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Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Per Rotoworld: Roy Williams-WR-Lions Jan. 13 - 12:16 pm et MLive.com's Tom Kowalski believes the Lions will dangle Roy Williams in trade talks leading up to April's NFL Draft. Williams will enter a contract year in 2008 and Kowalski expects ...

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Old 01-13-2008, 03:42 PM   #1
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Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

Per Rotoworld:

Roy Williams-WR-Lions Jan. 13 - 12:16 pm et

MLive.com's Tom Kowalski believes the Lions will dangle Roy Williams in trade talks leading up to April's NFL Draft.
Williams will enter a contract year in 2008 and Kowalski expects him to leave in 2009 if the Lions can't execute a trade. If Williams is dealt, Calvin Johnson would take over as Detroit's "No. 1" receiver. Williams, the No. 7 overall pick in 2004, should at least command a second-round pick as compensation.
Source: MLive.com
Related: Calvin Johnson

Would you trade are second round pick for him ???



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Old 01-13-2008, 04:30 PM   #2
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

In a heart beat. Just imagine Colston and Williams paired up in our offense... sick.
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Old 01-13-2008, 07:29 PM   #3
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

I would not want the Saints to trade their 2nd pick for him. Too many needs on defense. The only way I would reconsider is if the Saints could redo his contract first, mainly to extend it for a couple years. Yes, he would be a nice addition.
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Old 01-13-2008, 08:07 PM   #4
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

Thats a lot of money at WR. He and Colston is a FA in 2009. sounds like we would get in the same jam as the lions did with so many first round picks at WR.
What the heck put the defense rebuilding project on hold for another year.
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Old 01-13-2008, 09:41 PM   #5
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

Originally Posted by QBREES9 View Post
Per Rotoworld:

Roy Williams-WR-Lions Jan. 13 - 12:16 pm et

MLive.com's Tom Kowalski believes the Lions will dangle Roy Williams in trade talks leading up to April's NFL Draft.
Williams will enter a contract year in 2008 and Kowalski expects him to leave in 2009 if the Lions can't execute a trade. If Williams is dealt, Calvin Johnson would take over as Detroit's "No. 1" receiver. Williams, the No. 7 overall pick in 2004, should at least command a second-round pick as compensation.
Source: MLive.com
Related: Calvin Johnson

Would you trade are second round pick for him ???
Not unless he suddenly turns into a CB or a MLB. Can he play defensive tackle as well as Haynesworth?

I am truly confused as to why there is any discussion around here about anything other than top flight defensive free agents and defensive coaches

Maybe, just maybe a discussion of a stud OT may be woth having. But I really think we need another offensive skill guy as much as I need another hole in my already holey head.

For receivers the formula is simple: try to resign your own free agents for a reasonable price and get Meachem ready to play. Drew Brees has proved nothing over the last two years more than the fact that if you have the same colored jersey that he does that you will get the ball.

Giving away a 2nd round pick for any offensive skill player is a crime against this team. Each and every free agent move and draft move until about the 4th round needs to be on the defensive side of the ball. Period.

Our production on offense is totally out of whack with our defensive production. So our offseason needs to be unbalanced in the opposite direction.

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Old 01-14-2008, 07:23 AM   #6
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

I still remember prior to the season suggesting we go get Randy Moss and everyone was against it. Looking back it was dumb not to get him as Colston was our only reliable target. There is a need at receiver period. Should we not address that problem somehow this offseason... it would be a crime against our offense not addressing that weakness.

I bet this board would be a riot if we took a receiver with one of our first day picks. You know at the end of the game, the team with the most points win.
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Old 01-14-2008, 11:12 AM   #7
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

Originally Posted by papz View Post
I still remember prior to the season suggesting we go get Randy Moss and everyone was against it. Looking back it was dumb not to get him as Colston was our only reliable target. There is a need at receiver period. Should we not address that problem somehow this offseason... it would be a crime against our offense not addressing that weakness.
The Saints do not yet have the reputation required to secure free agents such as Moss. Moss took a pay cut to go to the Pats so that he could win his elusive championship. So I think that point is moot.

