Brooks and Saints are losers

duece4pres · 10-25-2004, 01:00 AM

I could have sworn that they won today. I must need new glasses.

RDOX · 10-25-2004, 08:29 AM

Geez, I am tired of this....Put yourself in AB\'s shoes, try having the media and fans on your butt every week no matter how well or bad you play and go out and try to do your job.
---most people don\'t want him here for which is W/L. Personally, I don\'t think he wants to be here so I say bye-bye. --- but if any player doesn\'t want to be here, then leave.

Sadly, everyone seems to miss the point here about Brooks. Boogro has basically summed up the Brooks problem. He really doesn\'t want to be here. He has been touted as the \"savior\" of the Saints Offense. Haslett and McCarthy are responsible for this, in that, Brooks did not really \"earn\" the starting job, it fell into his lap. Blake was not great, but we were winning up to the point that he was hurt. Blake was NOT given a fair shot to compete for the job the following year, because of Hazlett and McCarthy\'s idea about Brooks \"potential.\" The problem was that Brooks wasn\'t mature enough to handle the starting role. I don\'t blame Brooks for this, I blame coaching. When Hazlett had Brooks in the final 4 games hurt, he couldn\'t afford to put Delhomme in, because Delhomme would have done well, gotten us into the playoffs and then you have a QB controversy. Instead, Brooks played hurt and we went down the tubes that year. Delhomme left last year and Hazlett got Bouman because he knew that Bouman wouldn\'t push AB, thererfore no QB arguments.

The problem with that is, that AB in his comments, and his behavior has lost respect of the team. They neither like nor respect Brooks. Therefore they don\'t play for him. They played well enough to win yesterday, because they don\'t want Haz fired and McCarthy, or worse yet, Venturi as HC.

This is not about \"Stats,\" \"race,\" or \"hating Brooks.\" These are facts that come from reputable sources in the media. Face it, Brooks will never, ever win the respect of this group of fans or players. They go though the motions. And when he gets banged up, many classless, stupid people are going to cheer his injury and clamor for Bouman.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 10-26-2004, 08:41 AM

You AB supporters are all alike. You can babble off all kinds of stats that apparently seem impressive to you, but, for some reason, you never talk too much about thw W/L column, or, the Superbowl victories we have.

Yes we do. Each and every time Brooks haters come along with the same tripe.

Listen closely. Pro football is a team game. It takes 53 guys, coaches, front office, owner, and even fans, along with some luck, to be consistently successful.

Brooks gets part of the blame. No one has a problem with that. However the haters always comes online and puts 100 percent of the blame on him. It\'s totally unrealistic.

There\'s never any discussion of the poor defense. Of the receiver\'s drops. Of the poor play calling. Or anything else that affects the outcome of a football game.

The funny thing is that now Brooks haters have really nothing that they can hang their hat on. Early on when he got the job, one could point to the excessive interceptions. Last year they pointed to the fumbles lost. But this year with 9TDs, 3INTs, 1 (or 2) fumbles lost, a 60% competion percentage, top 5 in the NFL in passing yards, there\'s simply isn\'t any glaring faults to point to. So it\'s back to \"leadership\". As if somehow Brooks could talk the defense into not giving up a franchise record 605 yards and 5 TDs to Minnesota. A game BTW that we lost only by 7 points and the offense scored a TD on its last possession of the ball.

Now back to the Brooks hating channel....

Someone comes around and tries to help you see the situation without your rose-colored glasses, and you all the sudden jump to the race card...saying that I don\'t like AB because he is black. If you read any of my posts, I never mention anything about his race, but for some reason, a lot of you always come back with the race card. Perhaps you should take a long look in the mirror, and see which person is using race to support his attitude towards Brooks. It must really burn you up that you can\'t come back and point out all of the high points the team has accomplished with him at the helm, instead of trying to dig up stats that ultimately don\'t really matter in the long run. Because, if they did matter, we would have a lot more wins to talk about now, but that isn\'t the case, is it?

Interesting. That\'s the first time I\'ve seen the race card. That\'s my brother\'s assertion: the irrational dislike of Brooks is due to race.

But you keep coming back to wins. It\'s all about wins. Let\'s talk about wins. It\'s real simple:

THE TEAM WITH THE BEST DEFENSES CONSISTENTLY WINS IN THE NFL!!!!!

