The Real Question about the Defense...

SaintFanInATLHELL · 11-17-2015, 05:11 PM

OK. So Rob has left the building. Now what?

Everyone seems to be talking about people. Coaches, players, management.

But for me it doesn't answer the real question about the defense:

Given the current personnel, and limited adjustment time in-season, what is the best scheme that can be deployed to improve defensive performance?

The measuring criteria are:

1. Points
2. Takeaways
3. 3rd down percentage.
4. Soul crushing penalties.
5. Explosive plays (20+ yards)

What should DC Allen do? Who does he roll out? What scheme can be put in place in a short timeframe?

Is there anything that can really be done to make this defense better quickly?

Interested in hearing your thoughts.

SFIAH

Danno · 11-17-2015, 05:28 PM

If anyone here could figure it out, I'm sure Rob Ryan could and he'd still be employed. It's why NFL coaches make boatloads more money than most of us do.

darstep · 11-17-2015, 05:31 PM

Allen has to just play the hand he's been dealt.
4-3, Zone it, and keep everything in front of you.
Make teams have to execute 13 play drives.
Every possession would give us 13 opportunities for a turnover.
Better results will ONLY come with better play.
They have been looking so lost and out of place.
The conversations on the field after a breakdown seemed to frustrate more than just me.
Dumb the thing down and let every man cover/whip his man.
As a group they have to be able to cover their brother's weaknesses.
The only magic is to actually make the tackle 2 yards in the backfield when it presents itself.
Just don't jump off-sides on 3rd and 4 and give away a 1st down. Just don't do it.
Set the edges and funnel to your help.
Become good at something - Anything!
Run stuff, coverage, pass rush - Something - Anything!
Do something well and force teams to do the other things.
I am interested to see what becomes of this group.
Circle the wagons - and man up.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 11-17-2015, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by darstep

Allen has to just play the hand he's been dealt.
4-3, Zone it, and keep everything in front of you.
Make teams have to execute 13 play drives.
Every possession would give us 13 opportunities for a turnover.
Better results will ONLY come with better play.

This makes some sense. Two questions:

1. Do we have the personnel to play zone without penalty? We already know that Browner will simply grab anyone who comes near him.

2. Again do we have personnel or scheme that will make any QB in this league the least bit uncomfortable? One of the consistent items I've seen is no pressure on the QB. Do we have anyone to generate that with any consistency?

They have been looking so lost and out of place.
The conversations on the field after a breakdown seemed to frustrate more than just me.
Dumb the thing down and let every man cover/whip his man.
As a group they have to be able to cover their brother's weaknesses.
The only magic is to actually make the tackle 2 yards in the backfield when it presents itself.
Just don't jump off-sides on 3rd and 4 and give away a 1st down. Just don't do it.
Set the edges and funnel to your help.
Become good at something - Anything!
Run stuff, coverage, pass rush - Something - Anything!
Do something well and force teams to do the other things.
I am interested to see what becomes of this group.
Circle the wagons - and man up.

I'm figuring that there is some talent on the defense. Rob simply could not figure out how to get the defense in positions to be successful.

Is there a defensive scheme that will actually improve their performance so that they don't look so lost?

SFIAH

Euphoria · 11-17-2015, 05:33 PM

To some degree he does have to play the hand he was given...

But he starts by changing the attitude and philosophy.

spkb25 · 11-17-2015, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

To some degree he does have to play the hand he was given...

But he starts by changing the attitude and philosophy.

exactly what Shanle said. He said hustle anfd attitude can cover up talent deficiencies.

we weren't running to the ball. bunch of quitters..hes a players coach, we need an *******

Papa Voodoo · 11-17-2015, 06:15 PM

Let's trade a 2 and 4 for Spags to come in and hire Jason David to coach the secondary. Defensive line sucks so our secondary sucks. That won't be solved this year.

Danno · 11-17-2015, 05:42 PM

We've seen many teams with less talent perform much better than we have. That's coaching.
Euphoria nailed it. Call it whatever, culture, attitude, philosophy, cohesiveness...
Let's see if Allen can make something positive with the parts and pieces he's inherited. His tool box is filled with the right tools

SaintFanInATLHELL · 11-17-2015, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by Danno

We've seen many teams with less talent perform much better than we have. That's coaching.
Euphoria nailed it. Call it whatever, culture, attitude, philosophy, cohesiveness...
Let's see if Allen can make something positive with the parts and pieces he's inherited. His tool box is filled with the right tools

Can you offer an example from the last few years? I'm just trying to understand what the Saints could do with similar personnel that can significantly improve defensive performance.

SFIAH

halloween 65 · 11-17-2015, 06:42 PM

What they do or what I would like to see? What I would like to see is a switch to a 3-4 and let the lb.ers crash in(blitz) and see who needs to stay and who needs to go on the front line and lbers. Our front 7 hasn't played well for awhile and unless Suh is coming to town tomorrow they aint. Switching now lets us see what we need on those 2 lines then I think our secondary(with Browner) would be hard to contend with. Worst comes to worst we get a great top 5 pick out of the deal. Win, win in my book.

