Darren Howard Trade?

baronm · 04-12-2005, 03:08 PM

I like Crowder as well, but he is an inside LB and we need outside LB\'s if Watson is the answer inside. Which is a big if by the way.

that\'s actually another reason...someone convinced me that experience was a key ingredient for MLB so I am thinking keep watson in the middle linebacker and get an OLB.

stockman311 · 04-12-2005, 03:09 PM

I personally put Burnett right up their with D.J. Williams from last year on pure talent. We missed out on Williams last year by one pick and knowing our luck we will miss out on Burnett by one pick in the second round this year.

GoldenTomb · 04-12-2005, 03:11 PM

I personally put Burnett right up their with D.J. Williams from last year on pure talent. We missed out on Williams last year by one pick and knowing our luck we will miss out on Burnett by one pick in the second round this year.

All the more reason to try and secure the best LB prospect since LeVar Arrington.

baronm · 04-12-2005, 03:13 PM

another thing you gotta look at is-how would they fit in in our locker room/scheme/plans/city...I think that burnett would fit very well in what they are trying to do..I think crowder would spend half his time in bar fights and jail down on bourbon and st. charles.

stockman311 · 04-12-2005, 03:16 PM

:casstet:

Look I love D.J. but under no circumstance do I see the value of trading into the top 5 to get him. If he is available at 11 and the Cowboys want to trade the pick with us for Howard as well as throw in a second rounder so be it. Other than that we need far too much help in our entire defense to sabatoge our entire draft for one player.
You probably loved that Ditka trade for Ricky Williams didn\'t you. He was a Longhorn too. Who cares if that trade set us back 5 years or is widely regarded as the worst draft day trade in the history of the draft. We got Williams and the Redskins got Arrington and Champ Bailey. I.E. we got screwed and the same will happen if we trade up to get D.J. in the top 5.
Moreover, I see your icon and it appears that the burnt orange has you blinded to the value of D. J. You don\'t happen to be a Longhorn fan do you?

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by stockman311]

saintswhodi · 04-12-2005, 03:18 PM

I think the line between trading up for DJ and not doing so is pretty close. The only difference seems to be in what we would have to give up to get him. For the most part, I amhearing if we don\'t have to pull a Ricky Williams and give up our whole draft, or half of it, it is a very good idea. On the other side, seems like giving up a little more to get a player of this caliber seems reasonable. One thing is, with the amount of teams in cap trouble at the top of the draft, the lack of a true #1, and the depth at certain key positions high in the draft, this would be a better year than most to trade up, and for our team, DJ is worth it. Bar none, the best defensive player in the draft. Worst case scenario he is a Takeo Spikes type player. Best case, he is the next Derrick Brooks. Not bad odds. I am so tired of hearing the draft is a crap shoot, why not just let every college player be a free agent then and sign with whatever team they want to? Some players in some systems are worth the proce, and as many years as we have gone without a dominant, play-making LB, I don\'t see how we can sit back and hope for whatever\'s left IF the chance to move up for DJ is there.

GoldenTomb · 04-12-2005, 03:20 PM

Well Crowder is a secondary want for me. DJ is primary....and I do actually think the FO will make a serious run at him.

GoldenTomb · 04-12-2005, 03:31 PM

:casstet:

Look I love D.J. but under no circumstance do I see the value of trading into the top 5 to get him. If he is available at 11 and the Cowboys want to trade the pick with us for Howard as well as throw in a second rounder so be it. Other than that we need far too much help in our entire defense to sabatoge our entire draft for one player.
You probably loved that Ditka trade for Ricky Williams didn\'t you. He was a Longhorn too. Who cares if that trade set us back 5 years or is widely regarded as the worst draft day trade in the history of the draft. We got Williams and the Redskins got Arrington and Champ Bailey. I.E. we got screwed and the same will happen if we trade up to get D.J. in the top 5.
Moreover, I see your icon and it appears that the burnt orange has you blinded to the value of D. J. You don\'t happen to be a Longhorn fan do you?

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by stockman311]

Honestly speaking I was optimistic when we picked RW. I thought it was a rather excessive frivilous trade, but I looked at the positives. Who knew he\'d turn out to be such a loon. I find it hard to believe that you weren\'t happy in some sense that day, if you were truly a Saints fan. I was listening to the radio as the pick came down, and every Saints fan I could hear was ecstatic, so don\'t play the \"I knew it all along\" card.

