11-6."

:bng:

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962856)

You guys are either missing or avoiding the point I’m trying to make. I wasn’t trying to do an individual comparison of injuries under Payton versus injuries under Allen. Yes, Payton had the Miami game to deal with. That skewed things greatly. But Allen has had close to the same situation and started with a fundamentally less talented team without Marcus Williams, Johnson, Armstead, and Jenkins.

Are you denying that injuries have hit Allen’s team pretty seriously this year? Has he NOT played games without his top QB, Top 3 WRs, Top RBs, Top CBs, and DLs? Seems I remember comments about how long his injury list was not too long ago. It’s tough to coach and win in the NFL when you have a full roster much less a banged up one. Allen has had a mostly banged up one. That is the point I’m making. If you disagree and think injuries and the talent you are able to put on the field don’t matter then fine. I disagree. Having healthy players makes a difference and Allen hasn’t had much of that. Payton would be struggling with this team and it’s injuries the same way he struggled with last year’s team the same way Allen is struggling with it. Could be why he decided to jump ship.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 962826)

And, of course, don't forget that global warming is a direct result of Loomis' decision making.

:crazy:

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962816)

I know this is going to sound like I’m in Allen’s corner to be the head coach and I’m really not. I’d just like to interject a thought. Do you really think he’s been given a fair chance at an objective evaluation so far this year? Hear me out…

I remember Payton struggling along with multiple 7-9 seasons when he had Brees IN HIS PRIME because he was too…blind…to realize he needed a team that could at least force one or two punts a game. I remember Payton trying dumb reverses or flea flickers at ridiculously silly moments in games that cost the team wins. I remember him drafting players like Baptiste and I remember him NEVER developing anything even close to a successful back up QB or have a plan post Brees.

Now Allen needs to unexpectedly step in for a coach (who surprisingly retires) that had a 9-8 record. Due to financial reasons the D (which had carried the team the year before) needs to lose their two starting safties and an excellent corner. They also lose a cornerstone on their Oline in Armstead.

Allen starts the year with no established QB and needs to sort through a rehabbing Winston, a washed up Dalton or an unprepared/injury prone Hill for a starter (with only 3 preseason games to find him). Then, more injuries pop up. Some unsurprising like Davenport and Thomas. Some unexpected like Penning and Lattimore. But when you really consider the sheer number of players who have missed time and they guys who have had to play in their stead it’s sort of staggering to me.

There has been practically no Landry and no Thomas at WR. At least one game was played without Olave as well. Trautman was even hurt. Who the hell has there been to throw to? Kevin White and Juwan Johnson and Smith? Payton couldn’t win with those guys, why should Allen be able to.

Lattimore’s injury has been huge. That’s left the rookie Taylor as the best DB on the whole team. Last game against the Ravens we had Kaden friggin Ellis out there trying to tackle Lamar Jackson because Werner went down. That’s not on Allen.

Look at the RBs. It’s not on Allen that both Ingram and Kamara had big fumbles early in the season that clearly cost games. Both Tampa and Carolina are Ws if those Vets hold on to the ball. Allen shouldn’t need to tell those two players to hold on to the damn ball.

Again, I’m not saying Allen should stay. I’m only saying that he was put in a tough spot and I personally do not believe he can fairly be evaluated as the head coach of the Saints based upon what he has had to work with so far:

Starting QB…injured
2 Best WRs…injured
Top 2 RB…injured
Best CB…injured
“Best” TE…injured

That’s just off the top of my head. I doubt any coach including Payton would be doing much better with the hand Allen’s been dealt. He’s being made the scapegoat. But I guess when you are the HC that comes with the territory. I just don’t think fans are looking at things objectively.

Originally Posted by subguy (Post 962902)

Team wise - I think it is equally important to look at not only overall talent, but what have you, as the leader, done with the talent you have. Also, what are the expectations of the hand you are dealt and have pushed the talent to perform to those expectations? The lack of rallying his team, relying on and rallying the veterans to provide the synergy, in a nutshell, leadership falls squarely on DA's shoulders. As a leader you automatically receive the credit, but that also means you receive the criticism.

Evaluation of talent - Winston, talent wise upper mid pack, decision making lower pack as far as QB's go. Referring to Dalton as washed up, I do think he has proven otherwise. All of your injury points are also injuries that Dalton has had to deal with as a starter.

Overall observations are;

Special teams has been mediocre. Penalties(lack of discipline) and turnovers (fumbles) anomaly for this team. Part on the individual, part on the coaching staff.

No synergy of the who's who of talent on D. The D on paper should be living up to the pre-season hope and hype. It appears that we haven't been able to pressure as much as in past seasons, some due to injury, yes. While I am not a CJG fan, because of the chaos he brings, he seemed to have energy around him. How much more are you able to coach professionals on fundamentals? I have no idea, but tackling has been ridiculously bad. I do feel relying on your veteran field generals and the ability to get the team motivated is on the coaching staff.

Every armchair coach has their subjective opinion. Mine is, we don't utilize what offensive talent we have to create a spark. This is on the coaching staff.

Dalton is stable, can work the checkdown and the short pass game. But this will only carry you so far with one RB. Unfortunately for Taysom and his Swiss Army Knife duty he needs to be utilized more, injury aside. Kamara continually running off tackle becomes too predictable. Taysom can loosen the opposing D-line, since he runs the majority of the time he is on the field. He does offer another weapon for a D to focus on. Loosening up things for Dalton. There has been a glimmer with Shaheed, limited by usage.

I wouldn't say DA needs to go during his first year. It is frustrating to watch from the sofa at times, because there is an appearance of a lack of cohesion, a lack of spark, a lack of unification. If teams display any of those things and they are out matched in talent, so be it.

Injuries have been an issue, no doubt. But as a whole we appear to just go through the motions without luster and an effective group of leaders can most certainly motivate.

Jury is out, but I don't see DA's leadership skills improving even sans injuries.

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962903)

Often there are open receivers that Dalton (Winston too) aren’t seeing or throwing to.