Wow..I am going to say this the best way I can trying not to sound like I am insulting you.

You can't see the difference between trying to intentionally hurt someone and someone getting hurt from a legal play/hit? You are the reason Godell still has fans.

When you can prove the intent, let me know.

You need to stay away from analogies, and watch 12 Angry Men.

... anyway...

Football players hit each other as hard as they can. The rules of the game allow for this. When you hit someone as hard as you can, there is a chance the other guy is going to get hurt in some way: plain shaken from the impact, or get his bell rung, get the wind knocked out of him, bruise a muscle or a bone, to breaking a bone, or snapping a tendon, etc etc etc. This occurs every week in the NFL. On every game. That there may be an extra $1,000 dlls for someone who makes 2 mil a year and during the course of legal play knocked the wind out of someone else, or rang someone else's bell, that doesn't make it that the player is out to purposely maim someone with the intention to receive what amounts to $10 for you and me.

Paying to injure as Goodell initially defined it was that the Saints intentionally set out to injure players.

If you would take the time to pull your head out of your ass you would realize that the definition of a "cartoff" by everyone involved is a player that missed a play due to a hard hit. Paying to injure means trying to injure a player, not trying to hurt a player. Every time a defensive player hits the field his job is to HURT the opponent. If the HURT he puts on that opponent takes him out of the game for a play or more, so much the better. I know you are much smarter than you put on here and know the difference.

So Radical, what is your reply to this? You can't have one unless you continue with your delusional belief that the Saints are horrible monsters that deserve ultimate admonition. You chose to come over here to our site and continue the unfounded and illogical rhetoric that you have spewed on your own site about this farce. Now it is your turn to face the music. I have had the truth behind my defense, but now you have to defend your stand with nothing of substance.

Have at it big man.

There's no way to prove intent, but if you're paying for injuries, which is what paying for cart-offs is, then you're encouraging it.
That's the whole point of it. The Saints encouraged players to cause injury via payment, hence the discipline.

I guess you don't have an actual response, other than regurgitate Goodell's position. Fine.

What's there to argue? If the guy who was in charge of it all is admitting to it, what more needs to be said. So far, I've been given nothing but semantics games. You got a guy telling his players to go take out another player's ACL, people paying money for knocking players out of the game, etc.

The insanity of some of the stuff I've read from Saints fans since the start sounds about like the crap I was reading when the dog fighting case broke with Vick. It was all a big conspiracy theory, etc.

Answer me this:

Do you think Mike Nolan coaches his defense to hit offensive players as hard as they can? Or do you think he tells them "don't hit them as hard as you can because you may hurt someone"?

And about the Williams speech: a lot has been made about that speech, and how Williams instructed his players to tear Michael Crabtree's ACL, kill Frank Gore's head and the body will die, etc etc etc Ok.. well, Crabtree's ACL was fine and dandy after the game. So was Frank Gore's head. If the Saints actually wanted to tear Crabtree's ACL, they could've. Look how easily the Jets hurt Reggie and Cushing in back to back games, and they even said they were going to do it (dotting players, putting hot sauce on players).

Off course, then some things come out, like how the Chiefs have "kill the head and the body will die" painted on a wall. The very NFLN had a segment about the Chiefs that brought this to light. They also ran a promo for their Sounds of the Game show where a 49er coach is telling his linemen "knock the piss out of him" (hmm wonder what that means)... I remember Mike Tomlin screaming at his defense "tear his f*ing head off" during a game I was watching (a very specific body part too)... and it makes you wonder, what do other teams say during their defensive meetings? Wouldn't it be interesting to hear the audio of the other 31 teams during a defensive meeting? What do you think they say or do?

And you didn't say anything regardingt Mike Smith's comments and how he coaches his players to spear defenseless WRs. No comment? Are you agreeing Mike Smith coaches his players to intentionally injure players?

Nothing wrong with telling your guys to hit offensive players as hard as you can.

Falcons coach Mike Smith said after the game that he believed it was a legal hit and "that's the way we teach it."

"My opinion didn't change," he said Monday before the NFL made its ruling.

Nothing wrong with telling your guys to hit offensive players as hard as you can. It becomes illegal when you offer up money to injure them, which is what they did. Smith never said he tells his guys to spear WRs.