Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 962905)

When a play is executed the progressions the QB goes through are linear. They go from first designed option, to the next, then the next, then the next, etc. I have heard and read many times that the "open receiver" may actually be later in the progression and not even seen by the time the ball needs to get out. That may be the issue.

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962816)

I know this is going to sound like I’m in Allen’s corner to be the head coach and I’m really not. I’d just like to interject a thought. Do you really think he’s been given a fair chance at an objective evaluation so far this year? Hear me out…

I remember Payton struggling along with multiple 7-9 seasons when he had Brees IN HIS PRIME because he was too…blind…to realize he needed a team that could at least force one or two punts a game. I remember Payton trying dumb reverses or flea flickers at ridiculously silly moments in games that cost the team wins. I remember him drafting players like Baptiste and I remember him NEVER developing anything even close to a successful back up QB or have a plan post Brees.

Now Allen needs to unexpectedly step in for a coach (who surprisingly retires) that had a 9-8 record. Due to financial reasons the D (which had carried the team the year before) needs to lose their two starting safties and an excellent corner. They also lose a cornerstone on their Oline in Armstead.

Allen starts the year with no established QB and needs to sort through a rehabbing Winston, a washed up Dalton or an unprepared/injury prone Hill for a starter (with only 3 preseason games to find him). Then, more injuries pop up. Some unsurprising like Davenport and Thomas. Some unexpected like Penning and Lattimore. But when you really consider the sheer number of players who have missed time and they guys who have had to play in their stead it’s sort of staggering to me.

There has been practically no Landry and no Thomas at WR. At least one game was played without Olave as well. Trautman was even hurt. Who the hell has there been to throw to? Kevin White and Juwan Johnson and Smith? Payton couldn’t win with those guys, why should Allen be able to.

Lattimore’s injury has been huge. That’s left the rookie Taylor as the best DB on the whole team. Last game against the Ravens we had Kaden friggin Ellis out there trying to tackle Lamar Jackson because Werner went down. That’s not on Allen.

Look at the RBs. It’s not on Allen that both Ingram and Kamara had big fumbles early in the season that clearly cost games. Both Tampa and Carolina are Ws if those Vets hold on to the ball. Allen shouldn’t need to tell those two players to hold on to the damn ball.

Again, I’m not saying Allen should stay. I’m only saying that he was put in a tough spot and I personally do not believe he can fairly be evaluated as the head coach of the Saints based upon what he has had to work with so far:

Starting QB…injured
2 Best WRs…injured
Top 2 RB…injured
Best CB…injured
“Best” TE…injured

That’s just off the top of my head. I doubt any coach including Payton would be doing much better with the hand Allen’s been dealt. He’s being made the scapegoat. But I guess when you are the HC that comes with the territory. I just don’t think fans are looking at things objectively.

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962843)

Kevin White, trequan smith and Callaway are good WRs huh? and it’s Allen’s fault that they couldn’t afford CGJ and the safeties they lost in the off-season? Again, respect your opinion but you aren’t looking at things Objectively. This is the same team that the great Sean Payton was 9-8 with last year except we are worse off BY FAR at the safety spot and now at LB with Werner out. That’s a fact. It’s not Allen’s fault the economics dictated he lose the players he did.

Originally Posted by Rell&Gold (Post 962927)

Respect but no those are excuses. We haven't lost any of those games because of injuries. We've been in every game except the Ravens and maybe Carolina with or without certain players. There were still opportunities to be had after those plays in both of those games big plays and momentum changers no doubt there was still football to be played. Everyone is injured that's why you have and "Off-season" to prepare your counter measures. Co defensive coordinator but the head coach is calling the defensive plays? Coaches decision. Trading Chauncey for a fourth round pick coaches decision. Not resigning marcus Williams partial coaches decision or influence at the least. Trading away picks for a WR leaving unable to fill other obvious and immediate holes. I.E DT OL RB2 there were opportunities to add way more to this roster and they lost more than they gained. Offensive playcalling AND PERSONNEL?. This team is 3-6 because of coaching. Even with ALL the injuries the Saints have had they have been in every game excluding the Ravens and Panthers. That's not injuries we lost with Michael Thomas we lost with Jarvis we lost Jameis, as you stated you weren't shocked by some of the injuries with we lost father games because we couldn't close out . If this was coach that was brand new to the organization I would give him the benefit of the doubt you're giving him if this was a first time head coach situation. DA is an experienced coach who was handed some nice car keys and he just drove the car never gets it maintenance just gas and oil change maybe a tire here and there.

Originally Posted by Rell&Gold (Post 962927)

Respect but no those are excuses. We haven't lost any of those games because of injuries. We've been in every game except the Ravens and maybe Carolina with or without certain players. There were still opportunities to be had after those plays in both of those games big plays and momentum changers no doubt there was still football to be played. Everyone is injured that's why you have and "Off-season" to prepare your counter measures. Co defensive coordinator but the head coach is calling the defensive plays? Coaches decision. Trading Chauncey for a fourth round pick coaches decision. Not resigning marcus Williams partial coaches decision or influence at the least. Trading away picks for a WR leaving unable to fill other obvious and immediate holes. I.E DT OL RB2 there were opportunities to add way more to this roster and they lost more than they gained. Offensive playcalling AND PERSONNEL?. This team is 3-6 because of coaching. Even with ALL the injuries the Saints have had they have been in every game excluding the Ravens and Panthers. That's not injuries we lost with Michael Thomas we lost with Jarvis we lost Jameis, as you stated you weren't shocked by some of the injuries with we lost father games because we couldn't close out . If this was coach that was brand new to the organization I would give him the benefit of the doubt you're giving him if this was a first time head coach situation. DA is an experienced coach who was handed some nice car keys and he just drove the car never gets it maintenance just gas and oil change maybe a tire here and there.

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido (Post 962950)

Injuries have absolutely been a reason for many of the Saints' difficulties. When you are forced to field a team made up of backups you cannot be expected to compete at the same level as with a team filled with starters. That is NOT an excuse. As Boston pointed out, that is an absolute reality.

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962938)

So if Josh Allen or Mahomes or Hurts goes down with a season ending injury then the Bills, Chiefs or Eagles still should be favored to win the SB? Sorry, but I don’t agree and I guarantee Vegas odds would agree with me. It’s not an “excuse”. It’s reality.

Originally Posted by Boston Saint (Post 962938)

So if Josh Allen or Mahomes or Hurts goes down with a season ending injury then the Bills, Chiefs or Eagles still should be favored to win the SB? Sorry, but I don’t agree and I guarantee Vegas odds would agree with me. It’s not an “excuse”. It’s reality.