11-17-2015, 05:11 PM	#1
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,781	The Real Question about the Defense... OK. So Rob has left the building. Now what? Everyone seems to be talking about people. Coaches, players, management. But for me it doesn't answer the real question about the defense: Given the current personnel, and limited adjustment time in-season, what is the best scheme that can be deployed to improve defensive performance? The measuring criteria are: 1. Points 2. Takeaways 3. 3rd down percentage. 4. Soul crushing penalties. 5. Explosive plays (20+ yards) What should DC Allen do? Who does he roll out? What scheme can be put in place in a short timeframe? Is there anything that can really be done to make this defense better quickly? Interested in hearing your thoughts. SFIAH Rugby Saint II likes this.
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

11-17-2015, 05:28 PM	#2
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,747	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... If anyone here could figure it out, I'm sure Rob Ryan could and he'd still be employed. It's why NFL coaches make boatloads more money than most of us do. lumm0x, SapperSaint and The Dude like this.

11-17-2015, 05:31 PM	#3
darstep SaintSince67 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: PortCity Posts: 2,044	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... Allen has to just play the hand he's been dealt. 4-3, Zone it, and keep everything in front of you. Make teams have to execute 13 play drives. Every possession would give us 13 opportunities for a turnover. Better results will ONLY come with better play. They have been looking so lost and out of place. The conversations on the field after a breakdown seemed to frustrate more than just me. Dumb the thing down and let every man cover/whip his man. As a group they have to be able to cover their brother's weaknesses. The only magic is to actually make the tackle 2 yards in the backfield when it presents itself. Just don't jump off-sides on 3rd and 4 and give away a 1st down. Just don't do it. Set the edges and funnel to your help. Become good at something - Anything! Run stuff, coverage, pass rush - Something - Anything! Do something well and force teams to do the other things. I am interested to see what becomes of this group. Circle the wagons - and man up. SaintFanQ and Barry from MS like this.
	SaintSince67

11-17-2015, 07:25 PM	#4
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,781	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... Originally Posted by darstep Allen has to just play the hand he's been dealt. 4-3, Zone it, and keep everything in front of you. Make teams have to execute 13 play drives. Every possession would give us 13 opportunities for a turnover. Better results will ONLY come with better play. This makes some sense. Two questions: 1. Do we have the personnel to play zone without penalty? We already know that Browner will simply grab anyone who comes near him. 2. Again do we have personnel or scheme that will make any QB in this league the least bit uncomfortable? One of the consistent items I've seen is no pressure on the QB. Do we have anyone to generate that with any consistency? They have been looking so lost and out of place. The conversations on the field after a breakdown seemed to frustrate more than just me. Dumb the thing down and let every man cover/whip his man. As a group they have to be able to cover their brother's weaknesses. The only magic is to actually make the tackle 2 yards in the backfield when it presents itself. Just don't jump off-sides on 3rd and 4 and give away a 1st down. Just don't do it. Set the edges and funnel to your help. Become good at something - Anything! Run stuff, coverage, pass rush - Something - Anything! Do something well and force teams to do the other things. I am interested to see what becomes of this group. Circle the wagons - and man up. I'm figuring that there is some talent on the defense. Rob simply could not figure out how to get the defense in positions to be successful. Is there a defensive scheme that will actually improve their performance so that they don't look so lost? SFIAH
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

11-17-2015, 05:33 PM	#5
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... To some degree he does have to play the hand he was given... But he starts by changing the attitude and philosophy. Danno, spkb25, SapperSaint and 2 others like this.

11-17-2015, 06:05 PM	#6
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,115	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... Originally Posted by Euphoria To some degree he does have to play the hand he was given... But he starts by changing the attitude and philosophy. exactly what Shanle said. He said hustle anfd attitude can cover up talent deficiencies. we weren't running to the ball. bunch of quitters..hes a players coach, we need an *******

11-17-2015, 06:15 PM	#7
Papa Voodoo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,634	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... Let's trade a 2 and 4 for Spags to come in and hire Jason David to coach the secondary. Defensive line sucks so our secondary sucks. That won't be solved this year.

11-17-2015, 05:42 PM	#8
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,747	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... We've seen many teams with less talent perform much better than we have. That's coaching. Euphoria nailed it. Call it whatever, culture, attitude, philosophy, cohesiveness... Let's see if Allen can make something positive with the parts and pieces he's inherited. His tool box is filled with the right tools spkb25, SaintFanQ and Barry from MS like this.

11-17-2015, 07:17 PM	#9
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,781	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... Originally Posted by Danno We've seen many teams with less talent perform much better than we have. That's coaching. Euphoria nailed it. Call it whatever, culture, attitude, philosophy, cohesiveness... Let's see if Allen can make something positive with the parts and pieces he's inherited. His tool box is filled with the right tools Can you offer an example from the last few years? I'm just trying to understand what the Saints could do with similar personnel that can significantly improve defensive performance. SFIAH

11-17-2015, 06:42 PM	#10
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: The Real Question about the Defense... What they do or what I would like to see? What I would like to see is a switch to a 3-4 and let the lb.ers crash in(blitz) and see who needs to stay and who needs to go on the front line and lbers. Our front 7 hasn't played well for awhile and unless Suh is coming to town tomorrow they aint. Switching now lets us see what we need on those 2 lines then I think our secondary(with Browner) would be hard to contend with. Worst comes to worst we get a great top 5 pick out of the deal. Win, win in my book.

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