One thing I think a lot of fans are missing in regards to salary cap and signing our FA's

The Dude · 02-01-2012, 01:58 PM

We don't have a first round pick. That in itself will free up a bunch of money. I think Loomis will find a way to creatively sign the big three and add some GOOD talent on defense. In Loomis I trust.

SapperSaint · 02-01-2012, 02:03 PM

I think whatever happens in will be in the best interest of the team. I know players want to get paid but I would think that a competitive spirit would come into play. Forget loyalty to city, fans and team. None of that pays the bills. I would think that a player would want to be on a team that gives him the best place to shine as a player (HOF reasons) and a place where he will win a championship(s).

Or is my thinking way out in left field?

AlaskaSaints · 02-01-2012, 02:06 PM

Without personal glory it's all just a job + bone-jarring hits.

Spot-on, Sapper.

Alaska

Danno · 02-01-2012, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by The Dude

We don't have a first round pick. That in itself will free up a bunch of money. I think Loomis will find a way to creatively sign the big three and add some GOOD talent on defense. In Loomis I trust.

A late 1st round pick is just over league minimum now.

Ingram only counted for $472,000 against the cap in 2011.

Supertek · 02-01-2012, 04:46 PM

That pick is not a lot of money as stated by Danno. We need to let go of quite a few of our defensive players and go out and get some proven defenders across the board all phases of our defense needs help and an idenity. Everyone puts up big numbers against us. Tired of hearing we work with what we got crap is plain BS. The only way we can afford to do that is try and trade or just do not resign these guys period and spend the money somewhere else. Ellis for one needs to go,Rogers needs to go, Harper needs a position change or he needs to go, Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons). He is on the way out. Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety. Consider letting Smith go or trade. Has he really produced like a first round pick? Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same.

FinSaint · 02-01-2012, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by Supertek

That pick is not a lot of money as stated by Danno. We need to let go of quite a few of our defensive players and go out and get some proven defenders across the board all phases of our defense needs help and an idenity. Everyone puts up big numbers against us. Tired of hearing we work with what we got crap is plain BS. The only way we can afford to do that is try and trade or just do not resign these guys period and spend the money somewhere else. Ellis for one needs to go,Rogers needs to go, Harper needs a position change or he needs to go, Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons). He is on the way out. Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety. Consider letting Smith go or trade. Has he really produced like a first round pick? Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same.

Like Danno stated in another thread, it's not like the FO can just tear up contracts and send guys who have not performed up to their salaries packing.

It would be fairly expensive to release some of these guys with big contracts, and even more so if they can't find another team to play for. Ellis for example is someone the Saints would have much difficulty in trading to another team, and with only 1 more year left in his contract - it might be economically sound to just have him play out that last year and hope that he will have a career year in a contract year.

Smith and Vilma are different cases entirely, because they both have 2 years remaining on their contracts (since Smith's last year is voidable), so if the FO can't find a way to restructure their deals - they might just have to bite the bullet and release them.

And mind you, I'm not nearly as confident as many here on these boards are that Vilma is done. It all depends on how he'll rehab from his injuries/surgeries, and in the best case scenario he might live up to his big contract for those remaining two years. It's just too early to say, and we don't have the information needed to make an informed estimation about his future potential or fit in what Spags wants to do going forward.

halloween 65 · 02-01-2012, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by Supertek

That pick is not a lot of money as stated by Danno. We need to let go of quite a few of our defensive players and go out and get some proven defenders across the board all phases of our defense needs help and an idenity. Everyone puts up big numbers against us. Tired of hearing we work with what we got crap is plain BS. The only way we can afford to do that is try and trade or just do not resign these guys period and spend the money somewhere else. Ellis for one needs to go,Rogers needs to go, Harper needs a position change or he needs to go, Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons). He is on the way out. Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety. Consider letting Smith go or trade. Has he really produced like a first round pick? Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same.

I would give Jordan a pass, that was his first year. Harper hopefully fits in the new DC's scheme, Jenkins should do better in this scheme, Smith either takes back-up money or he can go, Rodgers will be gone, and Vilma and Ellis should be, way to much money for their pi$$ poor production. I say Jenkins should do better but at the same time he is my wildcard out of everyone, although I want give him a pass if he plays that bad this year, he is not a corner, to slow.

Danno · 02-02-2012, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by Supertek

Ellis for one needs to go,
Rogers needs to go,
Harper needs a position change or he needs to go,
Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons).
Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety.
Consider letting Smith go or trade.
Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same.

I like the outside the box thinking, but I disagree completely with every single one of them.

Mardigras9 · 02-02-2012, 09:54 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

I like the outside the box thinking, but I disagree completely with every single one of them.

I disagree with all but the old linebacker point. I think it is probably time to revamp at MLB.

Danno · 02-02-2012, 10:25 AM

Originally Posted by Mardigras9

I disagree with all but the old linebacker point. I think it is probably time to revamp at MLB.

IMO that totally depends on the health of Vilma.

If he's recovered, he's a keeper and he's our best LB.

If he's still too hurt to play at 100% then yeah, we need to start looking elsewhere.

02-01-2012, 01:58 PM	#1
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048	One thing I think a lot of fans are missing in regards to salary cap and signing our FA's We don't have a first round pick. That in itself will free up a bunch of money. I think Loomis will find a way to creatively sign the big three and add some GOOD talent on defense. In Loomis I trust. B_Dub_Saint and st thomas like this.
The Dude 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 9,048

02-01-2012, 02:03 PM	#2
SapperSaint Pink Nightmare Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 3,028 Blog Entries: 7	I think whatever happens in will be in the best interest of the team. I know players want to get paid but I would think that a competitive spirit would come into play. Forget loyalty to city, fans and team. None of that pays the bills. I would think that a player would want to be on a team that gives him the best place to shine as a player (HOF reasons) and a place where he will win a championship(s). Or is my thinking way out in left field? Halo, UK_WhoDat, AlaskaSaints and 1 others like this.

