New Orleans Saints select Texas safety Kenny Vaccaro with the 15th pick

papz · 04-25-2013, 11:49 PM

Originally Posted by TreyThomas

And comparing Vaccaro to Jenkins is just stupid. Vaccaro is a safety. Always has been a safety, always will be a safety. Jenkins was a corner moved to safety. These are two different positions entirely, and not every player has the instinct to play safety. Jenkins lack of interceptions is not his problem. Hell, I'd be happy if he were anywhere close to the ball just to swat it down.

Since this obvious is a response to my post, I think it's stupid you think it's stupid. And what position is Jenkins playing now? They both have the flexibility to cover receivers and tight ends. I'm also not overly concerned about neither player's ability to get an INT. He's also been compared to All Pro Eric Weddle. Is that stupid too? Eric Weddle was a CB/FS hybrid when he was drafted. Since when was it so stupid to compare players who play the same position? Genius.

Read this smarty pants.

WEAKNESSES Used extensively in man coverage and around the line, must continue improving as a reliable back-half defender against the pass and last line of defense against long runs. One-speed player who lacks burst. Is not quite agile or fast enough to stick with better NFL receivers, backpedal is high and stiff, can be out-quicked in space, and loses a step running down the seam. Can get caught freelancing and watching the backfield in zone coverage, and will bite on play action. Knee injury ended his senior season in high school after three games. Can fill downhill out of control, losing his leverage on the ball carrier and missing tackles. Doesn’t always take good angles and is prone to running himself too far upfield when he’s the “force” defender.

Now if you take your defensive blinders off, think about it. Does this not sound similar to Jenkins? Hell they even tackle alike. Go look at his reel. Go get a hand rag and take your aggression out somewhere else.

And just in case you missed it, I'm more than okay with the Vaccaro pick and was so throughout the process. I did not compare him to Jenkins as an insult... as I think the world of Jenkins' ability. I think Vaccaro can be just as good as Jenkins when he flashed his potential a few years ago. Which means, I think Vaccaro can be an All Pro type safety. Hopefully he'll be more consistent than Jenkins and fulfill his potential.

The nerve.

TreyThomas · 04-26-2013, 07:13 AM

Originally Posted by papz

Since this obvious is a response to my post, I think it's stupid you think it's stupid. And what position is Jenkins playing now? They both have the flexibility to cover receivers and tight ends. I'm also not overly concerned about neither player's ability to get an INT. He's also been compared to All Pro Eric Weddle. Is that stupid too? Eric Weddle was a CB/FS hybrid when he was drafted. Since when was it so stupid to compare players who play the same position? Genius.

Read this smarty pants.

WEAKNESSES Used extensively in man coverage and around the line, must continue improving as a reliable back-half defender against the pass and last line of defense against long runs. One-speed player who lacks burst. Is not quite agile or fast enough to stick with better NFL receivers, backpedal is high and stiff, can be out-quicked in space, and loses a step running down the seam. Can get caught freelancing and watching the backfield in zone coverage, and will bite on play action. Knee injury ended his senior season in high school after three games. Can fill downhill out of control, losing his leverage on the ball carrier and missing tackles. Doesn’t always take good angles and is prone to running himself too far upfield when he’s the “force” defender.

Now if you take your defensive blinders off, think about it. Does this not sound similar to Jenkins? Hell they even tackle alike. Go look at his reel. Go get a hand rag and take your aggression out somewhere else.

And just in case you missed it, I'm more than okay with the Vaccaro pick and was so throughout the process. I did not compare him to Jenkins as an insult... as I think the world of Jenkins' ability. I think Vaccaro can be just as good as Jenkins when he flashed his potential a few years ago. Which means, I think Vaccaro can be an All Pro type safety. Hopefully he'll be more consistent than Jenkins and fulfill his potential.

The nerve.

Actually I never responded to you, smart guy. The Jenkins comment was towards KySaintsFan. Go back and check before you start making crazy ass, off the wall assumptions, cool?

There is a DIFFERENCE between an elite CB and an ELITE safety.
Jenkins might could have been an elite corner, we'll never know. He, however, is NOT an elite safety. He never or hardly ever played safety in college or high school, meaning he learned a completely different position.

Oh, and if you actually believe there's hardly a difference between CB and safety because they "both cover WR's and TE's", you know absolutely nothing about secondary and coverage schemes.
Would appreciate it if you only call me out like that when spoken to first though, buddy.

The nerve.

papz · 04-26-2013, 07:36 AM

Originally Posted by TreyThomas

Actually I never responded to you, smart guy. The Jenkins comment was towards KySaintsFan. Go back and check before you start making crazy ass, off the wall assumptions, cool?