Last time I checked, the Saints had the worst defense in the NFL. 32nd out of 32 teams in both point and yards allowed. Let me recheck... Yup. 416 yards a game and 27.6 points a game are both dead last in the NFL.

And yet we are two games out of first place in the NFC South. We\'re a half game out from the last wild card spot. WIth 3 wins we\'re in the top half of the NFC with wins.

And here\'s important point: If our defense could just get to average, we\'d have 3 more wins. But the defense couldn\'t stop TB, Arizona, Minnesota, or Seattle from doing whatever they wanted with the ball: Running, Passing, or scoring. 4 of the 7 teams that we have played so far have scoring averages of less than 20 points per game for the season. Yet the Saints have given up more than 20 PPG to each and every team we\'ve played this season.

I\'d be right there with you if Brooks were screwing up every game. Throwing INTs, fumbling the ball. Throwing the ball into the dirt.

But he\'s not. He\'s hitting the receivers. He\'s being smart and careful with the ball, throwing it away when nothing\'s available. He occasionally misses the open read. But on the flip side receivers other than Horn (and Pathon of late) have dropped a bunch of balls.

So why the consistent blaming of Brooks? You keep discounting stats. But stats are kept for a reason. Stats are both a measure, and a indicator, of how well a team performs.

I will admit, and have posted, that it is not AB\'s fault that they keep trotting him out there....it is not his fault if he doesn\'t have the savvy or finesse that it takes to play QB in the NFL. That is the coaches call, and that\'s why Haz is going to lose his job. Sometimes you just have to say that you were wrong, and then you can make an adjustment. Instead, we just keep losing.

But you keep making the same assertion :

...he doesn\'t have the savvy or finesse that it takes to play QB in the NFL.

without any logical justification for it.

All I\'m asking is that you justify it. But you won\'t because you can\'t. But please try. I\'ll be waiting to read that.

SFIAH

Saint_LB · 10-26-2004, 09:03 AM

If you need me to point out all of the chokes at the most crucial moments of important games...the mysterious drops without anyone touching him....the smiling at inappropriate times, something that makes a lot of people irritated....these are all things that make people grow tired and weary of his act. Personality, or savvy, is an important part of the QB position. People don\'t like you and it starts showing on both sides of the football. The Saints need someone to come in and provide a spark....it happens all the time. Brooks came in and did that very thing in 2000, Four years later we are all still waiting for him to return to that level of play....but, somewhere along the line, AB got to believing that he was a superstar and should be treated that way. I say you have to earn that, first, and, coming in one year and providing a spark for that one year does not make you a superstar. It is a good start, but you have to build on it, and that is where he has \"dropped the ball.\" (Pardon the pun!)

2SAINTS04 · 10-26-2004, 09:21 AM

saint lb says they have no accomplishments with ab at the helm,but i do remember the only playoff win in the teams history

[Edited on 26/10/2004 by 2SAINTS04]

Saint_LB · 10-26-2004, 09:27 AM

How long is he going to be allowed to ride that wave?

St.Shrume · 10-27-2004, 01:49 PM

\"How long is he going to be allowed to ride that wave?\"

Until we have a QB that wins another playoff game.

Saint_LB, I feel your frustration about the Saints. But honestly, do you think __________ (plug in your favorite QB, McNabb, Manning, etc.) could help our defense tackle, remember who they\'re covering? Make our O-line stop friggin\' False Starting? If you think they can, then I would agree with you about getting rid of AB.

I get the Sunday Ticket so I watch a bunch of games each weekend, and I tell you what, you get a whole different perspective when you do so. AB smiles, AB fumbles at times etc. but he is better than most QB\'s I watch. Really.

Sure there are guys who I\'d want in there more than AB, like McNabb or Manning. But if you can ignore our pathetic defense, ignore Deuce\'s crucial fumble that lost us a game,IMO, and all the penalties...then brother, you are the one watching with rosy colored glasses.

Did you see how many dropped balls our WR\'s and TE\'s dropped in the past weeks? I mean, come on, Saint_LB, really? Sure, maybe AB is throwing them behind them, too fast, too soft, too perfect, but all I have heard all y life is \'if it hits you in the chest or hands, you\'re fault for not catching it\'. So how come you don\'t bring that up?