02-01-2012, 03:01 PM	#4
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,720	Originally Posted by The Dude We don't have a first round pick. That in itself will free up a bunch of money. I think Loomis will find a way to creatively sign the big three and add some GOOD talent on defense. In Loomis I trust. A late 1st round pick is just over league minimum now. Ingram only counted for $472,000 against the cap in 2011. FinSaint likes this.

02-01-2012, 06:59 PM	#6
FinSaint Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Finland... formerly Southern Virginia Posts: 4,961	Originally Posted by Supertek That pick is not a lot of money as stated by Danno. We need to let go of quite a few of our defensive players and go out and get some proven defenders across the board all phases of our defense needs help and an idenity. Everyone puts up big numbers against us. Tired of hearing we work with what we got crap is plain BS. The only way we can afford to do that is try and trade or just do not resign these guys period and spend the money somewhere else. Ellis for one needs to go,Rogers needs to go, Harper needs a position change or he needs to go, Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons). He is on the way out. Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety. Consider letting Smith go or trade. Has he really produced like a first round pick? Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same. Like Danno stated in another thread, it's not like the FO can just tear up contracts and send guys who have not performed up to their salaries packing. It would be fairly expensive to release some of these guys with big contracts, and even more so if they can't find another team to play for. Ellis for example is someone the Saints would have much difficulty in trading to another team, and with only 1 more year left in his contract - it might be economically sound to just have him play out that last year and hope that he will have a career year in a contract year. Smith and Vilma are different cases entirely, because they both have 2 years remaining on their contracts (since Smith's last year is voidable), so if the FO can't find a way to restructure their deals - they might just have to bite the bullet and release them. And mind you, I'm not nearly as confident as many here on these boards are that Vilma is done. It all depends on how he'll rehab from his injuries/surgeries, and in the best case scenario he might live up to his big contract for those remaining two years. It's just too early to say, and we don't have the information needed to make an informed estimation about his future potential or fit in what Spags wants to do going forward.
	"I'm not bashing people, I'm bashing their opinions because in my opinion their opinion is wrong" - Danno

02-01-2012, 07:09 PM	#7
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Originally Posted by Supertek That pick is not a lot of money as stated by Danno. We need to let go of quite a few of our defensive players and go out and get some proven defenders across the board all phases of our defense needs help and an idenity. Everyone puts up big numbers against us. Tired of hearing we work with what we got crap is plain BS. The only way we can afford to do that is try and trade or just do not resign these guys period and spend the money somewhere else. Ellis for one needs to go,Rogers needs to go, Harper needs a position change or he needs to go, Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons). He is on the way out. Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety. Consider letting Smith go or trade. Has he really produced like a first round pick? Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same. I would give Jordan a pass, that was his first year. Harper hopefully fits in the new DC's scheme, Jenkins should do better in this scheme, Smith either takes back-up money or he can go, Rodgers will be gone, and Vilma and Ellis should be, way to much money for their pi$$ poor production. I say Jenkins should do better but at the same time he is my wildcard out of everyone, although I want give him a pass if he plays that bad this year, he is not a corner, to slow.

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02-01-2012, 02:06 PM	#3
AlaskaSaints 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Anchorage, AK Posts: 2,484 Blog Entries: 2	Without personal glory it's all just a job + bone-jarring hits. Spot-on, Sapper. Alaska

02-01-2012, 04:46 PM	#5
Supertek 500th Post Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Harvey La. Posts: 611	That pick is not a lot of money as stated by Danno. We need to let go of quite a few of our defensive players and go out and get some proven defenders across the board all phases of our defense needs help and an idenity. Everyone puts up big numbers against us. Tired of hearing we work with what we got crap is plain BS. The only way we can afford to do that is try and trade or just do not resign these guys period and spend the money somewhere else. Ellis for one needs to go,Rogers needs to go, Harper needs a position change or he needs to go, Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons). He is on the way out. Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety. Consider letting Smith go or trade. Has he really produced like a first round pick? Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same.

02-02-2012, 09:28 AM	#8
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,720	Originally Posted by Supertek Ellis for one needs to go, Rogers needs to go, Harper needs a position change or he needs to go, Our best linebacker needs to go (Bad knees and age has slowed him down the last two seasons). Move Jenkins to corner he is not a free safety. Consider letting Smith go or trade. Jordan is a maybe or wanabe and there are others I failed to mention. Face it we need a major overhaul here or it will be more of the same. I like the outside the box thinking, but I disagree completely with every single one of them.

02-02-2012, 09:54 AM	#9
Mardigras9 Site Donor 2015 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Land Mass between LA and AL Posts: 4,375	Originally Posted by Danno I like the outside the box thinking, but I disagree completely with every single one of them. I disagree with all but the old linebacker point. I think it is probably time to revamp at MLB.

02-02-2012, 10:25 AM	#10
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,720	Originally Posted by Mardigras9 I disagree with all but the old linebacker point. I think it is probably time to revamp at MLB. IMO that totally depends on the health of Vilma. If he's recovered, he's a keeper and he's our best LB. If he's still too hurt to play at 100% then yeah, we need to start looking elsewhere.

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