Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach

ScottBalot · 01-24-2008, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by saintsmissile

Congratulations Loomis. You are now turning this team into the same mold as Haslett's. Ogeron? COME ON! They guy failed in his one attempt to be a head coach, so I guess that warrants him jumping to the NFL? Uh, don't get that at all. This was a horrible, horrible move. I also don't understand not firing a pathetic DC in Gibbs only to fire our rb and cb coach. Talk about scapegoat. I remember Haslett doing the same thing. I'm beginning to think that Payton may not be the guy for us after all. If anyone needed to be canned from this season it was Gibbs and yet, nothing. Shows me he's acting much like Haslett with Venturi. I got news for you Sean Payton, if it looks and smells like shi*, then it's probably shi*. To fire ANY COACH off this team besides Gibbs, it's a huge disjustice to the fans and the players. Gibbs is the MAIN problem with our defense and it may, just like Haslett, ultimately cost Payton his job. Loyalty is one thing, the unemployment line is another. If I were Payton, I'd start refreshing my resume.

you want Gibbs fired, yet on another thread you stated that the defense needs help at every position. So is it Gibbs' fault he has no talent, or is it that the defense is talented, but not well coached?

papz · 01-24-2008, 05:54 PM

Okay smart guy, if he was SUCH A GREAT DL coach, how were his D Lines at Ole Miss? Yeah right, when he didn't have the SC talent, he didn't have the same results. My arguement is weak? Sure, whatever you say, he BOMBED as a head coach. He just didn't "not do well" he NEVER even had a .500 record! None of his defenses were even CLOSE to being ranked high in the SEC.

I believe I already answered that even before you asked the question.

About my McFadden comment, I still stand by it. I will post facts to boast that it a second.

Any day now.

Second, you must be some kind of mental misfit to even mention Tomlin! That PROVES my point. Tomlin was a DC in the NFL for more than just a season or two before he got his chance. He also put his skins on the wall in the NFL. Please tell me where Ogeron has done this? Do you REALLY think that the D Lines at SC were so successful because of Ogeron? You make me laugh. Has SC missed a beat with Ogeron gone? Yeah right and my arguement is weak.

Obviously you have hard time reading and understanding things.

So umm... can you answer that question I posed?

Mike Tomlin worked his way from being a graduate assistant at Memphis to becoming a head coach for the Pittsburg Steelers. What qualified him making that jump from being a college assistant to becoming NFL position's coach?

Look carefully as I bolded the most important part in there.
Read it slowly first... you get my point yet?

Probably not.

papz · 01-24-2008, 05:58 PM

Oh man you're just digging yourself in a deeper hole... you should just stop and pretend this thread never happened.

Budsdrinker · 01-24-2008, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by saintsmissile

Weak? Give me ONE example of how he has established himself ON THE NFL level to warrant a job with the Saints? Okay smart guy, if he was SUCH A GREAT DL coach, how were his D Lines at Ole Miss? Yeah right, when he didn't have the SC talent, he didn't have the same results. My arguement is weak? Sure, whatever you say, he BOMBED as a head coach. He just didn't "not do well" he NEVER even had a .500 record! None of his defenses were even CLOSE to being ranked high in the SEC. About my McFadden comment, I still stand by it. I will post facts to boast that it a second. Second, you must be some kind of mental misfit to even mention Tomlin! That PROVES my point. Tomlin was a DC in the NFL for more than just a season or two before he got his chance. He also put his skins on the wall in the NFL. Please tell me where Ogeron has done this? Do you REALLY think that the D Lines at SC were so successful because of Ogeron? You make me laugh. Has SC missed a beat with Ogeron gone? Yeah right and my arguement is weak.

Ole Miss DL Greg Hardy led the SEC in sacks with 10 and had 18.5 tackles for losses. Another DL Peria Jerry had 3.5 sacks and 14 tackles for losses. So I would say the DL was pretty good. Did Orgreon have something to do with their play? I would have to say yes.

Budsdrinker · 01-24-2008, 06:18 PM

Again, he is hired to coach the DL not head coach. And it looks like the players on the DLine play well under his coaching everywhere he has been.
Just look outside the purple and gold box once in a while!!

ScottBalot · 01-24-2008, 06:51 PM

Originally Posted by saintsmissile

I'm sorry guy. I guess to have a bad defense you can only have

A) bad coaching OR
B) bad players

So, if we wen't with your reasoning, if we fired Gibbs, we just keep the status quo of players we have now and POOF! We'd be a great defense. OR if we bring in new players and keep Gibbs, POOF! We'd be a great defense! It's obvious we won't dump idiot Gibbs, so at least if you increase the talent level you MIGHT improve enough to be competitive. Right now, our D isn't even close to that.
You ask me, we need a NEW DC AND a NEW players. Complete overhaul. Keep Fujita, McKenzie, Smith, Grant as starters, keep Shanle, Simineau, Craft, Clancy, Harper etc as BACKUPS and go out and draft and bring in FA STARTERS!

please explain to me how you can unequivocally dismiss Gibbs if he doesn't have any talent to work with? Let's see him work with some players on defense first, and then if he bombs, by all means it will be time for a change.

papz · 01-24-2008, 07:16 PM

Give me ONE example of how he has established himself ON THE NFL level to warrant a job with the Saints?