The Saints passing offense was in the top three in passing yards, completion percentage, and attempts. Unfortunately they were also #2 in on target drops.

If the passing offense were 26th in the league and the defense were #3, maybe we could have a different conversation. But as it stands, very little needs to be done to the receiving corps or to the offense in general.

I bet this board would be a riot if we took a receiver with one of our first day picks.
I'd be totally ticked off even if the receiver were all world. The defense sucks. It needs to be improved at all costs.

You know at the end of the game, the team with the most points win.
Absolutely. However when you defense cannot stop the explosive play (of which the Saints were #1 in the league), cannot get off the field on third down (ditto), and make insurance salesmen and rookies look like Joe Montana (I guess it's Tom Brady now), then guess what? The other team is the one that ends up with the most points.

The Saints are badly unbalanced at this point. They should only do enough work on the offense to keep it stable. I mean we already have a #1 BPA receiver from last year. The guy got a year to get healthy and to learn the system. Next year Meachum should be that solid #2 receiver. And if not, then the other guys certainly did well enough to keep it stable for another year.

But the defense is horrible. Putrid. Abysmal. An embarrassment. And their current state is what generally destabilizes the offense because the offense feels like it must score a TD each and every time they are on the field.

Of the 8 teams that played this weekend, 6 of them were in the top 10 in scoring defense with 3 in the top 5. Only the Giants are out of the top 15. And they have improved their scoring defense by 9 PPG in the playoffs.

You cannot win championships in this league without solid defense, no matter what kind of offense you have. Offensive juggernauts like the 1999 Rams and the 1989 and 1994 49ers each had top 5 scoring defenses the years that they won the championship.

So when it comes to offense this offseason, my answer is absolutely not. No to receivers, no to backs, no to TE, and no to QBs. Stellar linemen are always considered because they improve the foundation of your team.

The Saints need 6 or 7 new defensive starters. More than half of our starting defensive lineup couldn't get a sniff anywhere else in this league. Our #1 corner is going to lose virtually a complete season next year.

We need standout defensive help and we need it badly. So when you've found me 2 new corners, a stud DT to complement big Hollis, 2 new LBs to go with Fujita, a pair of safeties I can trust, and a nickel guy that can prevent the big play downfield, then and only then can you talk to me about a receiver or any other skill position on offense.

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Last edited by SaintFanInATLHELL; 01-14-2008 at 11:14 AM..
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Old 01-14-2008, 12:04 PM   #8
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL View Post
The Saints do not yet have the reputation required to secure free agents such as Moss. Moss took a pay cut to go to the Pats so that he could win his elusive championship. So I think that point is moot.
Seeing how we were favorite coming into this season as legitimate Super Bowl contenders... that doesn't make any sense. Prior to the season we had as good as a chance of anyone to make it to the Superbowl.

The Saints passing offense was in the top three in passing yards, completion percentage, and attempts. Unfortunately they were also #2 in on target drops.
In bold.

If the passing offense were 26th in the league and the defense were #3, maybe we could have a different conversation. But as it stands, very little needs to be done to the receiving corps or to the offense in general.
Then you're just fooling yourself. Just because of offense was good, it doesn't mean it can't be better.


I'd be totally ticked off even if the receiver were all world. The defense sucks. It needs to be improved at all costs.
Which is understandable given how atrocious our defense is.



Absolutely. However when you defense cannot stop the explosive play (of which the Saints were #1 in the league), cannot get off the field on third down (ditto), and make insurance salesmen and rookies look like Joe Montana (I guess it's Tom Brady now), then guess what? The other team is the one that ends up with the most points.
I don't disagree at all with what you're saying.

The Saints are badly unbalanced at this point. They should only do enough work on the offense to keep it stable. I mean we already have a #1 BPA receiver from last year. The guy got a year to get healthy and to learn the system. Next year Meachum should be that solid #2 receiver. And if not, then the other guys certainly did well enough to keep it stable for another year.
Should isn't good enough... when the likes of a Roy Williams is on the market and could be had for probably a 2nd rounder, you jump on that. It's going to make our offense that much better and allow our defense to be on the sidelines longer. I hope Meachum can be that guy opposite Colston... but we have no idea what he's capable of. Draft picks are a crap shoot... Roy Williams is not.

