Why did Haslett regress so badly?

TheGambler · 11-17-2006, 10:03 AM

The Saints's recent success has me thinking back to their last playoff season (2000), which happened to be Haslett's rookie season. During that season they lost their starting QB (Blake), lost Ricky Williams for several weeks, and even lost Joe Horn at the beginning of their playoff game against the Rams. Yet somehow Haslett managed to win critical games with Aaron Brooks, Terry Allen, and Robert Wilson playing in place of those guys.

So why was Haslett able to overcome so many injuries to his players during his first year, but unable to get past 7,8,9 wins with teams that were slightly healthier? Where did it go wrong?

papz · 11-17-2006, 10:15 AM

When he took less of a role coaching the defense and promoted Venturi. The loss of both Zook and Bunting hurt too.

TallySaint · 11-17-2006, 12:16 PM

Yet somehow Haslett managed to win critical games with Aaron Brooks, Terry Allen, and Robert Wilson playing in place of those guys.

Robert Wilson has a nifty BBQ and Jazz joint here in downtown Tallahassee.

:P

gandhi1007 · 11-17-2006, 12:25 PM

You want a simple answer? Because he was too proud to admit that his "golden boy" (Aaron Brooks) was a bum, for one. Papz covered the other side of the ball already in his post.

Tobias-Reiper · 11-17-2006, 01:49 PM

Part was a favorable schedule, IIRC.
Part was that, before Blake was lost, the Saints went on a 7-1 game streak.
And part was that, somehow, that team matched up well against the Rams.

mjf150 · 11-17-2006, 04:08 PM

Many of the reason list are good, in particular the loss of Zook and Bunting, as well as the blind faith that Haslett had in Aaron Brooks, especially in '02 when he had a lame sholder. We went on to finish the season with 3 straight losses against Minnesota, Cincinnatti, and Carolina, when if we had simply won any one of those three games, we would have locked up a play-off berth. He stuck with Brooks in all three games despite the bad sholder and the fact that Delhomme had a spectacular game against the Ravens the week prior to the Vikings game.

But there is one other reason for the decline not mentioned and that is the firing of Randy Mueller for trading Ricky Williams (a trade that would prove Mueller to be right). He was an excellent GM. And many who know the NFL inside and out will tell you that a great GM is even more important than a great coach. Even some of the greatest coaches have failed when a bad GM has handed them poor talent.

LSUJeremy · 11-17-2006, 05:10 PM

Originally Posted by mjf150

But there is one other reason for the decline not mentioned and that is the firing of Randy Mueller for trading Ricky Williams (a trade that would prove Mueller to be right). He was an excellent GM. And many who know the NFL inside and out will tell you that a great GM is even more important than a great coach. Even some of the greatest coaches have failed when a bad GM has handed them poor talent.

From a Saints scout's mouth, at that time, and who was dating Rita LaBlanc, Mueller was fired because he didn't get along with her.

If you remember, before he was fired Benson allowed him to interview with the Falcons. I talked to this guy right around then and asked him why we'd let him talk to them. He said Benson didn't care for the way he treated LeBlanc. Soon after he was gone and no one publicly would really say why.

That's when I started to not like Benson.

APSaintsfan · 11-17-2006, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by papz

When he took less of a role coaching the defense and promoted Venturi. The loss of both Zook and Bunting hurt too.

Wait a minute??? Is that the John Bunting that took the North Carolina Tar Heels job and just is about to go 1-11 for the season?
He cannot recruit here in NC.

Tobias-Reiper · 11-17-2006, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by mjf150

But there is one other reason for the decline not mentioned and that is the firing of Randy Mueller for trading Ricky Williams (a trade that would prove Mueller to be right). He was an excellent GM. And many who know the NFL inside and out will tell you that a great GM is even more important than a great coach. Even some of the greatest coaches have failed when a bad GM has handed them poor talent.

Oh, yes, he was... and now he's leading the Dolphins to their second undefeated season and 2nd Lombardy trophy after tearing up the AFC last year. Great choices at QB in Miami, don't you think?

LSUJeremy · 11-17-2006, 11:01 PM

Originally Posted by APSaintsfan

Originally Posted by papz

When he took less of a role coaching the defense and promoted Venturi. The loss of both Zook and Bunting hurt too.

Wait a minute??? Is that the John Bunting that took the North Carolina Tar Heels job and just is about to go 1-11 for the season?
He cannot recruit here in NC.

But that doesn't mean he isn't a good position coach. Our defense was definitely better with him and Zook.