Prior to getting an job with the Tampa Bay Bucs...

Give me ONE example of how Mike Tomlin established himself on the NFL level to warrant a job with the Bucs?

Prior to joining Tampa Bay's staff, Tomlin served two seasons as the defensive backs coach at the University of Cincinnati (1999-00). He took over a secondary unit there that ranked 111th in the nation in pass defense in 1998 and helped them improve to 61st overall in his first season in '99. Under Tomlin's direction in 2000, the Bearcats ranked eight in the nation in INTs as well as fourth nationally in total turnovers.

You mentioned all those nice stats and rankings. It might have something to do with their talent over his ability to coach. He had ZERO NFL experience, yet you thought it qualified him to come on board and be a coach in the NFL.

ROFL it's like taking candy from a baby. You got what I just did?

Probably not.

Weak.

andersen · 01-24-2008, 09:34 PM

I was hoping this was the tip of the iceberg (on defensive coaching changes), but the more I thought about it, if they are going to replace Gibbs, they wouldn't make this change now. They would wait to after the new DC was installed to get his own men.
Oh boy, I hope we see LB coach next.

hagan714 · 01-24-2008, 11:11 PM

Just because he is coming from college does not mean a thing. All coaches came from the college rankings. I am willing to see what he can do. Look it can not get any worse. Well much worse. We are down there in the rankings.

dasaints26 · 01-24-2008, 11:30 PM

I just got 2 points to make.
1) regarding our old d-line coach how many interesting stats and team accomplishments can you recall from his coaching history(without looking them up first). Do you know how many sacks his unit produced during his 2nd year as a d-line coach? What made him earn his 1st job in the NFL? What were his qualifications to justify hiring him as the Saints d-line coach?
2)What was the reason Ole Miss had a losing record? Was it the poor play of the d-line or the o-line? Bad qb play or bad lb play? The Saints had a losing record it must have been the center's fault(love to bring that up). Just because he had a losing record does not mean he cant still be a positional coach does it? Reminds me of that great offense from the Dolphins this year. Their head coach gets fired then gets an OC job.

01-24-2008, 05:45 PM	#11
ScottBalot Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 87	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Originally Posted by saintsmissile Congratulations Loomis. You are now turning this team into the same mold as Haslett's. Ogeron? COME ON! They guy failed in his one attempt to be a head coach, so I guess that warrants him jumping to the NFL? Uh, don't get that at all. This was a horrible, horrible move. I also don't understand not firing a pathetic DC in Gibbs only to fire our rb and cb coach. Talk about scapegoat. I remember Haslett doing the same thing. I'm beginning to think that Payton may not be the guy for us after all. If anyone needed to be canned from this season it was Gibbs and yet, nothing. Shows me he's acting much like Haslett with Venturi. I got news for you Sean Payton, if it looks and smells like shi, then it's probably shi. To fire ANY COACH off this team besides Gibbs, it's a huge disjustice to the fans and the players. Gibbs is the MAIN problem with our defense and it may, just like Haslett, ultimately cost Payton his job. Loyalty is one thing, the unemployment line is another. If I were Payton, I'd start refreshing my resume. you want Gibbs fired, yet on another thread you stated that the defense needs help at every position. So is it Gibbs' fault he has no talent, or is it that the defense is talented, but not well coached?
ScottBalot Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 87

01-24-2008, 05:54 PM	#12
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,754	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Okay smart guy, if he was SUCH A GREAT DL coach, how were his D Lines at Ole Miss? Yeah right, when he didn't have the SC talent, he didn't have the same results. My arguement is weak? Sure, whatever you say, he BOMBED as a head coach. He just didn't "not do well" he NEVER even had a .500 record! None of his defenses were even CLOSE to being ranked high in the SEC. I believe I already answered that even before you asked the question. About my McFadden comment, I still stand by it. I will post facts to boast that it a second. Any day now. Second, you must be some kind of mental misfit to even mention Tomlin! That PROVES my point. Tomlin was a DC in the NFL for more than just a season or two before he got his chance. He also put his skins on the wall in the NFL. Please tell me where Ogeron has done this? Do you REALLY think that the D Lines at SC were so successful because of Ogeron? You make me laugh. Has SC missed a beat with Ogeron gone? Yeah right and my arguement is weak. Obviously you have hard time reading and understanding things. So umm... can you answer that question I posed? Mike Tomlin worked his way from being a graduate assistant at Memphis to becoming a head coach for the Pittsburg Steelers. What qualified him making that jump from being a college assistant to becoming NFL position's coach? Look carefully as I bolded the most important part in there. Read it slowly first... you get my point yet? Probably not.

01-24-2008, 05:58 PM	#13
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,754	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Oh man you're just digging yourself in a deeper hole... you should just stop and pretend this thread never happened.