Off wall assumptions? I also made the comparison and you did not quote who you were responding to. So how is it even close to being off the wall? You know what that means right. Regardless, it doesn't make a difference who you were responding too. The content remains the same. Maybe next time you want to go back and quote who you're responding to, cool?

There is a DIFFERENCE between an elite CB and an ELITE safety.
Jenkins might could have been an elite corner, we'll never know. He, however, is NOT an elite safety. He never or hardly ever played safety in college or high school, meaning he learned a completely different position.

Okay so what? I can't compare the two because one was moved to safety and one played safety in college? Makes perfect sense.

Oh, and if you actually believe there's hardly a difference between CB and safety because they "both cover WR's and TE's", you know absolutely nothing about secondary and coverage schemes.

I don't believe that. So you can throw that assumption out the window.

Would appreciate it if you only call me out like that when spoken to first though, buddy.

The nerve.

Would appreciate it if you be more specific. However it really made little difference as I thought your statement was ridiculous as is.

kelsobob · 04-26-2013, 07:23 AM

Originally Posted by papz

Since this obvious is a response to my post, I think it's stupid you think it's stupid. And what position is Jenkins playing now? They both have the flexibility to cover receivers and tight ends. I'm also not overly concerned about neither player's ability to get an INT. He's also been compared to All Pro Eric Weddle. Is that stupid too? Eric Weddle was a CB/FS hybrid when he was drafted. Since when was it so stupid to compare players who play the same position? Genius.

Read this smarty pants.

WEAKNESSES Used extensively in man coverage and around the line, must continue improving as a reliable back-half defender against the pass and last line of defense against long runs. One-speed player who lacks burst. Is not quite agile or fast enough to stick with better NFL receivers, backpedal is high and stiff, can be out-quicked in space, and loses a step running down the seam. Can get caught freelancing and watching the backfield in zone coverage, and will bite on play action. Knee injury ended his senior season in high school after three games. Can fill downhill out of control, losing his leverage on the ball carrier and missing tackles. Doesn’t always take good angles and is prone to running himself too far upfield when he’s the “force” defender.

Now if you take your defensive blinders off, think about it. Does this not sound similar to Jenkins? Hell they even tackle alike. Go look at his reel. Go get a hand rag and take your aggression out somewhere else.

And just in case you missed it, I'm more than okay with the Vaccaro pick and was so throughout the process. I did not compare him to Jenkins as an insult... as I think the world of Jenkins' ability. I think Vaccaro can be just as good as Jenkins when he flashed his potential a few years ago. Which means, I think Vaccaro can be an All Pro type safety. Hopefully he'll be more consistent than Jenkins and fulfill his potential.

The nerve.

Scouting Report

Athleticism
+Good size and bulk for the position.
+Shows good balance and change of direction skills.
+Above average quickness and acceleration.
+Fluid hips and has functional strength.
-Might be a high 4.5 speed guy.

Zone Coverage
+Fantastic instincts in zone, is always around the ball.
+Reads patterns well, plays very tight to receivers in his area
+Routinely gets a good break and closes quickly on the ball.
+Shows the ability to cover a deep half/third as well as play underneath.
-Doesn’t have great ball skills, has left a few interceptions on his plate.

Man Coverage
+Able to cover tight ends and slot receivers.
+Excels in press, able to get a solid jam and re-route receivers.
+Seems to understand leverage and will play his man into help.
-Lacks elite recovery speed on deep routes.
-Gets out of his backpedal too quickly at times, a bit impatient.

Run Support
+Solid form tackler, comfortable making a stop in space.
+Able to deliver a big hit, really lays the wood.
+Very effective blitzing off the edge, gets routine pressure.
+Will take on fullbacks, blow up blockers, all the dirty things to help his team.
+Very quick with his reads, gets to the hole quicker than blockers think he will.
-Goes for the kill-shot too often – has the fundamentals, needs to use them.
-Takes an occasional poor angle in pursuit.

Intelligence
+Shows a good understanding of the Texas “two-read” defense.
+Is asked to make adjustments based on the receivers route each play.
+Plays a variety of positions, including special teams.

Leadership
+Passionate player that has the respect of his teammates.
-Had an arrest (failure to obey) during the summer before his senior season.

Overview:
Vaccaro is exactly the kind of versatile defensive back that NFL teams are looking for. He can bully slot receivers with his strength and change of direction skills, while covering tight ends with his size and athletic ability, as well as covering a deep half or third in zone.

Vaccaro could play either free or strong safety at the next level, with the additional ability to contribute as a “star” or “money” defensive back in sub-packages. He also has excelled on special teams at Texas, which will endear him to NFL coaching staffs.

