McFadden vs Thomas

SaintFanInATLHELL · 01-15-2008, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by TheDeuce

.... But more to the point, if I had the chance between Pierre and McFadden, it would be silly not to take McFadden.

That may be a good point in isolation. But within the context of where this team is now, I certainly hope that this is simply idle speculation.

The Saints, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and probably 4th pick all need to be players that can contribute to the defense.

If all of our back are healthy, then Pierre is probably the 3rd back in the rotation. So this case means that the Saints had better not be looking to add any more backs to the rotation.

SFIAH

iceshack149 · 01-15-2008, 12:12 PM

Same topic, different player. Where's the talk of defensive players? Forget McFadden. If he is there at 10, my hope is that the Saints trade out and pick up more defensive players.

SapperSaint · 01-15-2008, 02:09 PM

I am against going with an offensive player for the first three rounds. We need STUDS and I mean STUD defensive players. LB's, Dline-man, CB's and FS's.

Would I be sick if we didn't pick up D-mac...sure I would. But the needs of the team out wieght the need for another RB (at least for now).

TheDeuce · 01-15-2008, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

That may be a good point in isolation. But within the context of where this team is now, I certainly hope that this is simply idle speculation.

The Saints, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and probably 4th pick all need to be players that can contribute to the defense.

If all of our back are healthy, then Pierre is probably the 3rd back in the rotation. So this case means that the Saints had better not be looking to add any more backs to the rotation.

SFIAH

No no no no I wasn't saying that I want the Saints to draft McFadden. I was simply arguing strongly against the argument that QBREES9 made: taking Pierre Thomas over Darren McFadden. That just seems ludicrous to me. Not factoring in salary and all that stuff, McFadden has Pro Bowl potential, Thomas doesn't.

iceshack149 · 01-15-2008, 03:25 PM

Pierre Thomas started one game this season and his stats against the Bears were pretty remarkable. 105 rush yards on 20 carries and 121 receiving yards on 12 catches with a touchdown. Granted, there is only one game to go by but in that one game Pierre Thomas showed me pro bowl potential.

SapperSaint · 01-15-2008, 03:46 PM

PT will be a good RB. He has shown me more in that one game than Reggie has in two years. I am giving Reggie one more year before I call him the worlds biggest draft bust.

mvtrucking · 01-15-2008, 07:08 PM

Originally Posted by TheDeuce

Look, I know Pierre is a fan favorite around here, but look at what you just said. You just said that you'd take a guy who has a limited ceiling and a 3rd or 4th string running back when everybody is healthy over a guy who finished second in the Heisman voting this past season. Sure, McFadden has had some legal issues over the past month, but that doesn't change the fact that he's probably the best all-around player in the country. Hell, he practically invented an entirely new offense.

Pierre can be a good back, but he will never be a great back. It's not even guaranteed that he'll make the squad next season. You're basing your argument on one game. Look at the rest of the season, the guy wasn't all that spectacular.

McFadden on the other hand has a lot of things that will prevent Pierre Thomas from ever being a great back. World-class speed, he's very very strong for a running back, good vision, and he's versatile (ie he can throw and catch the ball as well). McFadden is a game-changer, he can come in and on one play take it 80 yards for a score. If you don't believe me ask LSU, because he torched them on long runs numerous times. I just can't see Pierre ever doing that, his longest run this season was 17 yards.

I'm not really sold on Pierre Thomas being the future of the running back position. In fact, if Deuce is healthy come training camp, I'd take Deuce in a heartbeat over Pierre Thomas. But more to the point, if I had the chance between Pierre and McFadden, it would be silly not to take McFadden.

You may be right concerning PT BUT, its a fact that everytime this kid has had the chance to play be it preseason, special teams or his first start, he is a PLAYMAKER.(Look at his PS games, touchdown on ST, etc) I really believe that this kid is special. Diamonds have been found in the rough before..

TheDeuce · 01-15-2008, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by mvtrucking

You may be right concerning PT BUT, its a fact that everytime this kid has had the chance to play be it preseason, special teams or his first start, he is a PLAYMAKER.(Look at his PS games, touchdown on ST, etc) I really believe that this kid is special. Diamonds have been found in the rough before..

Please don't talk to me about how he's a playmaker because of what he did in the preseason. Preseason performances have absolutely no bearing on whether or not a player is going to be any good. You can point to the final game of the season and then you can start to say that he's going to be a good player, but please don't talk to me about the preseason.

I'll admit that Pierre had a great game against Chicago, in fact, he was the first player in Saints history to ever get 100 yds rushing and 100 yds receiving in the same game. BUT, let's not jump to conclusions because of one game. He had one good game, but if you look at the game where he got the most carries (besides the Chicago game), he rushed for a 2.7 yard average on 12 carries. I'm not saying he's not a good player, I'm just saying that maybe we should hold out on crowning him the best running back we have on the team, or better than the best running back in the draft, until we've seen him play a little more.

