Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry

burningmetal · 03-08-2018, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by K Major

What I'm starting to gather is that a lot of folks want us to somehow win a Championship using coupons.

Yeah, there has to be a limit for how much you pay, or how much you give up for one player. But you don't get anything for free. What I'm reading in this thread is some people seem to think Landry isn't worth giving up much of anything, and that he isn't a need for the team. I just don't get that.

You can plug in guys all day long, but that's all most of them will be... plugs. Jarvis Landry's don't grow on trees. I don't know, someone will probably criticize me for commenting on the Saints, but some of what I read just made me scratch my head.

NonieT · 03-08-2018, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

Yeah, there has to be a limit for how much you pay, or how much you give up for one player. But you don't get anything for free. What I'm reading in this thread is some people seem to think Landry isn't worth giving up much of anything, and that he isn't a need for the team. I just don't get that.

You can plug in guys all day long, but that's all most of them will be... plugs. Jarvis Landry's don't grow on trees. I don't know, someone will probably criticize me for commenting on the Saints, but some of what I read just made me scratch my head.

They come from the same place he came from, the draft.

burningmetal · 03-08-2018, 06:12 PM

Originally Posted by NonieT

They come from the same place he came from, the draft.

And they're all as good as him? Wow, everyone should go draft Jerry Rice and Joe Montana because, apparently, all you have to do is draft someone, and the rest is history.

How about a known commodity? Wouldn't you want that? If not, please explain why. The draft is always there, and you do what you can with it. But when you can get established players without breaking the bank or selling the farm, it's a good idea to take advantage of that.

SaintFanInATLHELL · 03-08-2018, 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

How about a known commodity? Wouldn't you want that? If not, please explain why. The draft is always there, and you do what you can with it. But when you can get established players without breaking the bank or selling the farm, it's a good idea to take advantage of that.

This is of course the quandry. Good established players are going to cost treasure in either dollars, personnel/picks, or both.

Draft picks on 5 year contracts are the only premium talent that doesn't break the bank. If you're not spending a ton of money, of giving up significant draft picks, then it's probably not premium talent.

SFIAH

Rell&Gold · 03-08-2018, 07:50 PM

We are going to overpay somebody this off-season so why not let it be the safest bet? Rather than overpaying mediocre talent

Rsanders24 · 03-08-2018, 08:21 PM

The problem is that you have to give up a 1rd AND he is going to be looking for top 5 money. That’s too much to give up for a WR who is not a game breaker and would just be the #2 WR on our team. There are more reasonable options out there for a #2 as well as talent in the draft. As time has shown our offense can make just about any WR good or better. That money and picks could be better spent on a DE or OLB...

burningmetal · 03-08-2018, 09:01 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

This is of course the quandry. Good established players are going to cost treasure in either dollars, personnel/picks, or both.

Draft picks on 5 year contracts are the only premium talent that doesn't break the bank. If you're not spending a ton of money, of giving up significant draft picks, then it's probably not premium talent.

SFIAH

When you have a guy who doesn't have much left on his contract (franchise tag, in this case), you don't have as much leverage to get much for him. It would be something fairly significant, but it wouldn't likely involve multiple high draft choices. Maybe one first or second round pick, and possibly a third rounder added in.

The whole point of the Dolphins giving him the tag and then looking to deal him, is so that he doesn't just walk out on them for nothing. But given the high cost of the tag, I don't see the Dolphins being able to get a kings ransom in return.

If you're the Saints, or any other team, it's all about how much money you want to spend in a long term deal. And if you aren't willing to spend on a proven commodity, why be willing to draft a player in hopes that he MIGHT work out? And if the draft pick does work out, at some point you have to pay him. Building through the draft is essential to long term success, but you can't count on "hitting" on a high percentage of your draft picks every year. Given that Landry is also still young, he seems like a good gamble.

