Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z

JKool · 02-06-2005, 03:26 PM

Whodi,

Miami is true that that ain\'t so.

Hunh?

JKool · 02-06-2005, 03:28 PM

Billy,

I\'ve got to disagree with you on Brooks bashers. I\'ve had several discussions recently that I thought ended with some good give and take. Patience is a virtue, after all.

I agree that it is probably best, in most threads, to just ignore Brooks comments altogether, as they often have little to do with the rest of the thread.

saintswhodi · 02-06-2005, 04:18 PM

Kool, I was told give AB a top flight defense and he would have us in the playoffs. Miami has a top flight defense and them along with several other top flight defenses were at home for the playoffs. Buffalo, Baltimore. Seems like they were doomed by poor QBing, and none of them have a pro bowl receiver. MY point on Miami was no matter how good your D is, is you have a poor QB, you ain\'t doing squat.

JKool · 02-06-2005, 05:53 PM

Whodi,

I see what you\'re getting at now.

I\'m not sure what to think about that argument. Does it follow from that that if your QB is bad what your defense is like doesn\'t matter at all?

Is Jake the snake a good QB then? Without Denver\'s top five defense, I don\'t think that Jake and the O would have made the playoffs, do you?

I\'m willing to say that Denver\'s running game and defense are the reason that they made the playoffs. Is that unreasonable?

Heck their WRs are at least as good as ours, but I\'m still not willing to say that Jake is a \"good\" QB. He\'s middling at best, which appears to me to be what we have.

[Edited on 6/2/2005 by JKool]

saintswhodi · 02-06-2005, 05:58 PM

If what you are saying Kool is Jake would not do any better here, I would agree with that. He is just as inconsistent as AB, although he puts up similar #s. I don\'t think at all their receivers are as good as ours though.

And yes pretty much I think it doesn\'t matter what your D looks like if your QB is gonna lead the league in red zone turnovers or fumbles or dumb plays or not even complete 60% of his passes in 5 years.

JKool · 02-06-2005, 06:18 PM

But if Jake would do the same here, then doesn\'t defense and a running game matter to your success? Jake and Denver are the counterexample to your Miami claim, aren\'t they? Maybe I missed something?

saintswhodi · 02-06-2005, 06:24 PM

Apparently not. Did you see the way Denver got blown out of the playoffs the last two years? I don\'t think they counter anything. I think they prove the point as well.

JKool · 02-06-2005, 07:12 PM

Denver: mid-to-crumby QB, good D, good Running game = playoffs.

That is a counter example to: mid-to-crumby Qb, good D, good running game = never make playoffs.

If Jake = Aaron, then \"never make playoffs\" with good running game and good D is false.

saintswhodi · 02-06-2005, 07:14 PM

I looked at the stats, and Jake is actually better than AB the last two years. My apologies to Jake. Jake does not = Aaron.

JKool · 02-07-2005, 03:00 AM

Whodi,

Just because his last two years stats are better doesn\'t make him not inconsistent as you said - he\'s just had two banner years.

Jake isn\'t any better than Aaron on any given Sunday. He just has a better team around him - better D, better OL, and a better running game.

You\'re digging in for no reason. I suspect most will agree.

02-06-2005, 03:26 PM	#11
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z Whodi, Miami is true that that ain\'t so. Hunh?

02-06-2005, 03:28 PM	#12
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z Billy, I\'ve got to disagree with you on Brooks bashers. I\'ve had several discussions recently that I thought ended with some good give and take. Patience is a virtue, after all. I agree that it is probably best, in most threads, to just ignore Brooks comments altogether, as they often have little to do with the rest of the thread.

02-06-2005, 04:18 PM	#13
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z Kool, I was told give AB a top flight defense and he would have us in the playoffs. Miami has a top flight defense and them along with several other top flight defenses were at home for the playoffs. Buffalo, Baltimore. Seems like they were doomed by poor QBing, and none of them have a pro bowl receiver. MY point on Miami was no matter how good your D is, is you have a poor QB, you ain\'t doing squat.

02-06-2005, 05:53 PM	#14
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z Whodi, I see what you\'re getting at now. I\'m not sure what to think about that argument. Does it follow from that that if your QB is bad what your defense is like doesn\'t matter at all? Is Jake the snake a good QB then? Without Denver\'s top five defense, I don\'t think that Jake and the O would have made the playoffs, do you? I\'m willing to say that Denver\'s running game and defense are the reason that they made the playoffs. Is that unreasonable? Heck their WRs are at least as good as ours, but I\'m still not willing to say that Jake is a \"good\" QB. He\'s middling at best, which appears to me to be what we have. [Edited on 6/2/2005 by JKool]
	"... I was beating them with my eyes the whole game..." - Aaron Brooks

02-06-2005, 05:58 PM	#15
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z If what you are saying Kool is Jake would not do any better here, I would agree with that. He is just as inconsistent as AB, although he puts up similar #s. I don\'t think at all their receivers are as good as ours though. And yes pretty much I think it doesn\'t matter what your D looks like if your QB is gonna lead the league in red zone turnovers or fumbles or dumb plays or not even complete 60% of his passes in 5 years.

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02-06-2005, 06:18 PM	#16
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z But if Jake would do the same here, then doesn\'t defense and a running game matter to your success? Jake and Denver are the counterexample to your Miami claim, aren\'t they? Maybe I missed something?

02-06-2005, 06:24 PM	#17
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z Apparently not. Did you see the way Denver got blown out of the playoffs the last two years? I don\'t think they counter anything. I think they prove the point as well.

02-06-2005, 07:12 PM	#18
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z Denver: mid-to-crumby QB, good D, good Running game = playoffs. That is a counter example to: mid-to-crumby Qb, good D, good running game = never make playoffs. If Jake = Aaron, then \"never make playoffs\" with good running game and good D is false.

02-06-2005, 07:14 PM	#19
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z I looked at the stats, and Jake is actually better than AB the last two years. My apologies to Jake. Jake does not = Aaron.

02-07-2005, 03:00 AM	#20
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	Bad Offensive Line Play by Dr. Z Whodi, Just because his last two years stats are better doesn\'t make him not inconsistent as you said - he\'s just had two banner years. Jake isn\'t any better than Aaron on any given Sunday. He just has a better team around him - better D, better OL, and a better running game. You\'re digging in for no reason. I suspect most will agree.