Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Dorsey had to take the fall for that turnover machine named Josh Allen. Not really a surprise to see Pete at the bottom of the list, plenty of blame to go around for that. Coaching, bad contracts, player performance, etc...

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

But look who is #32 … dead last signal caller 💀, hanging out with other bottom feeders (Giants, Falcons, Raiders, Patriots).

And the Saints refuse to make any changes during the bye week.

Front office is asleep at the wheel.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

I know that many will not agree with this perspective, but it does ring true.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

You’re right, I don’t agree, however I do agree with the individuals response to Nick though

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Where is this chart sourced? Just curious as to the stats used.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Carmichael is in way over his head without Sean Payton.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Weird, right? You'd think that a guy that spends over a decade with Payton would understand his concepts like the back of his hand.
I really do think that the main issue is the guys in charge of calling the plays. Neither DA nor Pete have the alpha male presence. They both may be smart as a whip but young men in their prime don't want to work hard for a beta.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

I'm not a huge fan of using analytics to vet coaches, but if it helps get closer to the obvious conclusion that Carmichael is a hack then I'm good.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Pete Carmichael understands the concepts of how Sean Payton likes his coffee like the back of his hand.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Is that a six figure salaried opportunity?

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F_FJQDaX...g&name=900x900

:bugeyes:


:puke:

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

And he's (Pete) still employed ^^^. Not even demoted from play calling. But it shows on Sundays.

Wow, just wow.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

This guy's (Steve) charts pops up a lot here on Dallas football metrics. He's all data analytics 24/7, reporting statistical facts.

It's really not about what he says, just the literal scientific data validating what most of us are seeing every week & the concerns about this pedestrian offense compared to others.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

How can he be rated as the worst OC in the NFL and still have a job? Two other franchises already fired their inept coordinators but Carmichael still has a job. SMH

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

My opinion hasn't changed here with this. Dorsey is a bad. When you have an All Pro quarterback and receiver, you're going to score points. They've regressed from last season and completely unbalanced. There are games where they completely abandon the run game which will drive you crazy. Other games it's throw Diggs the ball, throw Diggs the ball, and throw Diggs the ball again. Don't want.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Well, Pete Carmichael didn't stay unemployed very long. Welcome to the Denver Saints & good luck :rolleyes:. You'll need it in the AFC.

Pete Carmichael joining Sean Payton's Broncos coaching staff

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

I predict that he will do well. Watch what happens.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Much like a meme that makes you laugh way harder than it should this is intriguing the crap out pf me. If I am Gayle, I am on a plane to Denver to buy Sean dinner and ask him what I am missing? Why did he really leave?

Gayle just let go of an 18 year employee because she was led to believe he was the roadblock to the teams success. Only to wake up to the person that arguably knows his talents best but owes him nothing picking him up.

Lets assume Pete is as useless as we've tried to believe. This would make Sean an idiot and does not explain the success they had together in New Orleans. Drew might explain that but I struggle with it being a 1 man show.

Lets assume Pete is as good as Sean thinks he is. Did Pete just tank a season to get out of New Orleans? What is so bad in New Orleans that he would do that? How did Dennis Allen not see it and allow it to happen? I have so many questions and they all have very dark implications.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

SP is the play caller and the true OC. Pete is the guy that handles laminating the play call sheet SP uses on the sidelines?

Good for Pete Carmichael, though. We wish him well.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Carmichael's failure as the Saints OC was the result of his play calling and what I suspect was his play design. With Payton, and Brees, he reportedly contributed to the designing of those amazing plays that Payton called and Brees executed. From what I have read and heard from others, including Brees, Carmichael contributed greatly to those design sessions. Over the past couple of seasons he was missing his creative partners. He was Rodgers without Hammerstein, Bernie Taupin without Elton John, or Larry without Moe and Curly.

I do not believe it was anything as nefarious as you appear to presume. I believe that Pete Carmichael simply doesn't have it in him to do it on his own. We all should remember correctly that Carmichael did show a certain hesitancy assuming the full duties of OC when Payton left.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Just saw your reply. Carmichael definitely has his strengths and weaknesses. Unfortunately his strengths seem to be tied to Payton. Yes, I wish him well, as well.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Yes great for Pete. Great for anyone that can manage to maintain a career in that league. Will be interesting to see what his role will be as Denver has not jetted Joseph Lombardi.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Carmichael's title is that of Senior Offensive Assistant. Sounds like he'll be joining Payton back in the lab brewing up new plays.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Amongst many frustrations with the Saints organization the most annoying decision the team made was to keep Carmichael all season and not drop him midseason when everyone knew he wasn't the answer. We could have watched how Ronald Curry handled the offense after the bye week and the team would therefore make a more informed decision on Pete's replacement for the 2024 season.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

I can see Gayle's fingerprints all over that decision. I have often heard the description of her affection for both Loomis and Payton as that of the love for the sons she never had. I can easily see some of the similar feelings for someone with as long a tenure with the team as Carmichael enjoyed.