D24pick · 01-15-2008, 09:20 PM

Originally Posted by TheDeuce

Look, I know Pierre is a fan favorite around here, but look at what you just said. You just said that you'd take a guy who has a limited ceiling and a 3rd or 4th string running back when everybody is healthy over a guy who finished second in the Heisman voting this past season. Sure, McFadden has had some legal issues over the past month, but that doesn't change the fact that he's probably the best all-around player in the country. Hell, he practically invented an entirely new offense.

Pierre can be a good back, but he will never be a great back. It's not even guaranteed that he'll make the squad next season. You're basing your argument on one game. Look at the rest of the season, the guy wasn't all that spectacular.

McFadden on the other hand has a lot of things that will prevent Pierre Thomas from ever being a great back. World-class speed, he's very very strong for a running back, good vision, and he's versatile (ie he can throw and catch the ball as well). McFadden is a game-changer, he can come in and on one play take it 80 yards for a score. If you don't believe me ask LSU, because he torched them on long runs numerous times. I just can't see Pierre ever doing that, his longest run this season was 17 yards.

I'm not really sold on Pierre Thomas being the future of the running back position. In fact, if Deuce is healthy come training camp, I'd take Deuce in a heartbeat over Pierre Thomas. But more to the point, if I had the chance between Pierre and McFadden, it would be silly not to take McFadden.

Yes. One game.

And how many has McFadden played in the NFL exactly? That's right. None.
So lets drop the iron and go by what we know. And another thing is, Pierre was a super back in Illonois, just hugely overlooked if one didn't know. He has just as many qualities of a great back as McFadden, its just that, McFadden has more upside than Thomas

Budsdrinker · 01-15-2008, 09:36 PM

Heisman voting doesn't make you an NFL running back. We have a winner of the Heisman trophy and he hasn't figured out the NFL yet. Now I'm not saying McFadden won't be a good RB in the NFL but right now I don't think it is a position we need to look at in the first round.

01-15-2008, 11:49 AM	#11
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,774	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Originally Posted by TheDeuce .... But more to the point, if I had the chance between Pierre and McFadden, it would be silly not to take McFadden. That may be a good point in isolation. But within the context of where this team is now, I certainly hope that this is simply idle speculation. The Saints, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and probably 4th pick all need to be players that can contribute to the defense. If all of our back are healthy, then Pierre is probably the 3rd back in the rotation. So this case means that the Saints had better not be looking to add any more backs to the rotation. SFIAH

01-15-2008, 12:12 PM	#12
iceshack149 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fairbanks, AK Posts: 4,258 Blog Entries: 1	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Same topic, different player. Where's the talk of defensive players? Forget McFadden. If he is there at 10, my hope is that the Saints trade out and pick up more defensive players.

01-15-2008, 02:09 PM	#13
SapperSaint Pink Nightmare Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 3,028 Blog Entries: 7	Re: McFadden vs Thomas I am against going with an offensive player for the first three rounds. We need STUDS and I mean STUD defensive players. LB's, Dline-man, CB's and FS's. Would I be sick if we didn't pick up D-mac...sure I would. But the needs of the team out wieght the need for another RB (at least for now).

01-15-2008, 02:37 PM	#14
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL That may be a good point in isolation. But within the context of where this team is now, I certainly hope that this is simply idle speculation. The Saints, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and probably 4th pick all need to be players that can contribute to the defense. If all of our back are healthy, then Pierre is probably the 3rd back in the rotation. So this case means that the Saints had better not be looking to add any more backs to the rotation. SFIAH No no no no I wasn't saying that I want the Saints to draft McFadden. I was simply arguing strongly against the argument that QBREES9 made: taking Pierre Thomas over Darren McFadden. That just seems ludicrous to me. Not factoring in salary and all that stuff, McFadden has Pro Bowl potential, Thomas doesn't.
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928

01-15-2008, 03:25 PM	#15
iceshack149 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fairbanks, AK Posts: 4,258 Blog Entries: 1	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Pierre Thomas started one game this season and his stats against the Bears were pretty remarkable. 105 rush yards on 20 carries and 121 receiving yards on 12 catches with a touchdown. Granted, there is only one game to go by but in that one game Pierre Thomas showed me pro bowl potential.

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01-15-2008, 03:46 PM	#16
SapperSaint Pink Nightmare Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 3,028 Blog Entries: 7	Re: McFadden vs Thomas PT will be a good RB. He has shown me more in that one game than Reggie has in two years. I am giving Reggie one more year before I call him the worlds biggest draft bust.