I think AB is a good QB and will proabbly make it to the Superbowl, but not with us. WE, the Saints\' organization, have to learn how to become winners, and fans of winners. We mis-manage talent, we mis-manage our emotions, and run people out of town.

I just think you\'re putting too much blame on 1 guy. It truly does take a whole organization to win ball games as SFIAH said. Not just QB\'s, coaches, players, etc.

SFIAH, well put response you gave. Kudos.

When AB haters complain about him, the WR\'s. the O-line, and Defense...i hear them. When they get in their tunnel vision attacks on just AB, I usually ignore it as just venting for venting\'s sake with no logic. The Saints will make you do that. I\'ve done it on thsi board a few weeks back wanting everyone\'s head....even the fans!!

blackwidows · 10-27-2004, 07:51 PM

You know I hate to ride this black verse white qb bus but there has only been one black qb to win a superbowl. Also Brooks no matter bhow he wants to get away from the scrambling label Brooks is a scrambling qb. No scrambling qb has won a superbowl only pocket passers. Sometimes I wish they had a stat called qb inticts because it seems common sense is not to common with Brooks. Also someone mentioned IQ Dan Marino had one of the lowest IQ in football history but is one of the best.

BlackandBlue · 10-27-2004, 07:53 PM

No scrambling qb has won a superbowl only pocket passers.

Steve Young was a scrambler. Oh, but he was a white boy.

blackwidows · 10-27-2004, 07:54 PM

Don\'t get me wrong I like Brooks but when you back peddle 15 yards than try to out juke everyone that shows a lack of being to able to read a defense. I mean what ever happened to the 123 drop if nothings open dump it to the tighend across the middle or your back coming out of the backfeild. Brooks does not seem to be able to fine the running lane when pressure is coming. Likes when your watching a game the announcer time and time again draws the running lane Brooks was not able to find.

10-25-2004, 01:00 AM	#11
duece4pres Biloxi Bandit Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: biloxi, ms Posts: 293	Brooks and Saints are losers I could have sworn that they won today. I must need new glasses.

10-25-2004, 08:29 AM	#12
RDOX 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 264	Brooks and Saints are losers Geez, I am tired of this....Put yourself in AB\'s shoes, try having the media and fans on your butt every week no matter how well or bad you play and go out and try to do your job. ---most people don\'t want him here for which is W/L. Personally, I don\'t think he wants to be here so I say bye-bye. --- but if any player doesn\'t want to be here, then leave. Sadly, everyone seems to miss the point here about Brooks. Boogro has basically summed up the Brooks problem. He really doesn\'t want to be here. He has been touted as the \"savior\" of the Saints Offense. Haslett and McCarthy are responsible for this, in that, Brooks did not really \"earn\" the starting job, it fell into his lap. Blake was not great, but we were winning up to the point that he was hurt. Blake was NOT given a fair shot to compete for the job the following year, because of Hazlett and McCarthy\'s idea about Brooks \"potential.\" The problem was that Brooks wasn\'t mature enough to handle the starting role. I don\'t blame Brooks for this, I blame coaching. When Hazlett had Brooks in the final 4 games hurt, he couldn\'t afford to put Delhomme in, because Delhomme would have done well, gotten us into the playoffs and then you have a QB controversy. Instead, Brooks played hurt and we went down the tubes that year. Delhomme left last year and Hazlett got Bouman because he knew that Bouman wouldn\'t push AB, thererfore no QB arguments. The problem with that is, that AB in his comments, and his behavior has lost respect of the team. They neither like nor respect Brooks. Therefore they don\'t play for him. They played well enough to win yesterday, because they don\'t want Haz fired and McCarthy, or worse yet, Venturi as HC. This is not about \"Stats,\" \"race,\" or \"hating Brooks.\" These are facts that come from reputable sources in the media. Face it, Brooks will never, ever win the respect of this group of fans or players. They go though the motions. And when he gets banged up, many classless, stupid people are going to cheer his injury and clamor for Bouman.
RDOX 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 264

