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this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Originally Posted by burningmetal Your opinion could not possibly be more meaningless to me. You don't like what I have to say? Stop reading. I don't like what you have to say, but I don't reply to every thread you ...
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#1 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by burningmetal
I am afraid that Graham did only drop THREE balls this past season. Perhaps your image of Graham's supposed tendency is based upon 2012, instead. Graham did have 14 drops in 2012, but one must consider that he was playing with an injured wrist. In 2011 his drop percentage was only 3.4% with five drops in 149 possibilities.![]()
As for disappearing, any player would disappear with the muggings that the officials allowed from NE's Talib and Seattle's Sherman. It was during that NE game that Graham suffered the Plantar fasciitis injury that slowed him for the remainder of the season. I can see that you place the blame for those loses on Graham. He was doubled repeatedly during both of those games which should have freed up someone else one would think. Any player can be taken out of a game, regardless of how good they are, but in doing so the defense risks some other player blowing up instead. It was the rest of the Saints' offense that deserve the blame in those games, not Graham. |
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#2 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by AsylumGuido
You are going by official stats which only give credit for obvious drops. They don't think losing the ball after being hit counts. But the great one's sure count it against themselves.![]()
And you're dead wrong about the NE game. They had Talib on him, period. I never once saw him doubled, and even if he was it would have been very seldom. You think Talib would play any differently against the rest of the league if he can just mug people and get away with it? Of course not, yet he completely shut down Graham and struggled against pretty much everyone else the rest of the season. That didn't speak well of jimmy. Because that's just it. If you're physical with Jimmy, he gets frustrated. More and more teams are going to start banging him around, because that's what you have to do. Does Calvin Johnson get doubled? Does he get mugged? Does anybody shut him down? The first two answers are yes, and the last one is NO. I don't blame the loss to NE only on Jimmy, but as someone who wants to be the highest paid TE I sure expect him to do more than absolutely nothing as he did in that game. I Remember how Jimmy played in that playoff game against the 49ers a couple years ago. That's the intensity I want to see. I just haven't seen him respond to that type of challenge since then. |
If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.
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#3 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by burningmetal
Calvin Johnson makes over $18million per year. The discussion is $7million vs. $12 million. Nobody has suggested the Saints pay Graham "Calvin Johnson money". Apples and Oranges. ![]()
Although you might want to check out who's made more touchdowns over the last three seasons. |
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#4 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by Utah_Saint
The argument is not about who makes more money, I'm talking about how great players respond to adversity. It doesn't matter how much more money Calvin Makes, because the Lions have their own priorities.![]()
As for who has more touchdowns, I've already responded to you when you said the exact same thing in another thread. Touchdowns have more to do with opportunity than anything else. I care more about what you do between 20's that puts your team in that position. Drew Brees is light years better than Stafford and he has more decoys on the field than Stafford has had. The lions don't get in the redzone nearly as much as we do. Do I really need to continue with this comparison? |
If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.
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#5 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by burningmetal
I am a Saints fan. I want my team to win. Does Graham give me a better chance to win than lessor TE's? Yes. I don't give a flying rat's ass what he is paid. I want him on my team. What is your frickin' hangup about the money?
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#6 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Everything I have said up to this point is my hangup. This isn't a normal business. There is a salary cap. I understand he deserves more than he has been making. I just don't want to see a ridiculously high number thrown at him, because we're already on the hook with Drew.
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#7 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by burningmetal
No this isn't a normal business, but it is a business being run by individuals that know a whole hell of a lot more than you do about the finances. I am not sure what your expertise involves, but I have spent most of my life working in business. I have a degree in accounting and am a business analyst. I have been schooled in business law and have a better understanding than the vast majority of average fans on the working of a salary cap. The numbers involved in any NFL contract are meaningless as far as yearly average. The only number that mean anything are guaranteed dollar and year by year cap hit.![]()
You mention Brees. We are not on the hook for hardly anything. He has already received most of his guaranteed money as a signing bonus. Loomis can easily guarantee a minimal amount more of the non-guaranteed amount as another bonus and greatly reduce his cap hit in any of the next three seasons. They can do the same with other players across the board. All of this obsession with cap space is a waste of time for the average fan. It is not an issue. Believe me. |
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#8 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by burningmetal
The Saints averaged less than two points/game more than the Lions, there weren't that many red zone opportunities.![]()
What do decoy's have to do with anything. I could easily argue Graham has to share the ball more than Johnson. Graham was targeted 144 times, Johnson targeted 156. That argument works both ways. OK, let's expand the definition of "shut down" then. How many games did Calvin Johnson get held to less than a hundred yards and no touchdowns? How many games did Jimmy Graham get held to less than a hundred yards and no touchdowns? |
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#9 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by Utah_Saint
Decoys have to do with opening up the field in the redzone. And I'm not talking about last years stats alone, I'm talking about over the last few seasons combined, because that is the original example you used. ![]()
I don't have a sheet in front of me to tell you how many games either player was held to less than 100 yards and no touchdowns. so I don't have any idea. That isn't what constitutes being shut down for me. Being down is doing next to nothing. |
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#10 |
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Re: If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract
Originally Posted by burningmetal
... happened twice. Once when Talib was so physical he injured his foot and the second time when Seattle threw everything to stop him (still on the injured foot) and the rest of the team laid an egg offensively.![]()
I was as pissed off as you, but I at least understood that it wasn't his fault. |
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If you were Loomis writing Graham's contract | This thread | Refback | 07-04-2014 09:07 AM | 41 |
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