Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans

SmashMouth · 10-15-2023, 11:51 PM

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Cruize · 10-16-2023, 12:11 AM

-2nd self inflicted loss of the season.
-Penning is terrible. The tripping penalty wasn't his first trip attempt of the game. He has the size and and the ability. He doesn't have the desire or conviction.
-The OL is over matched every week because of the scheme. The ball has to come out quickly on most plays.
-Every route Thomas runs needs to be an option route. If they set deep on him, slant or curl. If they set up inside, go out. If they set up outside he needs to go in. All within in the 4 to 10 yard range. If a legit #1 CB is on him, he's not the first option.
-The TE has to be involved in the same patterns. FM and Hill had some success at that today.
-It's not a crime to get the ball in Olave's and Shaheed's hands the same way. Everything they do doesn't HAVE to be deep. Just get it in their hands.
-Grupe has had a direct impact in both of the Saints bad losses.
-There's WAY too much going on with Carr at the line of scrimmage. Things have to be simplified. Get the ball out and in the hands of your playmaker.
-Granderson is a beast. Ability and effort.
-Jordan is playing his butt off.
-The games before the bye are winable.

SmashMouth · 10-16-2023, 07:44 AM

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K Major · 10-16-2023, 09:07 AM

When I look for reasons on why we are losing in the trenches and in games, I find a stat line like this:

"The Saints have been whistled for a league-high 55 penalties (12 declined) for a league-high 406 yards. They lead the NFL in offensive holding (18) & defensive pass interference (9) penalties. Their opponents 16 first downs by penalty is tied for second highest in the leage".

Allen always want to get on that podium and talk about players need to do this or that but he needs to take a hard look in the mirror, coaching assistants as well.

IIRC the Saints were top 5 in penalties @ the conclusion of pre season.

This 2023 club has ZERO discipline. Those penalties are all on the coaches.

It's a short week coming off a L & we're facing a real playoff contending team (Jacksonville) on Thursday that can put up points.

Sinner · 10-16-2023, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by K Major

When I look for reasons on why we are losing in the trenches and in games, I find a stat line like this:

"The Saints have been whistled for a league-high 55 penalties (12 declined) for a league-high 406 yards. They lead the NFL in offensive holding (18) & defensive pass interference (9) penalties. Their opponents 16 first downs by penalty is tied for second highest in the leage".

Allen always want to get on that podium and talk about players need to do this or that but he needs to take a hard look in the mirror, coaching assistants as well.

IIRC the Saints were top 5 in penalties @ the conclusion of pre season.

This 2023 club has ZERO discipline. Those penalties are all on the coaches.

It's a short week coming off a L & we're facing a real playoff contending team (Jacksonville) on Thursday that can put up points.

WE NEED A NEW HEAD COACH. A real one.

K Major · 10-16-2023, 09:11 AM

Forgot to quote the source on that penalty stat in post #41 - Underhill

MatthewT · 10-16-2023, 10:28 AM

The way I see this right now is Derek Carr is a terrible QB and needs to be gone. Bench him now and release him after the season, bite the bullet on the salary cap issues. His red zone woes and overall questionable decision making have followed him from the Raiders, he will have good games here and there, but that's about it. If there is any way to trade Carr now I say do it.

And if anyone thinks Winston is a better choice, think again, he is worse. Trade him too if the opportunity presents itself, it is already assumed he won't be back with the team next year anyway.

SmashMouth · 10-16-2023, 10:53 AM

Originally Posted by MatthewT

The way I see this right now is Derek Carr is a terrible QB and needs to be gone. Bench him now and release him after the season, bite the bullet on the salary cap issues. His red zone woes and overall questionable decision making have followed him from the Raiders, he will have good games here and there, but that's about it. If there is any way to trade Carr now I say do it.

And if anyone thinks Winston is a better choice, think again, he is worse. Trade him too if the opportunity presents itself, it is already assumed he won't be back with the team next year anyway.

That says a lot, doesn't it?

$100 million guaranteed contract ... I guess we couldn't do a prove it deal !?!

Brace yourselves, it's going to be a bumpy road.

Sinner · 10-16-2023, 12:25 PM

Originally Posted by MatthewT

The way I see this right now is Derek Carr is a terrible QB and needs to be gone. Bench him now and release him after the season, bite the bullet on the salary cap issues. His red zone woes and overall questionable decision making have followed him from the Raiders, he will have good games here and there, but that's about it. If there is any way to trade Carr now I say do it.

And if anyone thinks Winston is a better choice, think again, he is worse. Trade him too if the opportunity presents itself, it is already assumed he won't be back with the team next year anyway.

All of what you suggest, is assuming that we have solid ownership, management and coaching. We don’t.

MatthewT · 10-16-2023, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by Sinner

All of what you suggest, is assuming that we have solid ownership, management and coaching. We don’t.

Nope, that alone will not fix everything. Coaching staff and front office isn't getting it done for sure. If it doesn't get better we will see what type of ownership the Saints have, meaning will she have the guts to fire the entire front office and coaching staff or does she leave it alone.

