Kamara or Lattimore Trade

keithday123 · 12-13-2022, 06:39 PM

I’m not a salary cap guru so I just kinda throw things out with no knowledge of cap ramifications, but could Kamara or Lattimore garner a number 1 pick from another team and if so what are the cap issues for us with it?

AsylumGuido · 12-13-2022, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by keithday123

I’m not a salary cap guru so I just kinda throw things out with no knowledge of cap ramifications, but could Kamara or Lattimore garner a number 1 pick from another team and if so what are the cap issues for us with it?

$19.37 million dead cap to trade Kamara after the season.

$43 million dead cap to trade Lattimore after the season.

Not sure what could be gained.

keithday123 · 12-13-2022, 09:27 PM

Well that answers that. Lol. Thanks

BakoSaint · 12-14-2022, 01:44 AM

What could be gained is 2024+ cap and draft picks. The Falcons took cap hits for Matt Ryan, Julio Jones, and Deion Jones bc they are committed to rebuild. The Panthers took cap hits for CMC and Baker. We could find a way to take cap hits now for the good of the future if we wanted to. But I think the best moves for the future are cut Peat, cut Winston, trade or cut Thomas, trade or cut Hill. Trading Kamara could make sense with the right value though, pre or
Post June 1. The other key thing is if we keep any of these players, dont restructure them in a way that would make the cap hit worse if we move on in the 2023-24 offseason, which means dont restructure them at all. We need to stop borrowing money in ways that ties are hands. These big cap hit numbera are usually the result of past restructuring schemes. Loomis loomising leads to Peat peating and us paying $15 million a year for it.

MatthewT · 12-14-2022, 07:55 AM

If I am reading the cap numbers correctly, looks like in 2023, Lattimore absolutely cannot be moved as it appears about 20 1/2 million more cap space would need to be created to either trade or release, Kamara would basically balance out as there would be a minor cap savings of about 700k.

AsylumGuido · 12-14-2022, 09:06 AM

Originally Posted by MatthewT

If I am reading the cap numbers correctly, looks like in 2023, Lattimore absolutely cannot be moved as it appears about 20 1/2 million more cap space would need to be created to either trade or release, Kamara would basically balance out as there would be a minor cap savings of about 700k.

Even though there could be minimal savings on Kamara, you still get stuck with a minimum of almost $15 million in dead money on your cap. So you are still accounting for him on your books without having him on your roster.

I know some might say you can spread that dead cap hit out with a post June 1st trade, but if the point of trading is to get 2023 picks that won't work.

SmashMouth · 12-14-2022, 09:07 AM

Kamara could make sense at some point. Not Lattimore though.

AsylumGuido · 12-14-2022, 09:29 AM

Kamara also has the unknown factor of a legal issue. I don't see him having any trade value until that is all behind him.

MatthewT · 12-14-2022, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

Even though there could be minimal savings on Kamara, you still get stuck with a minimum of almost $15 million in dead money on your cap. So you are still accounting for him on your books without having him on your roster.

I know some might say you can spread that dead cap hit out with a post June 1st trade, but if the point of trading is to get 2023 picks that won't work.

I completely agree with what you are saying. All this really means is Kamara can be moved if the Saints desire to do so without having to come up with additional cap space. My best guess is Kamara will be retained and likely restructured to create additional cap space, thus making him impossible to move in 2023 once that restructure is applied. Of course his situation is tricky with his pending legal issues.

BakoSaint · 12-14-2022, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

Kamara also has the unknown factor of a legal issue. I don't see him having any trade value until that is all behind him.

I see Kamara’s legal issues and CMC’s injury history being a wash and their value being similar. CMC’s helth has always been an unknown factor and the Panthers got value. Our best move would have been to trade Kamara before the trade deadline to avoid the suspension issue. But remember, Watson was moved with a pending suspension of a much more heinous nature though Watson is a QB. The other right thing we could do is refuse to restructure Kamara, which gives us an ability to move him after his suspension and before the trade deadline if we are not amazing contenders next year. This also preserves 2024 cap so the cycle of perpetual cap crisis will one day end and we will be able to add players like williams and armstead and hendrickson not lose them one day.