Having said all that....how does trading Howard(who we are getting rid of anyway) plus our first(which we\'ll swap with the Titans) and a third set us back 5 years? I think that\'s all it would take. As far as I know, we still have at least 5 more picks. plus free agency. Just because you make one mistake, doesn\'t mean you curl up in a shell and refuse to take chances. You have to take chances at everything in life to realize success.

And I\'m an LSU fan....I am a big Derrick Johnson fan and have been for 3 years now. I\'m convinced that you haven\'t seen him play before if you are this opposed to drafting him at 6.

baronm · 04-12-2005, 03:33 PM

Having said all that....how does trading Howard(who we are getting rid of anyway) plus our first(which we\'ll swap with the Titans) and a third set us back 5 years? I think that\'s all it would take. As far as I know, we still have at least 5 more picks. plus free agency. Just because you make one mistake, doesn\'t mean you curl up in a shell and refuse to take chances. You have to take chances at everything in life to realize success.

yes, but you must calculate those chances-point is-we have so many needs that trading half our draft picks would kill our depth...if we draft right-we could have outstanding depth.

GoldenTomb · 04-12-2005, 03:38 PM

Having said all that....how does trading Howard(who we are getting rid of anyway) plus our first(which we\'ll swap with the Titans) and a third set us back 5 years? I think that\'s all it would take. As far as I know, we still have at least 5 more picks. plus free agency. Just because you make one mistake, doesn\'t mean you curl up in a shell and refuse to take chances. You have to take chances at everything in life to realize success.

yes, but you must calculate those chances-point is-we have so many needs that trading half our draft picks would kill our depth...if we draft right-we could have outstanding depth.

Yeah and how many years do we say that exact same thing?? I have no confidence in this FO\'s scouting ability across the board, but DJ is the one pick that even they can\'t mess up.

04-12-2005, 03:08 PM	#21
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954	Darren Howard Trade? I like Crowder as well, but he is an inside LB and we need outside LB\'s if Watson is the answer inside. Which is a big if by the way. that\'s actually another reason...someone convinced me that experience was a key ingredient for MLB so I am thinking keep watson in the middle linebacker and get an OLB.
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954

04-12-2005, 03:09 PM	#22
stockman311 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 1,137	Darren Howard Trade? I personally put Burnett right up their with D.J. Williams from last year on pure talent. We missed out on Williams last year by one pick and knowing our luck we will miss out on Burnett by one pick in the second round this year.

04-12-2005, 03:11 PM	#23
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591	Darren Howard Trade? I personally put Burnett right up their with D.J. Williams from last year on pure talent. We missed out on Williams last year by one pick and knowing our luck we will miss out on Burnett by one pick in the second round this year. All the more reason to try and secure the best LB prospect since LeVar Arrington.
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591

04-12-2005, 03:13 PM	#24
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954	Darren Howard Trade? another thing you gotta look at is-how would they fit in in our locker room/scheme/plans/city...I think that burnett would fit very well in what they are trying to do..I think crowder would spend half his time in bar fights and jail down on bourbon and st. charles.
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954

04-12-2005, 03:16 PM	#25
stockman311 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 1,137	Darren Howard Trade? :casstet: Look I love D.J. but under no circumstance do I see the value of trading into the top 5 to get him. If he is available at 11 and the Cowboys want to trade the pick with us for Howard as well as throw in a second rounder so be it. Other than that we need far too much help in our entire defense to sabatoge our entire draft for one player. You probably loved that Ditka trade for Ricky Williams didn\'t you. He was a Longhorn too. Who cares if that trade set us back 5 years or is widely regarded as the worst draft day trade in the history of the draft. We got Williams and the Redskins got Arrington and Champ Bailey. I.E. we got screwed and the same will happen if we trade up to get D.J. in the top 5. Moreover, I see your icon and it appears that the burnt orange has you blinded to the value of D. J. You don\'t happen to be a Longhorn fan do you? [Edited on 12/4/2005 by stockman311]

