Trouble Brewing in Big Easy.

BigB · 10-02-2003, 11:12 AM

Brooks is definately not the only problem with this team. You could put Dan Marino or John Elway in as quarterback and this team would only be marginally more competitive.
Other reasons I see for the Saints problems.
1. Coaching - No not Haslett.. the offensive and defensive co-ordinators. Venturi tries to run a defense that we don\'t have the talent level for and McCarthy is too predictable.
2. Linebackers - When three of your top five tacklers are DB\'s and your first linebacker doesn\'t show up on the list until #7, something is wrong.
3. Age in secondary - Why we signed Ashley Ambrose, I will never know. Why we passed up on Marcus Trufant in the draft, I will never know.
4. Offensive Line - At first, I thought that trading Turley was going to be a good thing for team chemistry. Now I see how terribly wrong I really was.
5. Defensive Line - Sure Grady Jackson can muscle his way through an offensive line..but then what? If the quarterback takes one step left or right, Jackson doesn\'t have the speed to catch him. Sullivan, even before he was injured, is a bust so far in my opinion.
6. Injuries - I don\'t care what team you are..if you lose 6 of your starting defensive players, you are not going to be good. That being said, with the exception of the Colts game, the defense has outplayed the offense.
7. Turnovers - You are not going to win many games or go to too many playoff games with a -7 turnover margin, second worst in the NFL only in front of Arizona at -10.
8. Astronomy - Obviously, the stars are aligned against us. That can be the only reason I see that an offense that was the 3rd highest scoring offense in the NFL last year is now the 20th overall ranked offense this year.
I can\'t wait to hear the opinions on this post.
Be gentle.

tweeky · 10-02-2003, 11:31 AM

Brooks is definately not the only problem with this team. You could put Dan Marino or John Elway in as quarterback and this team would only be marginally more competitive.
Other reasons I see for the Saints problems.
1. Coaching - No not Haslett.. the offensive and defensive co-ordinators. Venturi tries to run a defense that we don\'t have the talent level for and McCarthy is too predictable.
2. Linebackers - When three of your top five tacklers are DB\'s and your first linebacker doesn\'t show up on the list until #7, something is wrong.
3. Age in secondary - Why we signed Ashley Ambrose, I will never know. Why we passed up on Marcus Trufant in the draft, I will never know.
4. Offensive Line - At first, I thought that trading Turley was going to be a good thing for team chemistry. Now I see how terribly wrong I really was.
5. Defensive Line - Sure Grady Jackson can muscle his way through an offensive line..but then what? If the quarterback takes one step left or right, Jackson doesn\'t have the speed to catch him. Sullivan, even before he was injured, is a bust so far in my opinion.
6. Injuries - I don\'t care what team you are..if you lose 6 of your starting defensive players, you are not going to be good. That being said, with the exception of the Colts game, the defense has outplayed the offense.
7. Turnovers - You are not going to win many games or go to too many playoff games with a -7 turnover margin, second worst in the NFL only in front of Arizona at -10.
8. Astronomy - Obviously, the stars are aligned against us. That can be the only reason I see that an offense that was the 3rd highest scoring offense in the NFL last year is now the 20th overall ranked offense this year.
I can\'t wait to hear the opinions on this post.
Be gentle.

1. Nailed it
2. Nailed it
3. Not so fast. Sullivan will be a stud. Everybody thought Grant was a bust pick too. He\'ll be a pro-bowler in 2 years. Sullivan will stud out in 2 years. But yes, we should have addressed the CB spot better in FA, or drafted one in the 2nd or 3rd.
4. WRONG. Turley sucks. He demanded to stay at LT, and demanded top LT money. He\'s not even a good RT. Gandy is a better LT.
5. Wrong. DL was good before injuries hit. Sullivan will be a stud. Wait and see.
6. Nailed it. How good would TB be if they lost Sapp, Brooks, Rice, Lynch and Barber?
Those are the positions we lost. I\'m not gonna slam the Defense because it isn\'t on the field yet.
7. Nailed it.
8. I don\'t believe in Astronomy nonsense. Our players need to step it up mentally, emotionally and physically. We need to get smarter, meaner and stronger.

lumm0x · 10-02-2003, 11:31 AM

Only thing I would have a beef with is:

Sullivan, even before he was injured, is a bust so far in my opinion.