10-26-2004, 08:41 AM	#13
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,773	Brooks and Saints are losers You AB supporters are all alike. You can babble off all kinds of stats that apparently seem impressive to you, but, for some reason, you never talk too much about thw W/L column, or, the Superbowl victories we have. Yes we do. Each and every time Brooks haters come along with the same tripe. Listen closely. Pro football is a team game. It takes 53 guys, coaches, front office, owner, and even fans, along with some luck, to be consistently successful. Brooks gets part of the blame. No one has a problem with that. However the haters always comes online and puts 100 percent of the blame on him. It\'s totally unrealistic. There\'s never any discussion of the poor defense. Of the receiver\'s drops. Of the poor play calling. Or anything else that affects the outcome of a football game. The funny thing is that now Brooks haters have really nothing that they can hang their hat on. Early on when he got the job, one could point to the excessive interceptions. Last year they pointed to the fumbles lost. But this year with 9TDs, 3INTs, 1 (or 2) fumbles lost, a 60% competion percentage, top 5 in the NFL in passing yards, there\'s simply isn\'t any glaring faults to point to. So it\'s back to \"leadership\". As if somehow Brooks could talk the defense into not giving up a franchise record 605 yards and 5 TDs to Minnesota. A game BTW that we lost only by 7 points and the offense scored a TD on its last possession of the ball. Now back to the Brooks hating channel.... Someone comes around and tries to help you see the situation without your rose-colored glasses, and you all the sudden jump to the race card...saying that I don\'t like AB because he is black. If you read any of my posts, I never mention anything about his race, but for some reason, a lot of you always come back with the race card. Perhaps you should take a long look in the mirror, and see which person is using race to support his attitude towards Brooks. It must really burn you up that you can\'t come back and point out all of the high points the team has accomplished with him at the helm, instead of trying to dig up stats that ultimately don\'t really matter in the long run. Because, if they did matter, we would have a lot more wins to talk about now, but that isn\'t the case, is it? Interesting. That\'s the first time I\'ve seen the race card. That\'s my brother\'s assertion: the irrational dislike of Brooks is due to race. But you keep coming back to wins. It\'s all about wins. Let\'s talk about wins. It\'s real simple: THE TEAM WITH THE BEST DEFENSES CONSISTENTLY WINS IN THE NFL!!!!! Last time I checked, the Saints had the worst defense in the NFL. 32nd out of 32 teams in both point and yards allowed. Let me recheck... Yup. 416 yards a game and 27.6 points a game are both dead last in the NFL. And yet we are two games out of first place in the NFC South. We\'re a half game out from the last wild card spot. WIth 3 wins we\'re in the top half of the NFC with wins. And here\'s important point: If our defense could just get to average, we\'d have 3 more wins. But the defense couldn\'t stop TB, Arizona, Minnesota, or Seattle from doing whatever they wanted with the ball: Running, Passing, or scoring. 4 of the 7 teams that we have played so far have scoring averages of less than 20 points per game for the season. Yet the Saints have given up more than 20 PPG to each and every team we\'ve played this season. I\'d be right there with you if Brooks were screwing up every game. Throwing INTs, fumbling the ball. Throwing the ball into the dirt. But he\'s not. He\'s hitting the receivers. He\'s being smart and careful with the ball, throwing it away when nothing\'s available. He occasionally misses the open read. But on the flip side receivers other than Horn (and Pathon of late) have dropped a bunch of balls. So why the consistent blaming of Brooks? You keep discounting stats. But stats are kept for a reason. Stats are both a measure, and a indicator, of how well a team performs. I will admit, and have posted, that it is not AB\'s fault that they keep trotting him out there....it is not his fault if he doesn\'t have the savvy or finesse that it takes to play QB in the NFL. That is the coaches call, and that\'s why Haz is going to lose his job. Sometimes you just have to say that you were wrong, and then you can make an adjustment. Instead, we just keep losing. But you keep making the same assertion : ...he doesn\'t have the savvy or finesse that it takes to play QB in the NFL. without any logical justification for it. All I\'m asking is that you justify it. But you won\'t because you can\'t. But please try. I\'ll be waiting to read that. SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

10-26-2004, 09:03 AM	#14
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Brooks and Saints are losers If you need me to point out all of the chokes at the most crucial moments of important games...the mysterious drops without anyone touching him....the smiling at inappropriate times, something that makes a lot of people irritated....these are all things that make people grow tired and weary of his act. Personality, or savvy, is an important part of the QB position. People don\'t like you and it starts showing on both sides of the football. The Saints need someone to come in and provide a spark....it happens all the time. Brooks came in and did that very thing in 2000, Four years later we are all still waiting for him to return to that level of play....but, somewhere along the line, AB got to believing that he was a superstar and should be treated that way. I say you have to earn that, first, and, coming in one year and providing a spark for that one year does not make you a superstar. It is a good start, but you have to build on it, and that is where he has \"dropped the ball.\" (Pardon the pun!)
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Whether you think you can or think you can't...you're right!