01-15-2008, 07:08 PM	#17
mvtrucking Registered Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Monroe, La Posts: 77	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Originally Posted by TheDeuce Look, I know Pierre is a fan favorite around here, but look at what you just said. You just said that you'd take a guy who has a limited ceiling and a 3rd or 4th string running back when everybody is healthy over a guy who finished second in the Heisman voting this past season. Sure, McFadden has had some legal issues over the past month, but that doesn't change the fact that he's probably the best all-around player in the country. Hell, he practically invented an entirely new offense. Pierre can be a good back, but he will never be a great back. It's not even guaranteed that he'll make the squad next season. You're basing your argument on one game. Look at the rest of the season, the guy wasn't all that spectacular. McFadden on the other hand has a lot of things that will prevent Pierre Thomas from ever being a great back. World-class speed, he's very very strong for a running back, good vision, and he's versatile (ie he can throw and catch the ball as well). McFadden is a game-changer, he can come in and on one play take it 80 yards for a score. If you don't believe me ask LSU, because he torched them on long runs numerous times. I just can't see Pierre ever doing that, his longest run this season was 17 yards. I'm not really sold on Pierre Thomas being the future of the running back position. In fact, if Deuce is healthy come training camp, I'd take Deuce in a heartbeat over Pierre Thomas. But more to the point, if I had the chance between Pierre and McFadden, it would be silly not to take McFadden. You may be right concerning PT BUT, its a fact that everytime this kid has had the chance to play be it preseason, special teams or his first start, he is a PLAYMAKER.(Look at his PS games, touchdown on ST, etc) I really believe that this kid is special. Diamonds have been found in the rough before..

01-15-2008, 08:43 PM	#18
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Originally Posted by mvtrucking You may be right concerning PT BUT, its a fact that everytime this kid has had the chance to play be it preseason, special teams or his first start, he is a PLAYMAKER.(Look at his PS games, touchdown on ST, etc) I really believe that this kid is special. Diamonds have been found in the rough before.. Please don't talk to me about how he's a playmaker because of what he did in the preseason. Preseason performances have absolutely no bearing on whether or not a player is going to be any good. You can point to the final game of the season and then you can start to say that he's going to be a good player, but please don't talk to me about the preseason. I'll admit that Pierre had a great game against Chicago, in fact, he was the first player in Saints history to ever get 100 yds rushing and 100 yds receiving in the same game. BUT, let's not jump to conclusions because of one game. He had one good game, but if you look at the game where he got the most carries (besides the Chicago game), he rushed for a 2.7 yard average on 12 carries. I'm not saying he's not a good player, I'm just saying that maybe we should hold out on crowning him the best running back we have on the team, or better than the best running back in the draft, until we've seen him play a little more.
TheDeuce 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,928

01-15-2008, 09:20 PM	#19
D24pick 500th Post Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: New Orleans Posts: 578	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Originally Posted by TheDeuce Look, I know Pierre is a fan favorite around here, but look at what you just said. You just said that you'd take a guy who has a limited ceiling and a 3rd or 4th string running back when everybody is healthy over a guy who finished second in the Heisman voting this past season. Sure, McFadden has had some legal issues over the past month, but that doesn't change the fact that he's probably the best all-around player in the country. Hell, he practically invented an entirely new offense. Pierre can be a good back, but he will never be a great back. It's not even guaranteed that he'll make the squad next season. You're basing your argument on one game. Look at the rest of the season, the guy wasn't all that spectacular. McFadden on the other hand has a lot of things that will prevent Pierre Thomas from ever being a great back. World-class speed, he's very very strong for a running back, good vision, and he's versatile (ie he can throw and catch the ball as well). McFadden is a game-changer, he can come in and on one play take it 80 yards for a score. If you don't believe me ask LSU, because he torched them on long runs numerous times. I just can't see Pierre ever doing that, his longest run this season was 17 yards. I'm not really sold on Pierre Thomas being the future of the running back position. In fact, if Deuce is healthy come training camp, I'd take Deuce in a heartbeat over Pierre Thomas. But more to the point, if I had the chance between Pierre and McFadden, it would be silly not to take McFadden. Yes. One game. And how many has McFadden played in the NFL exactly? That's right. None. So lets drop the iron and go by what we know. And another thing is, Pierre was a super back in Illonois, just hugely overlooked if one didn't know. He has just as many qualities of a great back as McFadden, its just that, McFadden has more upside than Thomas

01-15-2008, 09:36 PM	#20
Budsdrinker A Cajun Transforming TX Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Woodlands, Texas Posts: 2,787	Re: McFadden vs Thomas Heisman voting doesn't make you an NFL running back. We have a winner of the Heisman trophy and he hasn't figured out the NFL yet. Now I'm not saying McFadden won't be a good RB in the NFL but right now I don't think it is a position we need to look at in the first round.