The "Fire McMahon" Thread

MatthewT · 12-06-2010, 08:28 AM

Glad I am not the only one who noticed how freaking horrible special teams was yesterday. The field position Cincinnati had throughout the game was a complete joke. No wonder the Saints almost lost the game, if the Bengals weren't so mistake prone the outcome would have been different...

papz · 12-06-2010, 08:35 AM

Been calling for a new special teams coach for years. Bring back Bobby April.

TheKillerBs · 12-06-2010, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by papz

Been calling for a new special teams coach for years. Bring back Bobby April.

Hell yes!

MatthewT · 12-06-2010, 09:52 AM

At least we do know Sean Payton isn't afraid of releasing a member of his staff if necessary. It showed me a lot when he released his buddy Gary Gibbs. Not many head coaches have it in them to make difficult decisions. I would assume based on what we have recently witnessed, very safe to assume at the very least the Saints will be looking for an upgrade after the season.

TheOak · 12-06-2010, 10:30 AM

I am digging to find one of the most important stats to me in regards to Special teams.

Opponent starting yard line after a kick off. It seems to me for some reason our opponents usually start their offensive series inside their 30-40 yard lines.

I can find return yards on KO's but that does not tell me much except except how far they can run... If they average 25 yds but are starting in the EndZone, that is not too bad (25 yard line), However if they average 15 yards per return but start from the 20 then that puts them inside the 35 yard line.

After watching a few games this weekend i did notice a trend to kick it short and make the receiver try to catch it on the bouncing roll (long squib)... This is a nifty ploy except our kick off team is so slow they are rarely with in the 25 yard line to try and get the ball back.

TheOak · 12-06-2010, 10:48 AM

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | 2010 SPECIAL TEAMS RATINGS

We are ranked 24th in Special teams.

darstep · 12-06-2010, 10:52 AM

Teams that have a real chance at the title would eat us alive starting from their own 40 on every possession. We have got to improve our starting position stats if we hope to compete against elite teams. The good teams won't shoot themselves in the foot or squander opportunities to cut off our circulation.

Rugby Saint II · 12-06-2010, 11:30 AM

Payton is almost loyal to a fault, however McMahon needs to get his resume together.

SaintsBro · 12-06-2010, 11:54 AM

Oh man, hot button issue with me...I have been saying all this stuff for a long time...I think people kind of overlooked how bad the special teams were last year, because there was so much smoke and fireworks/excitement with the offense and the defensive takeaways. And the onside kick in the Super Bowl kind of created this "myth" that the Saints were as awesome on special teams as they were in offense and defense....teams have figured out it's just not true.

In fact it very nearly cost us TWICE yesterday in the final seconds. Even after the 12 man penalty, that last Bengal kick return was nearly broken, he went out to what, the 45 or something? If the Bungles hadn't been so incompetent, it would have been VERY possible for them to get a few more yards and then a Hail Mary into the end zone for a TD, that would have killed us with no time left to get the ball back. A playoff caliber team like the Falcons or Packers, they are gonna MAKE that play against us, and it won't be pretty. We just saw what Weems can do to change a game's momentum, against Tampa Bay last night. If we give the ball to the Falcons or Ravens on their 40 every time, or give up an easy TD like that, they will eat our lunch, all day long.

But remember -- right before the playoff run last year, after the Tampa Bay loss, Sean Payton said he was going to personally get involved and make adjustments on special teams. Which included getting more starters involved, and I happen to think he also went in and tweaked the x's and o's as well. And what happened? Against Arizona, Bush finally brought one back to the house for the first time in a long time; Hartley was money all through the post-season; and Pierre Thomas stepped in for an injured Roby and made a crucial kick 40 yard return in overtime that gave us good field position against the Vikes.

So bottom line, it's time for Payton to step in and take control of the special teams situation NOW, before the playoffs. If he does, I will not be nearly as worried about it -- I actually have faith in him as a coach, unlike McMahon.

44Champs · 12-06-2010, 12:04 PM

I'm glad someone finally called him out. The dude needs to go!

12-06-2010, 08:37 AM	#13
TheKillerBs Thread Killer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hammond, LA Posts: 366	Originally Posted by papz Been calling for a new special teams coach for years. Bring back Bobby April. Hell yes!

