We are 0-0 in Division.

That's good for you. Do what makes YOU feel good. I don't see anything wrong with you holding out hope, but if this is how he feels so be it. Either counter his argument with facts or be quiet. Simply attacking a poster for what they posted doesn't offer anything constructive. It just comes across as *****ing and complaining. The board is here for people to let out their frustrations. Allow him to be a member of the board and do what he needs to do to feel better. You're not going to change how he thinks or feels by simply complaining about how he thinks or feels. If you don't have anything constructive to offer about what he thinks then maybe you should not say anything.

Bro you don't get to claim that the new coaches were the fix and then turn around and spin it to be they would have fixed it if they had been signed earlier.

No matter how anyone spins this the man at the top is SP. He gets the blame after this many season and now 50 games of failure.

Spike, spin? No. Fact is I had been arguing, posting that changes had to be made to the coaching staff (for my part, specifically it was Vitt). Payton's fault, clearly stated then and now, was his reluctance to make those changes.

Spike you've been so f*cking negative with your blinded lust that pound of flesh for the disappointment the team has given all of us, you can't separate the progress and growing pains that's been made from the Payton/Loomis' failures to act or their misguided failures from a lack of not looking at themselves...

The real problems with this team started when Payton won a Superbowl and everyone, and I mean everyone, threw out careful organizational checks and balances, threw him on their shoulders and exalted him the king-dictator...

The team and its fanbase is simply paying the price for that hubris and we have to wait while a man now has to share (give up) that authority across the franchise with new, competent people in the organization...

It may be that by season's end that Payton has to go, but don't tell me that the team hasn't been making better moves the past two years...

I disagree on the depth part. On paper, we actually have quite a bit of depth at all positions except OL and DT. Especially compared to recent years. By this time we are usually scouring the free agent pool for LB's and DB's.

We can win the next 2 games and should win the next 2 games. Streif comes back and Snead...huge.

Consider if Sean Payton, three years ago, would have fired Vitt, Johnson, McMahon?

Is the coaching stafff better than it was three ago?

Consider our defensive line, linebackers, cornerbacks, are they better deeper than three years ago?

Is the personnel better than it was three years ago?

Consider our kicking game, specifically our placekicker...

Is that position better than it was three years ago?

Look, many of these changes were looooong overdue, Payton was slow to do them and only having been the only guy to deliver a Lombardi and a 92yo owner gave him that time...

You've responded, liked/disliked my posts as much as anyone and you know how critical I've been of Payton the GM, Loomis the YesMan, and the Front Office needing to restructure...

So things like extended Nick Fairley without a more intense cardio workup with knowledge of him having cardio anomalies...

And the Saints Front Office and Payton acknowledged they screwed up and it's saved a life - Jon Dorenbos...

There's two (2) things that I'd say I'd be critical of at this point that Payton needs to address, and quickly if he's to save this season, and likely his job...

First, he's got to make a decision by the BYE week if D.A. is his man or if it's time to move on; don't think Payton didn't bring in Mike Nolan just to coach LBers - he's the backup plan...

Second, we screwed up shifting every two years between schemes, and I'm not sold on Rankins (Hicks, now with Chicago looks better)...

It may be time to put Rankins in a part-time role (like Fairley) and rotate those D-Lineman, giving them all a chance to eat, and be fresh for for 4 quarters...

We may just have to let Payton and this team regurgitate the remnant poor play and poor decision making to get that groove back...

And though the losses were embarrassing, they weren't against division foes, so lets let the first quarter of the season play out...[/B]

We are 0-0 in Division.