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04-12-2005, 03:18 PM	#26
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	Darren Howard Trade? I think the line between trading up for DJ and not doing so is pretty close. The only difference seems to be in what we would have to give up to get him. For the most part, I amhearing if we don\'t have to pull a Ricky Williams and give up our whole draft, or half of it, it is a very good idea. On the other side, seems like giving up a little more to get a player of this caliber seems reasonable. One thing is, with the amount of teams in cap trouble at the top of the draft, the lack of a true #1, and the depth at certain key positions high in the draft, this would be a better year than most to trade up, and for our team, DJ is worth it. Bar none, the best defensive player in the draft. Worst case scenario he is a Takeo Spikes type player. Best case, he is the next Derrick Brooks. Not bad odds. I am so tired of hearing the draft is a crap shoot, why not just let every college player be a free agent then and sign with whatever team they want to? Some players in some systems are worth the proce, and as many years as we have gone without a dominant, play-making LB, I don\'t see how we can sit back and hope for whatever\'s left IF the chance to move up for DJ is there.

04-12-2005, 03:20 PM	#27
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591	Darren Howard Trade? Well Crowder is a secondary want for me. DJ is primary....and I do actually think the FO will make a serious run at him.
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591

04-12-2005, 03:31 PM	#28
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591	Darren Howard Trade? :casstet: Look I love D.J. but under no circumstance do I see the value of trading into the top 5 to get him. If he is available at 11 and the Cowboys want to trade the pick with us for Howard as well as throw in a second rounder so be it. Other than that we need far too much help in our entire defense to sabatoge our entire draft for one player. You probably loved that Ditka trade for Ricky Williams didn\'t you. He was a Longhorn too. Who cares if that trade set us back 5 years or is widely regarded as the worst draft day trade in the history of the draft. We got Williams and the Redskins got Arrington and Champ Bailey. I.E. we got screwed and the same will happen if we trade up to get D.J. in the top 5. Moreover, I see your icon and it appears that the burnt orange has you blinded to the value of D. J. You don\'t happen to be a Longhorn fan do you? [Edited on 12/4/2005 by stockman311] Honestly speaking I was optimistic when we picked RW. I thought it was a rather excessive frivilous trade, but I looked at the positives. Who knew he\'d turn out to be such a loon. I find it hard to believe that you weren\'t happy in some sense that day, if you were truly a Saints fan. I was listening to the radio as the pick came down, and every Saints fan I could hear was ecstatic, so don\'t play the \"I knew it all along\" card. Having said all that....how does trading Howard(who we are getting rid of anyway) plus our first(which we\'ll swap with the Titans) and a third set us back 5 years? I think that\'s all it would take. As far as I know, we still have at least 5 more picks. plus free agency. Just because you make one mistake, doesn\'t mean you curl up in a shell and refuse to take chances. You have to take chances at everything in life to realize success. And I\'m an LSU fan....I am a big Derrick Johnson fan and have been for 3 years now. I\'m convinced that you haven\'t seen him play before if you are this opposed to drafting him at 6.
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591

04-12-2005, 03:33 PM	#29
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954	Darren Howard Trade? Having said all that....how does trading Howard(who we are getting rid of anyway) plus our first(which we\'ll swap with the Titans) and a third set us back 5 years? I think that\'s all it would take. As far as I know, we still have at least 5 more picks. plus free agency. Just because you make one mistake, doesn\'t mean you curl up in a shell and refuse to take chances. You have to take chances at everything in life to realize success. yes, but you must calculate those chances-point is-we have so many needs that trading half our draft picks would kill our depth...if we draft right-we could have outstanding depth.
baronm 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 954

04-12-2005, 03:38 PM	#30
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591	Darren Howard Trade? Having said all that....how does trading Howard(who we are getting rid of anyway) plus our first(which we\'ll swap with the Titans) and a third set us back 5 years? I think that\'s all it would take. As far as I know, we still have at least 5 more picks. plus free agency. Just because you make one mistake, doesn\'t mean you curl up in a shell and refuse to take chances. You have to take chances at everything in life to realize success. yes, but you must calculate those chances-point is-we have so many needs that trading half our draft picks would kill our depth...if we draft right-we could have outstanding depth. Yeah and how many years do we say that exact same thing?? I have no confidence in this FO\'s scouting ability across the board, but DJ is the one pick that even they can\'t mess up.
GoldenTomb 500th Post Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 591