12-06-2010, 10:30 AM	#15
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,026	I am digging to find one of the most important stats to me in regards to Special teams. Opponent starting yard line after a kick off. It seems to me for some reason our opponents usually start their offensive series inside their 30-40 yard lines. I can find return yards on KO's but that does not tell me much except except how far they can run... If they average 25 yds but are starting in the EndZone, that is not too bad (25 yard line), However if they average 15 yards per return but start from the 20 then that puts them inside the 35 yard line. After watching a few games this weekend i did notice a trend to kick it short and make the receiver try to catch it on the bouncing roll (long squib)... This is a nifty ploy except our kick off team is so slow they are rarely with in the 25 yard line to try and get the ball back.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

12-06-2010, 12:04 PM	#20
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589	I'm glad someone finally called him out. The dude needs to go!
44Champs Site Donor Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,589

12-06-2010, 08:28 AM	#11
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	Glad I am not the only one who noticed how freaking horrible special teams was yesterday. The field position Cincinnati had throughout the game was a complete joke. No wonder the Saints almost lost the game, if the Bengals weren't so mistake prone the outcome would have been different...

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12-06-2010, 08:35 AM	#12
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,744	Been calling for a new special teams coach for years. Bring back Bobby April.

12-06-2010, 09:52 AM	#14
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	At least we do know Sean Payton isn't afraid of releasing a member of his staff if necessary. It showed me a lot when he released his buddy Gary Gibbs. Not many head coaches have it in them to make difficult decisions. I would assume based on what we have recently witnessed, very safe to assume at the very least the Saints will be looking for an upgrade after the season.

12-06-2010, 10:48 AM	#16
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,026	FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis \| 2010 SPECIAL TEAMS RATINGS We are ranked 24th in Special teams.

12-06-2010, 10:52 AM	#17
darstep SaintSince67 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: PortCity Posts: 2,044	Teams that have a real chance at the title would eat us alive starting from their own 40 on every possession. We have got to improve our starting position stats if we hope to compete against elite teams. The good teams won't shoot themselves in the foot or squander opportunities to cut off our circulation.

12-06-2010, 11:30 AM	#18
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,052	Payton is almost loyal to a fault, however McMahon needs to get his resume together.

12-06-2010, 11:54 AM	#19
SaintsBro Site Donor Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: in line with my ridiculous CLEAR PLASTIC BAG Posts: 3,650 Blog Entries: 3	Oh man, hot button issue with me...I have been saying all this stuff for a long time...I think people kind of overlooked how bad the special teams were last year, because there was so much smoke and fireworks/excitement with the offense and the defensive takeaways. And the onside kick in the Super Bowl kind of created this "myth" that the Saints were as awesome on special teams as they were in offense and defense....teams have figured out it's just not true. In fact it very nearly cost us TWICE yesterday in the final seconds. Even after the 12 man penalty, that last Bengal kick return was nearly broken, he went out to what, the 45 or something? If the Bungles hadn't been so incompetent, it would have been VERY possible for them to get a few more yards and then a Hail Mary into the end zone for a TD, that would have killed us with no time left to get the ball back. A playoff caliber team like the Falcons or Packers, they are gonna MAKE that play against us, and it won't be pretty. We just saw what Weems can do to change a game's momentum, against Tampa Bay last night. If we give the ball to the Falcons or Ravens on their 40 every time, or give up an easy TD like that, they will eat our lunch, all day long. But remember -- right before the playoff run last year, after the Tampa Bay loss, Sean Payton said he was going to personally get involved and make adjustments on special teams. Which included getting more starters involved, and I happen to think he also went in and tweaked the x's and o's as well. And what happened? Against Arizona, Bush finally brought one back to the house for the first time in a long time; Hartley was money all through the post-season; and Pierre Thomas stepped in for an injured Roby and made a crucial kick 40 yard return in overtime that gave us good field position against the Vikes. So bottom line, it's time for Payton to step in and take control of the special teams situation NOW, before the playoffs. If he does, I will not be nearly as worried about it -- I actually have faith in him as a coach, unlike McMahon.