10-16-2023, 12:11 AM	#2
Cruize 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,459	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans -2nd self inflicted loss of the season. -Penning is terrible. The tripping penalty wasn't his first trip attempt of the game. He has the size and and the ability. He doesn't have the desire or conviction. -The OL is over matched every week because of the scheme. The ball has to come out quickly on most plays. -Every route Thomas runs needs to be an option route. If they set deep on him, slant or curl. If they set up inside, go out. If they set up outside he needs to go in. All within in the 4 to 10 yard range. If a legit #1 CB is on him, he's not the first option. -The TE has to be involved in the same patterns. FM and Hill had some success at that today. -It's not a crime to get the ball in Olave's and Shaheed's hands the same way. Everything they do doesn't HAVE to be deep. Just get it in their hands. -Grupe has had a direct impact in both of the Saints bad losses. -There's WAY too much going on with Carr at the line of scrimmage. Things have to be simplified. Get the ball out and in the hands of your playmaker. -Granderson is a beast. Ability and effort. -Jordan is playing his butt off. -The games before the bye are winable.
Cruize 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 4,459

10-16-2023, 09:09 AM	#5
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,065	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans Originally Posted by K Major When I look for reasons on why we are losing in the trenches and in games, I find a stat line like this: "The Saints have been whistled for a league-high 55 penalties (12 declined) for a league-high 406 yards. They lead the NFL in offensive holding (18) & defensive pass interference (9) penalties. Their opponents 16 first downs by penalty is tied for second highest in the leage". Allen always want to get on that podium and talk about players need to do this or that but he needs to take a hard look in the mirror, coaching assistants as well. IIRC the Saints were top 5 in penalties @ the conclusion of pre season. This 2023 club has ZERO discipline. Those penalties are all on the coaches. It's a short week coming off a L & we're facing a real playoff contending team (Jacksonville) on Thursday that can put up points. WE NEED A NEW HEAD COACH. A real one. K Major likes this.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,065

10-16-2023, 09:11 AM	#6
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,797 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans Forgot to quote the source on that penalty stat in post #41 - Underhill SmashMouth likes this.

10-16-2023, 10:28 AM	#7
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans The way I see this right now is Derek Carr is a terrible QB and needs to be gone. Bench him now and release him after the season, bite the bullet on the salary cap issues. His red zone woes and overall questionable decision making have followed him from the Raiders, he will have good games here and there, but that's about it. If there is any way to trade Carr now I say do it. And if anyone thinks Winston is a better choice, think again, he is worse. Trade him too if the opportunity presents itself, it is already assumed he won't be back with the team next year anyway. SmashMouth, mapcow and K Major like this.

10-16-2023, 10:53 AM	#8
SmashMouth I donated, did you? Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Mandeville, LA Posts: 38,550 Blog Entries: 29	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans Originally Posted by MatthewT The way I see this right now is Derek Carr is a terrible QB and needs to be gone. Bench him now and release him after the season, bite the bullet on the salary cap issues. His red zone woes and overall questionable decision making have followed him from the Raiders, he will have good games here and there, but that's about it. If there is any way to trade Carr now I say do it. And if anyone thinks Winston is a better choice, think again, he is worse. Trade him too if the opportunity presents itself, it is already assumed he won't be back with the team next year anyway. That says a lot, doesn't it? $100 million guaranteed contract ... I guess we couldn't do a prove it deal !?! Brace yourselves, it's going to be a bumpy road. MatthewT and Sinner like this.
	Last edited by SmashMouth; 10-16-2023 at 11:04 AM..

10-16-2023, 09:07 AM	#4
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,797 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans When I look for reasons on why we are losing in the trenches and in games, I find a stat line like this: "The Saints have been whistled for a league-high 55 penalties (12 declined) for a league-high 406 yards. They lead the NFL in offensive holding (18) & defensive pass interference (9) penalties. Their opponents 16 first downs by penalty is tied for second highest in the leage". Allen always want to get on that podium and talk about players need to do this or that but he needs to take a hard look in the mirror, coaching assistants as well. IIRC the Saints were top 5 in penalties @ the conclusion of pre season. This 2023 club has ZERO discipline. Those penalties are all on the coaches. It's a short week coming off a L & we're facing a real playoff contending team (Jacksonville) on Thursday that can put up points. SmashMouth and Rugby Saint II like this.

10-16-2023, 12:25 PM	#9
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,065	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans Originally Posted by MatthewT The way I see this right now is Derek Carr is a terrible QB and needs to be gone. Bench him now and release him after the season, bite the bullet on the salary cap issues. His red zone woes and overall questionable decision making have followed him from the Raiders, he will have good games here and there, but that's about it. If there is any way to trade Carr now I say do it. And if anyone thinks Winston is a better choice, think again, he is worse. Trade him too if the opportunity presents itself, it is already assumed he won't be back with the team next year anyway. All of what you suggest, is assuming that we have solid ownership, management and coaching. We don’t.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,065

10-16-2023, 12:31 PM	#10
MatthewT 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Mississippi Posts: 2,729	Re: Observations from the Saints loss to the Texans Originally Posted by Sinner All of what you suggest, is assuming that we have solid ownership, management and coaching. We don’t. Nope, that alone will not fix everything. Coaching staff and front office isn't getting it done for sure. If it doesn't get better we will see what type of ownership the Saints have, meaning will she have the guts to fire the entire front office and coaching staff or does she leave it alone.