If you\'d have said that we overpaid to get him, got poor value for the pick position, or said he has yet to show he was worth the high draft I\'d have to agree. But to label him a bust after two and a half games is a reach. That would mean that over 20 of the first rounders this year are busts. I could name 20 that have given less tangible evidence that they will have impact.

Other than that....who could argue.

BigB · 10-02-2003, 11:42 AM

My comment on Sullivan is based on observation of his play during games. I watched him get no push off the line..while the rest of the of the D-line at least gets one or two steps closer to the play, Sullivan seems to be frozen. Could this be chalked up to being a rookie..sure..but strength off the line is not coached. He seems confused out there. He is always trailing plays, never being in on the intial action. Now I could be wrong about him, and God knows I hope I am, but Trufant would have been a better acquisition in the draft, and I believe time will bear this out.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 11:43 AM

I do know that staying with the status Quo is not going to do anything but tear this team apart even more. This will cause players to have anomosity among each other and make it that much harder to get team chemistry back next year

You KNOW? You know no such thing !! It could happen, but they might start winning !! You guys kill me coming in here stating things as FACTS. I seem to remember the Jets getting killed their first 3 or 4 games last year and they went to the playoffs and beat the Colts 44-0. Don\'t say it can\'t happen or you KNOW what\'s going to happen!! But, sure FWtex, it COULD happen.

BigB · 10-02-2003, 11:47 AM

You are right about the Jets last year BC, but they didn\'t start winning until they made a change at quarterback. Let me make this clear, I am not saying that Brooks needs to be yanked (as I said in previous post), but a change, probably many changes, need to be made.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 11:48 AM

My comment on Sullivan is based on observation of his play during games. I watched him get no push off the line..while the rest of the of the D-line at least gets one or two steps closer to the play, Sullivan seems to be frozen. Could this be chalked up to being a rookie..sure..but strength off the line is not coached. He seems confused out there. He is always trailing plays, never being in on the intial action. Now I could be wrong about him, and God knows I hope I am, but Trufant would have been a better acquisition in the draft, and I believe time will bear this out.

There was an aritcle posted on here a while back showing what PROBOWL tackles did in their rookie year and it wasn\'t pretty. You can\'t being making observations or making staments like that this early. You are wrong about this !! Well, you are way premature about it anyway!!

BigB · 10-02-2003, 11:49 AM

Like I said..I hope I am wrong about him, but I don\'t think I am.

TheOriginalSwampdog · 10-02-2003, 11:49 AM

Jets had Chad Pennington and a coach in Herman Edwards who oozes confidence and motivation. Brooks smiles while losing and Haz doesn\'t have a clue on how to right the ship. Also, the Jets didn\'t collapse TWO years in a row before last year. Haslett obviously underestimated the psychological effect it had on his players. We are paying for it this year.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 12:02 PM

Dog --

Here\'s the deal. Haslett has done a poor job. But, it\'s not like he isn\'t capiable of winning games. To hear you, you would think that Haslett doesn\'t know a damn thing about football. While I don\'t have any HIGH hopes that great things are going to happen for the Saints this year, it\'s entirley POSSIBLE that something COULD happen to turn things around. I would rather hang my hat on that possibility than to let fans like yourself tell me \"IT\'S OVER\". Of course have a losing mentality !!

