Trouble Brewing in Big Easy.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 02:50 PM

however all reports are also saying he doesn\'t have the leadership quality.

These reports are coming from everywhere execpt where they would be crediable and that\'s the coaches and his teammates. Furthermore, if it takes Aaron having to fire these guys up or if they are playing poorly because they have no confidence in Brooks, then I think those players need to go. They are paid to play like professionals and not blame the QB (which they have not done). How would it look if AB said \" I just can\'t play as well as I\'m suppose to because I have no faith in my receivers because they keep dropping the ball?\"

canucksaint · 10-02-2003, 03:00 PM

I agree that I haven\'t heard anything out of the locker room. But the way that Haz is circling the wagons, that doesn\'t suprise me. I am basing this off the look on the sidelines. It all goes back to his big goofy smile. Now that may be more of a nervious reaction (which I think I rememeber you saying), or it could be that he just doesn\'t care. I think that this team lacks the leadership from everywhere. This isn\'t just Brooks responsiblity, it is also Duece\'s, Horn\'s, Haz\'s and whoever we still have standing on D. The problem is, no one has stood up. The last person/people who actually did get this team all fired up are now playing in St. Louis and Miami. AB is probably loosing faith in his recievers and viceversa, and that is probably why he isn\'t playing well. But where is that scramble that he used to have. We know that he is capable of it, but it seems that he would rather sit in the pocket and get nailed all day, then scamble and make plays happen.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 03:06 PM

Every mistake is being magnified because of the turnovers and because the defense is allowing to many points. It\'s causing Aaron to have to force things and putting too much pressure on the offense in general. If they can cut out the turnovers and the defense can play respectful -- I think you will see a different team.

[Edited on 2/10/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]

canucksaint · 10-02-2003, 03:11 PM

Granted the D is playing like crap this year. But they also played like crap last year. No difference except all of our injuries. AB still came out looking good last year. As for the turnovers. That\'s AB\'s problem. Is he trying to force things... yup. Has he been doing that for the last 4 years.. yup. That\'s one of the things that they were hoping for when he \"matured\", is that he would stop trying to force plays. I think he still has it in him. Just he needs to play like he\'s fighting for his job/life, like he used to.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 03:20 PM

canucksaint --

I think your trying to place to much blame on AB or the quarterback postion in general. The fact of the matter is we would probably be 1-3 no matter who would have been the QB !! No matter what anyone says, there has never been a QB in history that has won a game by himself. Not Montana, Elway, Peyton, or anyone else. How do you think Aaron would do if he played on the Bucs or Panthers??

This is a team game and those turnovers you speak of that are Aaron\'s problem?? Please !! Of all those turnovers Aaron is responsible for only 2 of them. How exactly are the rest of them Aaron\'s fault? Is he suppose to catch the ball for Donte\' to?

lumm0x · 10-02-2003, 03:23 PM

Billy,

Just like you I have lots of guesses and no answers. As much as we like to ride this on Haslett, Venturi & McCarthy, and even the QB, defense, whatever, these players and coaches all know more about football than any of us and they don\'t know the answers. How many teams throughout history have gone through slumps and losing streaks? There is probably a million possibilites to turn it around. Tough practices, easy practices, QB changes, benching players, calling them out in the media.....
I guess each is an individual case and there is no proven formula to get this done. I have to fall it onto the shoulders of the coaches because their job description covers this area of the team. Prepare your players to be competetive.