01-24-2008, 06:02 PM	#14
Budsdrinker A Cajun Transforming TX Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Woodlands, Texas Posts: 2,787	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Originally Posted by saintsmissile Weak? Give me ONE example of how he has established himself ON THE NFL level to warrant a job with the Saints? Okay smart guy, if he was SUCH A GREAT DL coach, how were his D Lines at Ole Miss? Yeah right, when he didn't have the SC talent, he didn't have the same results. My arguement is weak? Sure, whatever you say, he BOMBED as a head coach. He just didn't "not do well" he NEVER even had a .500 record! None of his defenses were even CLOSE to being ranked high in the SEC. About my McFadden comment, I still stand by it. I will post facts to boast that it a second. Second, you must be some kind of mental misfit to even mention Tomlin! That PROVES my point. Tomlin was a DC in the NFL for more than just a season or two before he got his chance. He also put his skins on the wall in the NFL. Please tell me where Ogeron has done this? Do you REALLY think that the D Lines at SC were so successful because of Ogeron? You make me laugh. Has SC missed a beat with Ogeron gone? Yeah right and my arguement is weak. Ole Miss DL Greg Hardy led the SEC in sacks with 10 and had 18.5 tackles for losses. Another DL Peria Jerry had 3.5 sacks and 14 tackles for losses. So I would say the DL was pretty good. Did Orgreon have something to do with their play? I would have to say yes.

01-24-2008, 06:18 PM	#15
Budsdrinker A Cajun Transforming TX Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Woodlands, Texas Posts: 2,787	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Again, he is hired to coach the DL not head coach. And it looks like the players on the DLine play well under his coaching everywhere he has been. Just look outside the purple and gold box once in a while!!

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01-24-2008, 06:51 PM	#16
ScottBalot Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 87	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Originally Posted by saintsmissile I'm sorry guy. I guess to have a bad defense you can only have A) bad coaching OR B) bad players So, if we wen't with your reasoning, if we fired Gibbs, we just keep the status quo of players we have now and POOF! We'd be a great defense. OR if we bring in new players and keep Gibbs, POOF! We'd be a great defense! It's obvious we won't dump idiot Gibbs, so at least if you increase the talent level you MIGHT improve enough to be competitive. Right now, our D isn't even close to that. You ask me, we need a NEW DC AND a NEW players. Complete overhaul. Keep Fujita, McKenzie, Smith, Grant as starters, keep Shanle, Simineau, Craft, Clancy, Harper etc as BACKUPS and go out and draft and bring in FA STARTERS! please explain to me how you can unequivocally dismiss Gibbs if he doesn't have any talent to work with? Let's see him work with some players on defense first, and then if he bombs, by all means it will be time for a change.
ScottBalot Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 87

01-24-2008, 07:16 PM	#17
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,754	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Give me ONE example of how he has established himself ON THE NFL level to warrant a job with the Saints? Prior to getting an job with the Tampa Bay Bucs... Give me ONE example of how Mike Tomlin established himself on the NFL level to warrant a job with the Bucs? Prior to joining Tampa Bay's staff, Tomlin served two seasons as the defensive backs coach at the University of Cincinnati (1999-00). He took over a secondary unit there that ranked 111th in the nation in pass defense in 1998 and helped them improve to 61st overall in his first season in '99. Under Tomlin's direction in 2000, the Bearcats ranked eight in the nation in INTs as well as fourth nationally in total turnovers. You mentioned all those nice stats and rankings. It might have something to do with their talent over his ability to coach. He had ZERO NFL experience, yet you thought it qualified him to come on board and be a coach in the NFL. ROFL it's like taking candy from a baby. You got what I just did? Probably not. Weak.

01-24-2008, 09:34 PM	#18
andersen With an "E" Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Madisonville, LA Posts: 429	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach I was hoping this was the tip of the iceberg (on defensive coaching changes), but the more I thought about it, if they are going to replace Gibbs, they wouldn't make this change now. They would wait to after the new DC was installed to get his own men. Oh boy, I hope we see LB coach next.

01-24-2008, 11:11 PM	#19
hagan714 LB Mentallity Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 15,870 Blog Entries: 68	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach Just because he is coming from college does not mean a thing. All coaches came from the college rankings. I am willing to see what he can do. Look it can not get any worse. Well much worse. We are down there in the rankings.

01-24-2008, 11:30 PM	#20
dasaints26 100th Post Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 167	Re: Saints hire Orgeron as defensive line coach I just got 2 points to make. 1) regarding our old d-line coach how many interesting stats and team accomplishments can you recall from his coaching history(without looking them up first). Do you know how many sacks his unit produced during his 2nd year as a d-line coach? What made him earn his 1st job in the NFL? What were his qualifications to justify hiring him as the Saints d-line coach? 2)What was the reason Ole Miss had a losing record? Was it the poor play of the d-line or the o-line? Bad qb play or bad lb play? The Saints had a losing record it must have been the center's fault(love to bring that up). Just because he had a losing record does not mean he cant still be a positional coach does it? Reminds me of that great offense from the Dolphins this year. Their head coach gets fired then gets an OC job.
dasaints26 100th Post Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 167