But the defense is horrible. Putrid. Abysmal. An embarrassment. And their current state is what generally destabilizes the offense because the offense feels like it must score a TD each and every time they are on the field.

Of the 8 teams that played this weekend, 6 of them were in the top 10 in scoring defense with 3 in the top 5. Only the Giants are out of the top 15. And they have improved their scoring defense by 9 PPG in the playoffs.

You cannot win championships in this league without solid defense, no matter what kind of offense you have. Offensive juggernauts like the 1999 Rams and the 1989 and 1994 49ers each had top 5 scoring defenses the years that they won the championship.

So when it comes to offense this offseason, my answer is absolutely not. No to receivers, no to backs, no to TE, and no to QBs. Stellar linemen are always considered because they improve the foundation of your team.

The Saints need 6 or 7 new defensive starters. More than half of our starting defensive lineup couldn't get a sniff anywhere else in this league. Our #1 corner is going to lose virtually a complete season next year.

We need standout defensive help and we need it badly. So when you've found me 2 new corners, a stud DT to complement big Hollis, 2 new LBs to go with Fujita, a pair of safeties I can trust, and a nickel guy that can prevent the big play downfield, then and only then can you talk to me about a receiver or any other skill position on offense.

SFIAH
[/quote]

Pretty much agree with all of that except that last part. Getting a solid #2 WR is a big concern from my point of view... whether it's via free agency, trade, or draft pick... it is as big as a concern as every defensive position on this team. What would happen if Colston got injured?

Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.

All little common sense goes a long way.
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Old 01-14-2008, 06:19 PM   #9
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

Originally Posted by papz View Post
Seeing how we were favorite coming into this season as legitimate Super Bowl contenders... that doesn't make any sense. Prior to the season we had as good as a chance of anyone to make it to the Superbowl.
But only if our defense improved. It didn't.


(about drops...) In bold.
Drops were certainly a problem. However the guy we picked to be that complementary #2 receiver wasn't on the field.

I see the receiver issue quite simply: we've already spent a #1 pick on a receiver. Give the guy a chance to be that #2.

Then you're just fooling yourself. Just because of offense was good, it doesn't mean it can't be better.
I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the offense is quite good enough and that spending resources to make it better isn't going to improve the overall outlook of the team.

Let me flip the question: How much better will our offense be if we get a defense that actually gets them both the ball and the time to do something with it. One of the reasons that the Patriots were putting up 40-burgers this season is that their defense got off the field and gave the offense the ball back.

The offense and defense need to protect one another. The offense is good enough to handle its end of the load. The defense however...

As for being ticked off for drafting offense high in the draft...
Which is understandable given how atrocious our defense is...

I don't disagree at all with what you're saying.
At least we agree on something.

Should isn't good enough... when the likes of a Roy Williams is on the market and could be had for probably a 2nd rounder, you jump on that.
Nope. You spend that pick on a defensive starter. Houston's Demico Ryans was a #2 pick a year ago. The guy is a stud a middle linebacker.

The offense blew its high draft pick wad last year on a receiver. Get that guy ready to play.

Note that I think that Meachum will make an impact in the league. While some questioned the fact that the Saints picked him, most folks agreed that the guy could be a standout wideout in the league. He has Brees to throw him the ball. All he has to do is stay healthy, get some separation and catch it.

It's going to make our offense that much better and allow our defense to be on the sidelines longer. I hope Meachum can be that guy opposite Colston... but we have no idea what he's capable of. Draft picks are a crap shoot... Roy Williams is not.
We're going to have to give the guy a chance to prove himself. Payton redshirted him this year because he was hurt and the offense was clicking without him. Presumably the offense will click with him too.

As for keeping the ball longer, that wasn't really the problem. Between the defense's inability to get off the field on third down and explosive plays, when they were on the field, often they only got off after a score. There's nothing that the offense can do about that except not to turn the ball over.

Pretty much agree with all of that except that last part. Getting a solid #2 WR is a big concern from my point of view... whether it's via free agency, trade, or draft pick... it is as big as a concern as every defensive position on this team. What would happen if Colston got injured?
Colston was injured during this season. Did the passing attack stop? Brees throws the ball to whichever receiver is out there.