As for the QB situation....I like Aaron Brooks. Based on what I\'ve seen of him, he\'s a nice guy, has great measureables, and brings many traits that can be positive in the QB position. He has a strong arm, decent accuracy and velocity, escapability, plays through injury, pretty good throw mechanics, and alot of upside. He also, like everyone else, has many weaknesses. He has poor intangible qualities in my opinion, that no stats can backup. Lack of a fiery disposition, vocal leadership, lead by action, slow reads, lack of pocket prescence, lack of polished play disguise, lack of expereince audibling, etc. He is a very good QB prospect that has enjoyed alot of success and is now in the position, from late last year to today, to experience great adversity.
There have been a handful of games that he hasn\'t shown up 100%, but his game hasn\'t deteriorated. It just hasn\'t grown much. I think on a personal level, he is growing, and we\'ll see him be a more involved team member based on his interection I\'ve seen this year. His play disguise and audible calls could be better with coaching and experiencing. He\'s not a born leader, but not every offense needs the QB to be one. It\'s just that our team doesn\'t have one that the eyes will immediately look to the QB position out of historical trend.
Is the right decision to sit him down for a bit? Who knows. It is if Bouman sparks the offense. It isn\'t if we continue to be unsuccessful and it shatters Brook\'s confidence. I think that it honestly falls to Tom Benson here. Is the intention to have Haslett/Loomis run this team next year? If so, Brooks plays. If not then it doesn\'t matter. Same goes to Haslett/Loomis. Is McCarthy here next year regardless of season outcome? If so, Brooks plays. It depends what direction the team will go.
To be totally honest, if I\'m the team owner, my mind is made up that I will be bringing in a new coaching staff next season. I believe we have a decent talent base to work off of, but need a proven second level coach. I need the coach that can field a consistent winner and a natural leader of a team. I would look at Bill Cowher. No, he\'s never won the big game, but he has maintained a consistent quality of product through all sorts of adversity and will be a leader when there is no player to lead. I don\'t like the guy, but Mike Shanahan is another name that would fit. I\'m not going to fold the season to get a better pick, so the news doesn\'t leak out. I try to salvage the egos and respect of the players I want to remain. I would push the current coach to have the hardest practices every week for the rest of the season, because \"if a players going to be a quitter...I want him to quit in practice, not in a game\"-Bear Bryant.

So to sum it up....I have no clue.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 03:29 PM

LOL -- Thanks LummOx. That was good reading...

canucksaint · 10-02-2003, 03:42 PM

Hold on there Billy...
I\'m not blaming AB for everything. I am just looking for a bit of responsiblity to be taken. I would like to see someone step up to the plate. As I said before, I\'m not seeing it from anyone. The QB is the general on the field, he has to lead the troops. If he\'s not up to it, then others have to step in and make up for it. That is not happening on the team.
I\'m not blaming AB for the balls that Donte, Horn or Conwell dropped, but how many balls were not thown on target, how many were picked off?
As for having another QB, I think that sometimes a switch can raise the bar a bit. I am not blaming the QB, just asking him (or someone else) to take responsiblity.
You ask how AB would do if he was playing for TB? Probably much better, they have very vocal leaders on the team, and don\'t need someone to step up. We don\'t have that luxury.

BillyCarpenter1 · 10-02-2003, 03:54 PM

but how many balls were not thown on target, how many were picked off?

Well up unitl last week he was on target more than any other QB in the league except for 1 or 2. His interception rate was also amoung the league leaders. Two of the interceptions he has thrown was because the RECEIVER didn\'t catch the ball. The ball hit him right there in his hands. Believe me I saw it with my own two eyes.

You ask how AB would do if he was playing for TB? Probably much better, they have very vocal leaders on the team, and don\'t need someone to step up. We don\'t have that luxury.

That\'s nice of you to say. But you left out the part that they have a defense that allows the QB to play within the system and not have to try to force things. Brooks hasn\'t been perfect but he\'s played well enough to win 3 of these games. As a matter of fact he played as well or better than anyone else on the team in the first 3 games. Why aren\'t you singling Deuce out after his bad performance against the Titans? I\'ll tell you why... Because it\'s easy to single the QB out and you hear about the QB more from the media. I\'m telling you right now that the QB gets too much credit and too much blame.

canucksaint · 10-02-2003, 04:06 PM

Billy, Not everyone is against AB.
I am not focusing on AB.

This isn\'t just Brooks responsiblity, it is also Duece\'s, Horn\'s, Haz\'s and whoever we still have standing on D

I am asking anyone to step up. I do think that leadership starts at the top. I have already stated that I don\'t think that Haz or any of the Asst add much to the team. I do think that AB has great potental. I just wished that he steped up and took leadership. I have ask that of any other player as well. Just because we ask more of a player doesn\'t mean that we are against them. I like AB. Can he do more? Hell ya. That\'s all I ask.. (well maybe not all...)