04-25-2013, 11:49 PM	#1
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,793	Re: New Orleans Saints select Texas safety Kenny Vaccaro with the 15th pick Originally Posted by TreyThomas And comparing Vaccaro to Jenkins is just stupid. Vaccaro is a safety. Always has been a safety, always will be a safety. Jenkins was a corner moved to safety. These are two different positions entirely, and not every player has the instinct to play safety. Jenkins lack of interceptions is not his problem. Hell, I'd be happy if he were anywhere close to the ball just to swat it down. Since this obvious is a response to my post, I think it's stupid you think it's stupid. And what position is Jenkins playing now? They both have the flexibility to cover receivers and tight ends. I'm also not overly concerned about neither player's ability to get an INT. He's also been compared to All Pro Eric Weddle. Is that stupid too? Eric Weddle was a CB/FS hybrid when he was drafted. Since when was it so stupid to compare players who play the same position? Genius. Read this smarty pants. WEAKNESSES Used extensively in man coverage and around the line, must continue improving as a reliable back-half defender against the pass and last line of defense against long runs. One-speed player who lacks burst. Is not quite agile or fast enough to stick with better NFL receivers, backpedal is high and stiff, can be out-quicked in space, and loses a step running down the seam. Can get caught freelancing and watching the backfield in zone coverage, and will bite on play action. Knee injury ended his senior season in high school after three games. Can fill downhill out of control, losing his leverage on the ball carrier and missing tackles. Doesn’t always take good angles and is prone to running himself too far upfield when he’s the “force” defender. Now if you take your defensive blinders off, think about it. Does this not sound similar to Jenkins? Hell they even tackle alike. Go look at his reel. Go get a hand rag and take your aggression out somewhere else. And just in case you missed it, I'm more than okay with the Vaccaro pick and was so throughout the process. I did not compare him to Jenkins as an insult... as I think the world of Jenkins' ability. I think Vaccaro can be just as good as Jenkins when he flashed his potential a few years ago. Which means, I think Vaccaro can be an All Pro type safety. Hopefully he'll be more consistent than Jenkins and fulfill his potential. The nerve.
	Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege. All little common sense goes a long way. Last edited by papz; 04-25-2013 at 11:53 PM..

04-26-2013, 07:13 AM	#2
TreyThomas Registered Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 82	Re: New Orleans Saints select Texas safety Kenny Vaccaro with the 15th pick Originally Posted by papz Since this obvious is a response to my post, I think it's stupid you think it's stupid. And what position is Jenkins playing now? They both have the flexibility to cover receivers and tight ends. I'm also not overly concerned about neither player's ability to get an INT. He's also been compared to All Pro Eric Weddle. Is that stupid too? Eric Weddle was a CB/FS hybrid when he was drafted. Since when was it so stupid to compare players who play the same position? Genius. Read this smarty pants. WEAKNESSES Used extensively in man coverage and around the line, must continue improving as a reliable back-half defender against the pass and last line of defense against long runs. One-speed player who lacks burst. Is not quite agile or fast enough to stick with better NFL receivers, backpedal is high and stiff, can be out-quicked in space, and loses a step running down the seam. Can get caught freelancing and watching the backfield in zone coverage, and will bite on play action. Knee injury ended his senior season in high school after three games. Can fill downhill out of control, losing his leverage on the ball carrier and missing tackles. Doesn’t always take good angles and is prone to running himself too far upfield when he’s the “force” defender. Now if you take your defensive blinders off, think about it. Does this not sound similar to Jenkins? Hell they even tackle alike. Go look at his reel. Go get a hand rag and take your aggression out somewhere else. And just in case you missed it, I'm more than okay with the Vaccaro pick and was so throughout the process. I did not compare him to Jenkins as an insult... as I think the world of Jenkins' ability. I think Vaccaro can be just as good as Jenkins when he flashed his potential a few years ago. Which means, I think Vaccaro can be an All Pro type safety. Hopefully he'll be more consistent than Jenkins and fulfill his potential. The nerve. Actually I never responded to you, smart guy. The Jenkins comment was towards KySaintsFan. Go back and check before you start making crazy ass, off the wall assumptions, cool? There is a DIFFERENCE between an elite CB and an ELITE safety. Jenkins might could have been an elite corner, we'll never know. He, however, is NOT an elite safety. He never or hardly ever played safety in college or high school, meaning he learned a completely different position. Oh, and if you actually believe there's hardly a difference between CB and safety because they "both cover WR's and TE's", you know absolutely nothing about secondary and coverage schemes. Would appreciate it if you only call me out like that when spoken to first though, buddy. The nerve.
TreyThomas Registered Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 82