[Edited on 2/10/2003 by JOESAM2002]

10-02-2003, 11:12 AM	#11
BigB Rookie Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Lake Charles Posts: 16	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Brooks is definately not the only problem with this team. You could put Dan Marino or John Elway in as quarterback and this team would only be marginally more competitive. Other reasons I see for the Saints problems. 1. Coaching - No not Haslett.. the offensive and defensive co-ordinators. Venturi tries to run a defense that we don\'t have the talent level for and McCarthy is too predictable. 2. Linebackers - When three of your top five tacklers are DB\'s and your first linebacker doesn\'t show up on the list until #7, something is wrong. 3. Age in secondary - Why we signed Ashley Ambrose, I will never know. Why we passed up on Marcus Trufant in the draft, I will never know. 4. Offensive Line - At first, I thought that trading Turley was going to be a good thing for team chemistry. Now I see how terribly wrong I really was. 5. Defensive Line - Sure Grady Jackson can muscle his way through an offensive line..but then what? If the quarterback takes one step left or right, Jackson doesn\'t have the speed to catch him. Sullivan, even before he was injured, is a bust so far in my opinion. 6. Injuries - I don\'t care what team you are..if you lose 6 of your starting defensive players, you are not going to be good. That being said, with the exception of the Colts game, the defense has outplayed the offense. 7. Turnovers - You are not going to win many games or go to too many playoff games with a -7 turnover margin, second worst in the NFL only in front of Arizona at -10. 8. Astronomy - Obviously, the stars are aligned against us. That can be the only reason I see that an offense that was the 3rd highest scoring offense in the NFL last year is now the 20th overall ranked offense this year. I can\'t wait to hear the opinions on this post. Be gentle.
	\"The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place\"

10-02-2003, 11:31 AM	#12
tweeky 500th Post Join Date: May 2003 Location: South Alabama Posts: 779	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Brooks is definately not the only problem with this team. You could put Dan Marino or John Elway in as quarterback and this team would only be marginally more competitive. Other reasons I see for the Saints problems. 1. Coaching - No not Haslett.. the offensive and defensive co-ordinators. Venturi tries to run a defense that we don\'t have the talent level for and McCarthy is too predictable. 2. Linebackers - When three of your top five tacklers are DB\'s and your first linebacker doesn\'t show up on the list until #7, something is wrong. 3. Age in secondary - Why we signed Ashley Ambrose, I will never know. Why we passed up on Marcus Trufant in the draft, I will never know. 4. Offensive Line - At first, I thought that trading Turley was going to be a good thing for team chemistry. Now I see how terribly wrong I really was. 5. Defensive Line - Sure Grady Jackson can muscle his way through an offensive line..but then what? If the quarterback takes one step left or right, Jackson doesn\'t have the speed to catch him. Sullivan, even before he was injured, is a bust so far in my opinion. 6. Injuries - I don\'t care what team you are..if you lose 6 of your starting defensive players, you are not going to be good. That being said, with the exception of the Colts game, the defense has outplayed the offense. 7. Turnovers - You are not going to win many games or go to too many playoff games with a -7 turnover margin, second worst in the NFL only in front of Arizona at -10. 8. Astronomy - Obviously, the stars are aligned against us. That can be the only reason I see that an offense that was the 3rd highest scoring offense in the NFL last year is now the 20th overall ranked offense this year. I can\'t wait to hear the opinions on this post. Be gentle. 1. Nailed it 2. Nailed it 3. Not so fast. Sullivan will be a stud. Everybody thought Grant was a bust pick too. He\'ll be a pro-bowler in 2 years. Sullivan will stud out in 2 years. But yes, we should have addressed the CB spot better in FA, or drafted one in the 2nd or 3rd. 4. WRONG. Turley sucks. He demanded to stay at LT, and demanded top LT money. He\'s not even a good RT. Gandy is a better LT. 5. Wrong. DL was good before injuries hit. Sullivan will be a stud. Wait and see. 6. Nailed it. How good would TB be if they lost Sapp, Brooks, Rice, Lynch and Barber? Those are the positions we lost. I\'m not gonna slam the Defense because it isn\'t on the field yet. 7. Nailed it. 8. I don\'t believe in Astronomy nonsense. Our players need to step it up mentally, emotionally and physically. We need to get smarter, meaner and stronger.
	Whether we agree or disagree; its all for Him.