10-02-2003, 02:50 PM	#31
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. however all reports are also saying he doesn\'t have the leadership quality. These reports are coming from everywhere execpt where they would be crediable and that\'s the coaches and his teammates. Furthermore, if it takes Aaron having to fire these guys up or if they are playing poorly because they have no confidence in Brooks, then I think those players need to go. They are paid to play like professionals and not blame the QB (which they have not done). How would it look if AB said \" I just can\'t play as well as I\'m suppose to because I have no faith in my receivers because they keep dropping the ball?\"
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-02-2003, 03:00 PM	#32
canucksaint 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 227	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. I agree that I haven\'t heard anything out of the locker room. But the way that Haz is circling the wagons, that doesn\'t suprise me. I am basing this off the look on the sidelines. It all goes back to his big goofy smile. Now that may be more of a nervious reaction (which I think I rememeber you saying), or it could be that he just doesn\'t care. I think that this team lacks the leadership from everywhere. This isn\'t just Brooks responsiblity, it is also Duece\'s, Horn\'s, Haz\'s and whoever we still have standing on D. The problem is, no one has stood up. The last person/people who actually did get this team all fired up are now playing in St. Louis and Miami. AB is probably loosing faith in his recievers and viceversa, and that is probably why he isn\'t playing well. But where is that scramble that he used to have. We know that he is capable of it, but it seems that he would rather sit in the pocket and get nailed all day, then scamble and make plays happen.

10-02-2003, 03:06 PM	#33
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Every mistake is being magnified because of the turnovers and because the defense is allowing to many points. It\'s causing Aaron to have to force things and putting too much pressure on the offense in general. If they can cut out the turnovers and the defense can play respectful -- I think you will see a different team. [Edited on 2/10/2003 by BillyCarpenter1]
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-02-2003, 03:11 PM	#34
canucksaint 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 227	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Granted the D is playing like crap this year. But they also played like crap last year. No difference except all of our injuries. AB still came out looking good last year. As for the turnovers. That\'s AB\'s problem. Is he trying to force things... yup. Has he been doing that for the last 4 years.. yup. That\'s one of the things that they were hoping for when he \"matured\", is that he would stop trying to force plays. I think he still has it in him. Just he needs to play like he\'s fighting for his job/life, like he used to.

10-02-2003, 03:20 PM	#35
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. canucksaint -- I think your trying to place to much blame on AB or the quarterback postion in general. The fact of the matter is we would probably be 1-3 no matter who would have been the QB !! No matter what anyone says, there has never been a QB in history that has won a game by himself. Not Montana, Elway, Peyton, or anyone else. How do you think Aaron would do if he played on the Bucs or Panthers?? This is a team game and those turnovers you speak of that are Aaron\'s problem?? Please !! Of all those turnovers Aaron is responsible for only 2 of them. How exactly are the rest of them Aaron\'s fault? Is he suppose to catch the ball for Donte\' to?
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