I think Bunting had a pretty decent class lined up so far.

http://rivals100.rivals.com/teamrank.asp

11-17-2006, 10:03 AM	#1
TheGambler 500th Post Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 610	Why did Haslett regress so badly? The Saints's recent success has me thinking back to their last playoff season (2000), which happened to be Haslett's rookie season. During that season they lost their starting QB (Blake), lost Ricky Williams for several weeks, and even lost Joe Horn at the beginning of their playoff game against the Rams. Yet somehow Haslett managed to win critical games with Aaron Brooks, Terry Allen, and Robert Wilson playing in place of those guys. So why was Haslett able to overcome so many injuries to his players during his first year, but unable to get past 7,8,9 wins with teams that were slightly healthier? Where did it go wrong?
TheGambler 500th Post Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 610

11-17-2006, 10:15 AM	#2
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,744	RE: Why did Haslett regress so badly? When he took less of a role coaching the defense and promoted Venturi. The loss of both Zook and Bunting hurt too.

11-17-2006, 04:08 PM	#6
mjf150 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 747	Many of the reason list are good, in particular the loss of Zook and Bunting, as well as the blind faith that Haslett had in Aaron Brooks, especially in '02 when he had a lame sholder. We went on to finish the season with 3 straight losses against Minnesota, Cincinnatti, and Carolina, when if we had simply won any one of those three games, we would have locked up a play-off berth. He stuck with Brooks in all three games despite the bad sholder and the fact that Delhomme had a spectacular game against the Ravens the week prior to the Vikings game. But there is one other reason for the decline not mentioned and that is the firing of Randy Mueller for trading Ricky Williams (a trade that would prove Mueller to be right). He was an excellent GM. And many who know the NFL inside and out will tell you that a great GM is even more important than a great coach. Even some of the greatest coaches have failed when a bad GM has handed them poor talent.
mjf150 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 747

11-17-2006, 05:10 PM	#7
LSUJeremy 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 472	Originally Posted by mjf150 But there is one other reason for the decline not mentioned and that is the firing of Randy Mueller for trading Ricky Williams (a trade that would prove Mueller to be right). He was an excellent GM. And many who know the NFL inside and out will tell you that a great GM is even more important than a great coach. Even some of the greatest coaches have failed when a bad GM has handed them poor talent. From a Saints scout's mouth, at that time, and who was dating Rita LaBlanc, Mueller was fired because he didn't get along with her. If you remember, before he was fired Benson allowed him to interview with the Falcons. I talked to this guy right around then and asked him why we'd let him talk to them. He said Benson didn't care for the way he treated LeBlanc. Soon after he was gone and no one publicly would really say why. That's when I started to not like Benson.
LSUJeremy 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 472

11-17-2006, 08:33 PM	#8
APSaintsfan 100th Post Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Concord, NC Posts: 119	Re: RE: Why did Haslett regress so badly? Originally Posted by papz When he took less of a role coaching the defense and promoted Venturi. The loss of both Zook and Bunting hurt too. Wait a minute??? Is that the John Bunting that took the North Carolina Tar Heels job and just is about to go 1-11 for the season? He cannot recruit here in NC.

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11-17-2006, 12:16 PM	#3
TallySaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tallahassee Posts: 1,367	Yet somehow Haslett managed to win critical games with Aaron Brooks, Terry Allen, and Robert Wilson playing in place of those guys. Robert Wilson has a nifty BBQ and Jazz joint here in downtown Tallahassee. :P

11-17-2006, 12:25 PM	#4
gandhi1007 Part Time Pimp Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,967	You want a simple answer? Because he was too proud to admit that his "golden boy" (Aaron Brooks) was a bum, for one. Papz covered the other side of the ball already in his post.

11-17-2006, 01:49 PM	#5
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Part was a favorable schedule, IIRC. Part was that, before Blake was lost, the Saints went on a 7-1 game streak. And part was that, somehow, that team matched up well against the Rams.

11-17-2006, 08:44 PM	#9
Tobias-Reiper Merces Letifer Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 4,161	Originally Posted by mjf150 But there is one other reason for the decline not mentioned and that is the firing of Randy Mueller for trading Ricky Williams (a trade that would prove Mueller to be right). He was an excellent GM. And many who know the NFL inside and out will tell you that a great GM is even more important than a great coach. Even some of the greatest coaches have failed when a bad GM has handed them poor talent. Oh, yes, he was... and now he's leading the Dolphins to their second undefeated season and 2nd Lombardy trophy after tearing up the AFC last year. Great choices at QB in Miami, don't you think?

11-17-2006, 11:01 PM	#10
LSUJeremy 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 472	Re: RE: Why did Haslett regress so badly? Originally Posted by APSaintsfan Originally Posted by papz When he took less of a role coaching the defense and promoted Venturi. The loss of both Zook and Bunting hurt too. Wait a minute??? Is that the John Bunting that took the North Carolina Tar Heels job and just is about to go 1-11 for the season? He cannot recruit here in NC. But that doesn't mean he isn't a good position coach. Our defense was definitely better with him and Zook. I think Bunting had a pretty decent class lined up so far. http://rivals100.rivals.com/teamrank.asp
LSUJeremy 100th Post Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 472