Also, the consensus among Saints fans seems to be that everything has to be done in Drew Brees' window. So if you have a decent foundation, it's time to expedite the process. Within reason, though. Landry seems like he would be a reasonable fit, to me. IF some team is willing to give the Dolphins a huge return, then that's their problem. My guess is that the market will pass on their initial demands, and that's when a negotiation could make sense for a team like the Saints.

burningmetal · 03-08-2018, 09:11 PM

Originally Posted by Rsanders24

The problem is that you have to give up a 1rd AND he is going to be looking for top 5 money. That’s too much to give up for a WR who is not a game breaker and would just be the #2 WR on our team. There are more reasonable options out there for a #2 as well as talent in the draft. As time has shown our offense can make just about any WR good or better. That money and picks could be better spent on a DE or OLB...

Well, everyone has their opinions. I personally think Landry is a better player than Thomas. His problem has been that the Dolphins have used him in kind of a small ball type of role. They don't have confidence in their QB's to get the ball down the field, and they really haven't had anyone to draw attention away from Landry.

If you watch him on punt returns, you can see what kind of elusiveness he has. If you can get him the ball in space, he might not have elite speed, but he's going to make big plays with his quickness. And he has both elite hands AND route running. The draft will always give you the guys with the "measurables", but many are bad at route running, and have average to below average hands, and little toughness.

voodooido · 03-08-2018, 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by saintsfan1976

Put yourself in the shoes of Michael Thomas or Marshon Lattimore. How would you view the team over-paying for another player at your position?

I think we sign mid-level vets and draft well in 2018. The only position I could justify a big contract is middle linebacker.

I wouldnt exactly say we would be "overpaying" for Landry. He has more catches over the past 3 years than any other WR.

WillSaints81 · 03-08-2018, 09:49 PM

What draft pick are we going to give them?

03-08-2018, 05:15 PM	#21
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry Originally Posted by K Major What I'm starting to gather is that a lot of folks want us to somehow win a Championship using coupons. Yeah, there has to be a limit for how much you pay, or how much you give up for one player. But you don't get anything for free. What I'm reading in this thread is some people seem to think Landry isn't worth giving up much of anything, and that he isn't a need for the team. I just don't get that. You can plug in guys all day long, but that's all most of them will be... plugs. Jarvis Landry's don't grow on trees. I don't know, someone will probably criticize me for commenting on the Saints, but some of what I read just made me scratch my head.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

03-08-2018, 05:21 PM	#22
NonieT 500th Post Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 921	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry Originally Posted by burningmetal Yeah, there has to be a limit for how much you pay, or how much you give up for one player. But you don't get anything for free. What I'm reading in this thread is some people seem to think Landry isn't worth giving up much of anything, and that he isn't a need for the team. I just don't get that. You can plug in guys all day long, but that's all most of them will be... plugs. Jarvis Landry's don't grow on trees. I don't know, someone will probably criticize me for commenting on the Saints, but some of what I read just made me scratch my head. They come from the same place he came from, the draft. Rsanders24 likes this.
NonieT 500th Post Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 921

03-08-2018, 06:12 PM	#23
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry Originally Posted by NonieT They come from the same place he came from, the draft. And they're all as good as him? Wow, everyone should go draft Jerry Rice and Joe Montana because, apparently, all you have to do is draft someone, and the rest is history. How about a known commodity? Wouldn't you want that? If not, please explain why. The draft is always there, and you do what you can with it. But when you can get established players without breaking the bank or selling the farm, it's a good idea to take advantage of that. K Major likes this.

03-08-2018, 06:52 PM	#24
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,774	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry Originally Posted by burningmetal How about a known commodity? Wouldn't you want that? If not, please explain why. The draft is always there, and you do what you can with it. But when you can get established players without breaking the bank or selling the farm, it's a good idea to take advantage of that. This is of course the quandry. Good established players are going to cost treasure in either dollars, personnel/picks, or both. Draft picks on 5 year contracts are the only premium talent that doesn't break the bank. If you're not spending a ton of money, of giving up significant draft picks, then it's probably not premium talent. SFIAH

03-08-2018, 07:50 PM	#25
Rell&Gold 1000 Posts + Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington, D.C Posts: 2,887	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry We are going to overpay somebody this off-season so why not let it be the safest bet? Rather than overpaying mediocre talent voodooido likes this.