04-26-2013, 07:36 AM	#3
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,793	Re: New Orleans Saints select Texas safety Kenny Vaccaro with the 15th pick Originally Posted by TreyThomas Actually I never responded to you, smart guy. The Jenkins comment was towards KySaintsFan. Go back and check before you start making crazy ass, off the wall assumptions, cool? Off wall assumptions? I also made the comparison and you did not quote who you were responding to. So how is it even close to being off the wall? You know what that means right. Regardless, it doesn't make a difference who you were responding too. The content remains the same. Maybe next time you want to go back and quote who you're responding to, cool? There is a DIFFERENCE between an elite CB and an ELITE safety. Jenkins might could have been an elite corner, we'll never know. He, however, is NOT an elite safety. He never or hardly ever played safety in college or high school, meaning he learned a completely different position. Okay so what? I can't compare the two because one was moved to safety and one played safety in college? Makes perfect sense. Oh, and if you actually believe there's hardly a difference between CB and safety because they "both cover WR's and TE's", you know absolutely nothing about secondary and coverage schemes. I don't believe that. So you can throw that assumption out the window. Would appreciate it if you only call me out like that when spoken to first though, buddy. The nerve. Would appreciate it if you be more specific. However it really made little difference as I thought your statement was ridiculous as is.
	Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but some abuse the privilege. All little common sense goes a long way.

04-26-2013, 07:23 AM	#4
kelsobob Rookie Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 10	Re: New Orleans Saints select Texas safety Kenny Vaccaro with the 15th pick Originally Posted by papz Since this obvious is a response to my post, I think it's stupid you think it's stupid. And what position is Jenkins playing now? They both have the flexibility to cover receivers and tight ends. I'm also not overly concerned about neither player's ability to get an INT. He's also been compared to All Pro Eric Weddle. Is that stupid too? Eric Weddle was a CB/FS hybrid when he was drafted. Since when was it so stupid to compare players who play the same position? Genius. Read this smarty pants. WEAKNESSES Used extensively in man coverage and around the line, must continue improving as a reliable back-half defender against the pass and last line of defense against long runs. One-speed player who lacks burst. Is not quite agile or fast enough to stick with better NFL receivers, backpedal is high and stiff, can be out-quicked in space, and loses a step running down the seam. Can get caught freelancing and watching the backfield in zone coverage, and will bite on play action. Knee injury ended his senior season in high school after three games. Can fill downhill out of control, losing his leverage on the ball carrier and missing tackles. Doesn’t always take good angles and is prone to running himself too far upfield when he’s the “force” defender. Now if you take your defensive blinders off, think about it. Does this not sound similar to Jenkins? Hell they even tackle alike. Go look at his reel. Go get a hand rag and take your aggression out somewhere else. And just in case you missed it, I'm more than okay with the Vaccaro pick and was so throughout the process. I did not compare him to Jenkins as an insult... as I think the world of Jenkins' ability. I think Vaccaro can be just as good as Jenkins when he flashed his potential a few years ago. Which means, I think Vaccaro can be an All Pro type safety. Hopefully he'll be more consistent than Jenkins and fulfill his potential. The nerve. Scouting Report Athleticism +Good size and bulk for the position. +Shows good balance and change of direction skills. +Above average quickness and acceleration. +Fluid hips and has functional strength. -Might be a high 4.5 speed guy. Zone Coverage +Fantastic instincts in zone, is always around the ball. +Reads patterns well, plays very tight to receivers in his area +Routinely gets a good break and closes quickly on the ball. +Shows the ability to cover a deep half/third as well as play underneath. -Doesn’t have great ball skills, has left a few interceptions on his plate. Man Coverage +Able to cover tight ends and slot receivers. +Excels in press, able to get a solid jam and re-route receivers. +Seems to understand leverage and will play his man into help. -Lacks elite recovery speed on deep routes. -Gets out of his backpedal too quickly at times, a bit impatient. Run Support +Solid form tackler, comfortable making a stop in space. +Able to deliver a big hit, really lays the wood. +Very effective blitzing off the edge, gets routine pressure. +Will take on fullbacks, blow up blockers, all the dirty things to help his team. +Very quick with his reads, gets to the hole quicker than blockers think he will. -Goes for the kill-shot too often – has the fundamentals, needs to use them. -Takes an occasional poor angle in pursuit. Intelligence +Shows a good understanding of the Texas “two-read” defense. +Is asked to make adjustments based on the receivers route each play. +Plays a variety of positions, including special teams. Leadership +Passionate player that has the respect of his teammates. -Had an arrest (failure to obey) during the summer before his senior season. Overview: Vaccaro is exactly the kind of versatile defensive back that NFL teams are looking for. He can bully slot receivers with his strength and change of direction skills, while covering tight ends with his size and athletic ability, as well as covering a deep half or third in zone. Vaccaro could play either free or strong safety at the next level, with the additional ability to contribute as a “star” or “money” defensive back in sub-packages. He also has excelled on special teams at Texas, which will endear him to NFL coaching staffs. Danno likes this.
kelsobob Rookie Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 10

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