This is much the same reason why I cannot see Gayle ever cutting ties with Mickey Loomis until he either chooses to retire or upon her death. My guess is he'd retire before she passes.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Add blind loyalty in business to my list of frustrations...:brood:

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

I believe it's pretty clear that she sees the Saints as far more than just a business. This is one of the reasons why she has mandated the Saints remaining in New Orleans even past her eventual passing. Personally I'll take that sort of guidance over a cutthroat bottom line leader any day. In my many years of working within organizations of all sorts I'd take the former over the latter every time. Times have changed and I understand the younger generations see things like this differently, but it is understandable that she feels the way she feels. If not ours Saints could very well have been elsewhere years ago.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

You're missing the point. Generally speaking, loyalty is an admirable quality. Blind loyalty is the sense of giving yourself entirely to someone without caring what he/she will do to your organization.
We all knew that Carmichael was in over his head but Loomis and Gayle Benson kept him anyway. They knew that he was a terrible OC but the team and it's fans be damned. That angered a lot of us for good reason.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

It is abundantly clear now, that Gayle sees the Saints as far more (or less) than a progressive, WINNING FOOTBALL TEAM. it is also clear that there are fans who will buy the merch, go to the games, and feel really good about whatever it is that Gayle sees, and continues to put on the field for fans to see.

The rest of us came here to watch WINNING FOOTBALL, and it AINT happening.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

There it ‘tis’.

Mentioned this numerous times last season.

Saints take a UGLY loss against a BACKUP QB (Dobbs). Mind you, we ONLY became COMPETITIVE once Winston came in :rolleyes:.

Subsequent BYE week, then get embarrassed AGAIN to another back up (Deridder) in Atlanta. 10 day rest & perform that poorly?

Stale & predictable play calling … Pete should have definitely been relieved of his duties as OC. As you mentioned, that would have been a PERFECT opportunity to see what Ronald could do on his own as signal caller.

Saints organization has become PASSIVE.

Beating the likes of Chicago, Giants, Panthers, etc was fools gold.

Yet we are here … again.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

I have come to the realization that some fans are much quicker to anger than others. I suppose their (Gayle's) loyalty is stronger for those they know and love than for the fear of any anger from random fans. Would you not agree that this is understandable?

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

I probably won’t be able to think of a good way to phrase my thoughts without someone coming down on me, but I’ll give it a try.

I think an overlooked part of the “downfall” has been injury…especially to the QBs as a result of injuries and poor play by the Oline. The team finished well(top 10 I think) in scoring by the end of the year. IMO That’s partially because Carr finally got relatively healthy by the last 5 or so games of the season. He seemed to finally have developed a good chemistry with his three young WRs.

The Oline couldn’t maintain a run game. That severely limited playcalling. I believe Carr has mentioned in the past that switching OCs in the past was a hindrance…so here he goes again with a new OC and new system.

I don’t know if Charmical is good or not. Obviously SP thinks he is. I’m Not even sad that he’s gone. I’m just pointing ideas out.

As far as the team missing out on someone they wanted, that could also be so. But they also could be waiting for someone on the Niners or KCs staff. At least for an interview. Seems there are still good candidates available.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Nope. Not missing the point. I believe you are assuming that their viewpoint of the situation was the same as yours. You said "We all knew that Carmichael was in over his head." Given that they have far more insight than any of us out here we cannot assume that their take was the same as yours. In fact, it most likely wasn't. I suppose some fan's anger would be based on Loomis and Gayle not seeing things exactly as those on the outside looking in. And this applies to many aspects. Perhaps they saw us still being in reach of that playoff spot, which we absolutely were. Would a total shakeup in midstream make things better or perhaps make things worse? Who knows? Or maybe it was blind loyalty with them knowing Carmichael was hurting more than helping. Perhaps. But, it is all still their prerogative over us as fans, correct? Gayle does own the team, not us.

By all means be angry, but just know that no owner really cares what every fan thinks. Nor should they. They know for a fact that almost anything they do or don't do, say or don't say, is going to piss off someone.

:D

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

And we need a new Head Coach.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Didn’t the Browns lose their stud RB (Chubb) in week 2? Then lose a stud TACKLE (Conklin)? Then have to call on old man Flacco @ QB?

I don’t believe any NFL team was hit as bad with injuries than the Browns yet they found a way in to post season.

Saints couldn’t even capitalize on having a soft schedule.

Yet here we are … again.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Excuses have been like gnats flying around, defending mosquitoes who have been defending poor management and coaching for two years now. Wait until next year, and watch the cycle repeat.

Re: Pete Carmichael analytics show you something.
 

Friggin sad when pointing out reality is called making excuses. Teams dealt with injuries better than the Saints did. Some dealt with it worse. If some
Want to say the Jets, For example, didn’t suffer because they had QB injuries I would disagree. Winston getting injured last year and Carr this year both had an impact on the team. Feel free to disagree all you want. It’s a reality, not an excuse.

What about a team like Philly? Weren’t they supposed to be the darlings because they fleeced us in trades and were looking good? Failed down the stretch. The cherry picking of points do bash the team about is ridiculous. Obviously they have flaws. But most teams in the league do…including the two playing for the SB.