10-02-2003, 11:31 AM	#13
lumm0x Resident antediluvian Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,026	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Only thing I would have a beef with is: Sullivan, even before he was injured, is a bust so far in my opinion. If you\'d have said that we overpaid to get him, got poor value for the pick position, or said he has yet to show he was worth the high draft I\'d have to agree. But to label him a bust after two and a half games is a reach. That would mean that over 20 of the first rounders this year are busts. I could name 20 that have given less tangible evidence that they will have impact. Other than that....who could argue.

10-02-2003, 11:42 AM	#14
BigB Rookie Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Lake Charles Posts: 16	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. My comment on Sullivan is based on observation of his play during games. I watched him get no push off the line..while the rest of the of the D-line at least gets one or two steps closer to the play, Sullivan seems to be frozen. Could this be chalked up to being a rookie..sure..but strength off the line is not coached. He seems confused out there. He is always trailing plays, never being in on the intial action. Now I could be wrong about him, and God knows I hope I am, but Trufant would have been a better acquisition in the draft, and I believe time will bear this out.
	\"The single biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place\"

10-02-2003, 11:43 AM	#15
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. I do know that staying with the status Quo is not going to do anything but tear this team apart even more. This will cause players to have anomosity among each other and make it that much harder to get team chemistry back next year You KNOW? You know no such thing !! It could happen, but they might start winning !! You guys kill me coming in here stating things as FACTS. I seem to remember the Jets getting killed their first 3 or 4 games last year and they went to the playoffs and beat the Colts 44-0. Don\'t say it can\'t happen or you KNOW what\'s going to happen!! But, sure FWtex, it COULD happen.
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

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10-02-2003, 11:47 AM	#16
BigB Rookie Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Lake Charles Posts: 16	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. You are right about the Jets last year BC, but they didn\'t start winning until they made a change at quarterback. Let me make this clear, I am not saying that Brooks needs to be yanked (as I said in previous post), but a change, probably many changes, need to be made.

10-02-2003, 11:48 AM	#17
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. My comment on Sullivan is based on observation of his play during games. I watched him get no push off the line..while the rest of the of the D-line at least gets one or two steps closer to the play, Sullivan seems to be frozen. Could this be chalked up to being a rookie..sure..but strength off the line is not coached. He seems confused out there. He is always trailing plays, never being in on the intial action. Now I could be wrong about him, and God knows I hope I am, but Trufant would have been a better acquisition in the draft, and I believe time will bear this out. There was an aritcle posted on here a while back showing what PROBOWL tackles did in their rookie year and it wasn\'t pretty. You can\'t being making observations or making staments like that this early. You are wrong about this !! Well, you are way premature about it anyway!!
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-02-2003, 11:49 AM	#18
BigB Rookie Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Lake Charles Posts: 16	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Like I said..I hope I am wrong about him, but I don\'t think I am.

10-02-2003, 11:49 AM	#19
TheOriginalSwampdog 100th Post Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 215	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Jets had Chad Pennington and a coach in Herman Edwards who oozes confidence and motivation. Brooks smiles while losing and Haz doesn\'t have a clue on how to right the ship. Also, the Jets didn\'t collapse TWO years in a row before last year. Haslett obviously underestimated the psychological effect it had on his players. We are paying for it this year.

10-02-2003, 12:02 PM	#20
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Dog -- Here\'s the deal. Haslett has done a poor job. But, it\'s not like he isn\'t capiable of winning games. To hear you, you would think that Haslett doesn\'t know a damn thing about football. While I don\'t have any HIGH hopes that great things are going to happen for the Saints this year, it\'s entirley POSSIBLE that something COULD happen to turn things around. I would rather hang my hat on that possibility than to let fans like yourself tell me \"IT\'S OVER\". Of course have a losing mentality !! [Edited on 2/10/2003 by JOESAM2002]
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209