12-13-2022, 06:39 PM	#1
keithday123 Texasaint Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188	Kamara or Lattimore Trade I’m not a salary cap guru so I just kinda throw things out with no knowledge of cap ramifications, but could Kamara or Lattimore garner a number 1 pick from another team and if so what are the cap issues for us with it?
keithday123 Texasaint Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188

12-13-2022, 06:43 PM	#2
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade Originally Posted by keithday123 I’m not a salary cap guru so I just kinda throw things out with no knowledge of cap ramifications, but could Kamara or Lattimore garner a number 1 pick from another team and if so what are the cap issues for us with it? $19.37 million dead cap to trade Kamara after the season. $43 million dead cap to trade Lattimore after the season. Not sure what could be gained.

12-13-2022, 09:27 PM	#3
keithday123 Texasaint Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade Well that answers that. Lol. Thanks Rugby Saint II likes this.
keithday123 Texasaint Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188

12-14-2022, 01:44 AM	#4
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade What could be gained is 2024+ cap and draft picks. The Falcons took cap hits for Matt Ryan, Julio Jones, and Deion Jones bc they are committed to rebuild. The Panthers took cap hits for CMC and Baker. We could find a way to take cap hits now for the good of the future if we wanted to. But I think the best moves for the future are cut Peat, cut Winston, trade or cut Thomas, trade or cut Hill. Trading Kamara could make sense with the right value though, pre or Post June 1. The other key thing is if we keep any of these players, dont restructure them in a way that would make the cap hit worse if we move on in the 2023-24 offseason, which means dont restructure them at all. We need to stop borrowing money in ways that ties are hands. These big cap hit numbera are usually the result of past restructuring schemes. Loomis loomising leads to Peat peating and us paying $15 million a year for it. SmashMouth and Rugby Saint II like this.
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173

12-14-2022, 07:55 AM	#5
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade If I am reading the cap numbers correctly, looks like in 2023, Lattimore absolutely cannot be moved as it appears about 20 1/2 million more cap space would need to be created to either trade or release, Kamara would basically balance out as there would be a minor cap savings of about 700k.

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12-14-2022, 09:06 AM	#6
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade Originally Posted by MatthewT If I am reading the cap numbers correctly, looks like in 2023, Lattimore absolutely cannot be moved as it appears about 20 1/2 million more cap space would need to be created to either trade or release, Kamara would basically balance out as there would be a minor cap savings of about 700k. Even though there could be minimal savings on Kamara, you still get stuck with a minimum of almost $15 million in dead money on your cap. So you are still accounting for him on your books without having him on your roster. I know some might say you can spread that dead cap hit out with a post June 1st trade, but if the point of trading is to get 2023 picks that won't work.

12-14-2022, 09:07 AM	#7
SmashMouth I donated, did you? Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Mandeville, LA Posts: 38,201 Blog Entries: 29	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade Kamara could make sense at some point. Not Lattimore though. MatthewT, leilung and Rugby Saint II like this.

12-14-2022, 09:29 AM	#8
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,274	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade Kamara also has the unknown factor of a legal issue. I don't see him having any trade value until that is all behind him. MatthewT and SaintsBro like this.

12-14-2022, 09:36 AM	#9
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade Originally Posted by AsylumGuido Even though there could be minimal savings on Kamara, you still get stuck with a minimum of almost $15 million in dead money on your cap. So you are still accounting for him on your books without having him on your roster. I know some might say you can spread that dead cap hit out with a post June 1st trade, but if the point of trading is to get 2023 picks that won't work. I completely agree with what you are saying. All this really means is Kamara can be moved if the Saints desire to do so without having to come up with additional cap space. My best guess is Kamara will be retained and likely restructured to create additional cap space, thus making him impossible to move in 2023 once that restructure is applied. Of course his situation is tricky with his pending legal issues.

12-14-2022, 10:14 AM	#10
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173	Re: Kamara or Lattimore Trade Originally Posted by AsylumGuido Kamara also has the unknown factor of a legal issue. I don't see him having any trade value until that is all behind him. I see Kamara’s legal issues and CMC’s injury history being a wash and their value being similar. CMC’s helth has always been an unknown factor and the Panthers got value. Our best move would have been to trade Kamara before the trade deadline to avoid the suspension issue. But remember, Watson was moved with a pending suspension of a much more heinous nature though Watson is a QB. The other right thing we could do is refuse to restructure Kamara, which gives us an ability to move him after his suspension and before the trade deadline if we are not amazing contenders next year. This also preserves 2024 cap so the cycle of perpetual cap crisis will one day end and we will be able to add players like williams and armstead and hendrickson not lose them one day.
BakoSaint 1000 Posts + Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 2,173