Personally I didn't have a problem with Patton as the #2 receiver. He did the job the vast majority of the time.

If there's a vet that's cheap in free agency like Patton was, then that's fine. But spending a precious draft pick to get yet another receiver? I don't think so.

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Old 01-14-2008, 07:04 PM   #10
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Re: Per Rotoworld/ Roy Williams

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL View Post
But only if our defense improved. It didn't.
We're talking about prior to the season... no one knew our defense was going to be this bad. So still, what you said about the Saints reputation makes no sense.

Drops were certainly a problem. However the guy we picked to be that complementary #2 receiver wasn't on the field.

I see the receiver issue quite simply: we've already spent a #1 pick on a receiver. Give the guy a chance to be that #2.
Agreed. But if it doesn't pan out, then what? Do you realize the lack of depth we have on offense at both receiver and tight end?



I'm not saying that. I'm saying that the offense is quite good enough and that spending resources to make it better isn't going to improve the overall outlook of the team.
Unless it's great, tweaking always can be done. Let me ask you something... say we go get Roy Williams... do you think he will make our team better overall?

Let me flip the question: How much better will our offense be if we get a defense that actually gets them both the ball and the time to do something with it. One of the reasons that the Patriots were putting up 40-burgers this season is that their defense got off the field and gave the offense the ball back.
Makes perfect sense and I don't disagree with you at all.

The offense and defense need to protect one another. The offense is good enough to handle its end of the load. The defense however...
I agree our offense is far better than our defense... it still doesn't change the fact I feel we need an upgrade at WR. Who's knows... we might go and sign these impact defensive free agents leaving us to be able to do whatever we want with our draft picks. The draft isn't the only way to build our defense.


At least we agree on something.
Actually I agree on mostly everything you've said... just not to dismiss an offensive player with our draft pick.


The offense blew its high draft pick wad last year on a receiver. Get that guy ready to play.
We sure could use him as we only have Colston to lean on.

Note that I think that Meachum will make an impact in the league. While some questioned the fact that the Saints picked him, most folks agreed that the guy could be a standout wideout in the league. He has Brees to throw him the ball. All he has to do is stay healthy, get some separation and catch it.
I hope so too.


We're going to have to give the guy a chance to prove himself. Payton redshirted him this year because he was hurt and the offense was clicking without him. Presumably the offense will click with him too.
Even when he was healthy he didn't get to sniff the field.

As for keeping the ball longer, that wasn't really the problem. Between the defense's inability to get off the field on third down and explosive plays, when they were on the field, often they only got off after a score. There's nothing that the offense can do about that except not to turn the ball over.
And by getting quality talent at WR and TE, it will continue to not be a problem.



Colston was injured during this season. Did the passing attack stop? Brees throws the ball to whichever receiver is out there.
We might as well not re-sign Colston then when he's available to leave. We could use that money and go sign more defensive players. Just go sign a bunch of 2's, 3's, and 4's and let Brees operate with that all year long.

Personally I didn't have a problem with Patton as the #2 receiver. He did the job the vast majority of the time.
I thought he was fine... but Patten is no Williams.

Nope. You spend that pick on a defensive starter. Houston's Demico Ryans was a #2 pick a year ago. The guy is a stud a middle linebacker.
If there's a vet that's cheap in free agency like Patton was, then that's fine. But spending a precious draft pick to get yet another receiver? I don't think so.

SFIAH
It's only precious if it works out... which is no guarantee. Hit or miss draft pick for ProBowl WR? I don't see how it's even close. We'll just agree to disagree.

With all that said, we don't even know if Williams is on the market. But if he was, I would at least inquire about it. He's a gamebreaker... and would instantly make our offense better. But if we chose not to, we need to go sign a solid 2 while we break Meachem into the rotation.

I understand our defense is horrible and we definately need a heavy defensive draft. But that doesn't mean we don't need to address our problems on offense. I'm fine with drafting two defensive players first... but I wouldn't mind us selecting a LB, DT, CB along with a WR either.

Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege.

All little common sense goes a long way.
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