10-26-2004, 09:21 AM	#15
2SAINTS04 Rookie Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: NORTH LOUISIANA Posts: 20	Brooks and Saints are losers saint lb says they have no accomplishments with ab at the helm,but i do remember the only playoff win in the teams history [Edited on 26/10/2004 by 2SAINTS04]

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10-26-2004, 09:27 AM	#16
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Brooks and Saints are losers How long is he going to be allowed to ride that wave?
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894

10-27-2004, 01:49 PM	#17
St.Shrume 100th Post Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 125	Brooks and Saints are losers \"How long is he going to be allowed to ride that wave?\" Until we have a QB that wins another playoff game. Saint_LB, I feel your frustration about the Saints. But honestly, do you think __________ (plug in your favorite QB, McNabb, Manning, etc.) could help our defense tackle, remember who they\'re covering? Make our O-line stop friggin\' False Starting? If you think they can, then I would agree with you about getting rid of AB. I get the Sunday Ticket so I watch a bunch of games each weekend, and I tell you what, you get a whole different perspective when you do so. AB smiles, AB fumbles at times etc. but he is better than most QB\'s I watch. Really. Sure there are guys who I\'d want in there more than AB, like McNabb or Manning. But if you can ignore our pathetic defense, ignore Deuce\'s crucial fumble that lost us a game,IMO, and all the penalties...then brother, you are the one watching with rosy colored glasses. Did you see how many dropped balls our WR\'s and TE\'s dropped in the past weeks? I mean, come on, Saint_LB, really? Sure, maybe AB is throwing them behind them, too fast, too soft, too perfect, but all I have heard all y life is \'if it hits you in the chest or hands, you\'re fault for not catching it\'. So how come you don\'t bring that up? I think AB is a good QB and will proabbly make it to the Superbowl, but not with us. WE, the Saints\' organization, have to learn how to become winners, and fans of winners. We mis-manage talent, we mis-manage our emotions, and run people out of town. I just think you\'re putting too much blame on 1 guy. It truly does take a whole organization to win ball games as SFIAH said. Not just QB\'s, coaches, players, etc. SFIAH, well put response you gave. Kudos. When AB haters complain about him, the WR\'s. the O-line, and Defense...i hear them. When they get in their tunnel vision attacks on just AB, I usually ignore it as just venting for venting\'s sake with no logic. The Saints will make you do that. I\'ve done it on thsi board a few weeks back wanting everyone\'s head....even the fans!!
St.Shrume 100th Post Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 125

10-27-2004, 07:51 PM	#18
blackwidows 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 245	Brooks and Saints are losers You know I hate to ride this black verse white qb bus but there has only been one black qb to win a superbowl. Also Brooks no matter bhow he wants to get away from the scrambling label Brooks is a scrambling qb. No scrambling qb has won a superbowl only pocket passers. Sometimes I wish they had a stat called qb inticts because it seems common sense is not to common with Brooks. Also someone mentioned IQ Dan Marino had one of the lowest IQ in football history but is one of the best.
blackwidows 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 245

10-27-2004, 07:53 PM	#19
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	Brooks and Saints are losers No scrambling qb has won a superbowl only pocket passers. Steve Young was a scrambler. Oh, but he was a white boy.

10-27-2004, 07:54 PM	#20
blackwidows 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 245	Brooks and Saints are losers Don\'t get me wrong I like Brooks but when you back peddle 15 yards than try to out juke everyone that shows a lack of being to able to read a defense. I mean what ever happened to the 123 drop if nothings open dump it to the tighend across the middle or your back coming out of the backfeild. Brooks does not seem to be able to fine the running lane when pressure is coming. Likes when your watching a game the announcer time and time again draws the running lane Brooks was not able to find.
blackwidows 100th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 245