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10-02-2003, 03:23 PM	#36
lumm0x Resident antediluvian Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,026	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Billy, Just like you I have lots of guesses and no answers. As much as we like to ride this on Haslett, Venturi & McCarthy, and even the QB, defense, whatever, these players and coaches all know more about football than any of us and they don\'t know the answers. How many teams throughout history have gone through slumps and losing streaks? There is probably a million possibilites to turn it around. Tough practices, easy practices, QB changes, benching players, calling them out in the media..... I guess each is an individual case and there is no proven formula to get this done. I have to fall it onto the shoulders of the coaches because their job description covers this area of the team. Prepare your players to be competetive. As for the QB situation....I like Aaron Brooks. Based on what I\'ve seen of him, he\'s a nice guy, has great measureables, and brings many traits that can be positive in the QB position. He has a strong arm, decent accuracy and velocity, escapability, plays through injury, pretty good throw mechanics, and alot of upside. He also, like everyone else, has many weaknesses. He has poor intangible qualities in my opinion, that no stats can backup. Lack of a fiery disposition, vocal leadership, lead by action, slow reads, lack of pocket prescence, lack of polished play disguise, lack of expereince audibling, etc. He is a very good QB prospect that has enjoyed alot of success and is now in the position, from late last year to today, to experience great adversity. There have been a handful of games that he hasn\'t shown up 100%, but his game hasn\'t deteriorated. It just hasn\'t grown much. I think on a personal level, he is growing, and we\'ll see him be a more involved team member based on his interection I\'ve seen this year. His play disguise and audible calls could be better with coaching and experiencing. He\'s not a born leader, but not every offense needs the QB to be one. It\'s just that our team doesn\'t have one that the eyes will immediately look to the QB position out of historical trend. Is the right decision to sit him down for a bit? Who knows. It is if Bouman sparks the offense. It isn\'t if we continue to be unsuccessful and it shatters Brook\'s confidence. I think that it honestly falls to Tom Benson here. Is the intention to have Haslett/Loomis run this team next year? If so, Brooks plays. If not then it doesn\'t matter. Same goes to Haslett/Loomis. Is McCarthy here next year regardless of season outcome? If so, Brooks plays. It depends what direction the team will go. To be totally honest, if I\'m the team owner, my mind is made up that I will be bringing in a new coaching staff next season. I believe we have a decent talent base to work off of, but need a proven second level coach. I need the coach that can field a consistent winner and a natural leader of a team. I would look at Bill Cowher. No, he\'s never won the big game, but he has maintained a consistent quality of product through all sorts of adversity and will be a leader when there is no player to lead. I don\'t like the guy, but Mike Shanahan is another name that would fit. I\'m not going to fold the season to get a better pick, so the news doesn\'t leak out. I try to salvage the egos and respect of the players I want to remain. I would push the current coach to have the hardest practices every week for the rest of the season, because \"if a players going to be a quitter...I want him to quit in practice, not in a game\"-Bear Bryant. So to sum it up....I have no clue.

10-02-2003, 03:29 PM	#37
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. LOL -- Thanks LummOx. That was good reading...
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-02-2003, 03:42 PM	#38
canucksaint 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 227	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Hold on there Billy... I\'m not blaming AB for everything. I am just looking for a bit of responsiblity to be taken. I would like to see someone step up to the plate. As I said before, I\'m not seeing it from anyone. The QB is the general on the field, he has to lead the troops. If he\'s not up to it, then others have to step in and make up for it. That is not happening on the team. I\'m not blaming AB for the balls that Donte, Horn or Conwell dropped, but how many balls were not thown on target, how many were picked off? As for having another QB, I think that sometimes a switch can raise the bar a bit. I am not blaming the QB, just asking him (or someone else) to take responsiblity. You ask how AB would do if he was playing for TB? Probably much better, they have very vocal leaders on the team, and don\'t need someone to step up. We don\'t have that luxury.

10-02-2003, 03:54 PM	#39
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. but how many balls were not thown on target, how many were picked off? Well up unitl last week he was on target more than any other QB in the league except for 1 or 2. His interception rate was also amoung the league leaders. Two of the interceptions he has thrown was because the RECEIVER didn\'t catch the ball. The ball hit him right there in his hands. Believe me I saw it with my own two eyes. You ask how AB would do if he was playing for TB? Probably much better, they have very vocal leaders on the team, and don\'t need someone to step up. We don\'t have that luxury. That\'s nice of you to say. But you left out the part that they have a defense that allows the QB to play within the system and not have to try to force things. Brooks hasn\'t been perfect but he\'s played well enough to win 3 of these games. As a matter of fact he played as well or better than anyone else on the team in the first 3 games. Why aren\'t you singling Deuce out after his bad performance against the Titans? I\'ll tell you why... Because it\'s easy to single the QB out and you hear about the QB more from the media. I\'m telling you right now that the QB gets too much credit and too much blame.
BillyCarpenter1 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,209

10-02-2003, 04:06 PM	#40
canucksaint 100th Post Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 227	Trouble Brewing in Big Easy. Billy, Not everyone is against AB. I am not focusing on AB. This isn\'t just Brooks responsiblity, it is also Duece\'s, Horn\'s, Haz\'s and whoever we still have standing on D I am asking anyone to step up. I do think that leadership starts at the top. I have already stated that I don\'t think that Haz or any of the Asst add much to the team. I do think that AB has great potental. I just wished that he steped up and took leadership. I have ask that of any other player as well. Just because we ask more of a player doesn\'t mean that we are against them. I like AB. Can he do more? Hell ya. That\'s all I ask.. (well maybe not all...)