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03-08-2018, 08:21 PM	#26
Rsanders24 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Baton Rouge, LA. Posts: 1,482	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry The problem is that you have to give up a 1rd AND he is going to be looking for top 5 money. That’s too much to give up for a WR who is not a game breaker and would just be the #2 WR on our team. There are more reasonable options out there for a #2 as well as talent in the draft. As time has shown our offense can make just about any WR good or better. That money and picks could be better spent on a DE or OLB... SaintFanInATLHELL likes this.

03-08-2018, 09:01 PM	#27
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL This is of course the quandry. Good established players are going to cost treasure in either dollars, personnel/picks, or both. Draft picks on 5 year contracts are the only premium talent that doesn't break the bank. If you're not spending a ton of money, of giving up significant draft picks, then it's probably not premium talent. SFIAH When you have a guy who doesn't have much left on his contract (franchise tag, in this case), you don't have as much leverage to get much for him. It would be something fairly significant, but it wouldn't likely involve multiple high draft choices. Maybe one first or second round pick, and possibly a third rounder added in. The whole point of the Dolphins giving him the tag and then looking to deal him, is so that he doesn't just walk out on them for nothing. But given the high cost of the tag, I don't see the Dolphins being able to get a kings ransom in return. If you're the Saints, or any other team, it's all about how much money you want to spend in a long term deal. And if you aren't willing to spend on a proven commodity, why be willing to draft a player in hopes that he MIGHT work out? And if the draft pick does work out, at some point you have to pay him. Building through the draft is essential to long term success, but you can't count on "hitting" on a high percentage of your draft picks every year. Given that Landry is also still young, he seems like a good gamble. Also, the consensus among Saints fans seems to be that everything has to be done in Drew Brees' window. So if you have a decent foundation, it's time to expedite the process. Within reason, though. Landry seems like he would be a reasonable fit, to me. IF some team is willing to give the Dolphins a huge return, then that's their problem. My guess is that the market will pass on their initial demands, and that's when a negotiation could make sense for a team like the Saints. K Major likes this.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

03-08-2018, 09:11 PM	#28
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry Originally Posted by Rsanders24 The problem is that you have to give up a 1rd AND he is going to be looking for top 5 money. That’s too much to give up for a WR who is not a game breaker and would just be the #2 WR on our team. There are more reasonable options out there for a #2 as well as talent in the draft. As time has shown our offense can make just about any WR good or better. That money and picks could be better spent on a DE or OLB... Well, everyone has their opinions. I personally think Landry is a better player than Thomas. His problem has been that the Dolphins have used him in kind of a small ball type of role. They don't have confidence in their QB's to get the ball down the field, and they really haven't had anyone to draw attention away from Landry. If you watch him on punt returns, you can see what kind of elusiveness he has. If you can get him the ball in space, he might not have elite speed, but he's going to make big plays with his quickness. And he has both elite hands AND route running. The draft will always give you the guys with the "measurables", but many are bad at route running, and have average to below average hands, and little toughness.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

03-08-2018, 09:46 PM	#29
voodooido 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 2,766	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry Originally Posted by saintsfan1976 Put yourself in the shoes of Michael Thomas or Marshon Lattimore. How would you view the team over-paying for another player at your position? I think we sign mid-level vets and draft well in 2018. The only position I could justify a big contract is middle linebacker. I wouldnt exactly say we would be "overpaying" for Landry. He has more catches over the past 3 years than any other WR.
voodooido 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 2,766

03-08-2018, 09:49 PM	#30
WillSaints81 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Posts: 4,267	Re: Saints Could Trade For Dolphins WR Jarvis Landry What draft pick are we going to give them?

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