Bounty evidence may have been fake.

Ava's Daddy · 04-11-2012, 12:48 PM

If it is or isn't is probably of little matter now. People have their minds made up one way or the other. I don't care. The main reason I would like for it to be proven fake (at least the pay for injury scenario cause they already admitted to pay for performance) is how stupid it would make goodell and all the sky is falling crowd look. Otherwise let's get past this crap cause it serves no purpose to keep re hashing what can't be changed. Get ready for an exciting season to come and get brees to retire as a saint.

SaintGup · 04-11-2012, 12:58 PM

Have just listened to the audio on the Canal Street Chronicles. Are you telling me, that Goodell punished the Saints with the severest penalty known due to information that may have been fabricated, that the tape on Greg Williams was edited and had an important statement at the end which was not heard? Next thing is you'll be telling me that Roger Goodell is more interested in the liability of the NFL than player safety! Which we all know isn't true...

mikesaintfan · 04-11-2012, 01:30 PM

i think the players are safe...they have a union...i dont think HC's have a union

AlaskaSaints · 04-11-2012, 01:30 PM

Put Sheriff Joe Arpaio on the case! He'll get to the bottom of it!
His investigators are specialists at sniffing out forged documents.

LOL

Alaska

mikesaintfan · 04-11-2012, 01:34 PM

Originally Posted by AlaskaSaints

Put Sheriff Joe Arpaio on the case! He'll get to the bottom of it!
His investigators are specialists at sniffing out forged documents.

LOL

Alaska

good analagy....2 dictators with forged documents and nothing will be done

BGWhoDat · 04-11-2012, 04:35 PM

Originally Posted by Halo

The entire situation is just weird.
The problem is the NFL has no "Judicial system" in place to handle these matters, it's just a dictatorship.
The Saints are the perfect scapegoat for the Commish and the NFL to make their point.

I, like so many other Saints fans, grow so weary of the entire Bountygate matter that I'm ready to completely move on.

Would need Watergate-esque hard cold evidence to make a case, and by the time anything got started, draft and training camp will be underway and we'll be watching our team do whatever in their power to salvage a chance at a superbowl.

If pending suspensions cripple the team, then I'd say YES the Saints as an organization need to take the commish down not by legal means but by manipulation of the owners to have him removed or reverse harsh suspensions.

Loomis, Sean Payton and at least Vilma and a few others will not be factors in this season. It just is what it is.

Great journalism on the part of our friends at Canal Street Chronicles - really appreciate this contribution.

Problem is, all the other owners are against the Saints.

BGWhoDat · 04-11-2012, 04:41 PM

I'm glad ya'll enjoyed the post as much as I did when CSC posted it. I listened and thought it was definitely worth posting on here given the alleged whistleblower leak.

That's why the NFLPA wants to see the evidence because if they believe this evidence doesn't stand up, they have lawyers on stand-by to appeal the process outside of Goodell.

I think whether or not they actually paid players for cart-offs, the intent was there, and that's the NFL's basis of punishment. Sort of like carrying around marijuana with "intent to distribute" when in reality you didn't.

It's pretty ridiculous. I see the players getting a "slap on the wrist" outside Vilma's alleged bounty payment. The thing with Vilma is, how do they have proof he actually did that and that also wasn't fabricated?

Euphoria · 04-11-2012, 04:56 PM

Some people are still in denial I see.

If there was no program then ya think with your ass on the line you'd come out and say "look Mo Fo's... we didn't have one". I know I would but the apologized for it already, hmmm.

BGWhoDat · 04-11-2012, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

Some people are still in denial I see.

If there was no program then ya think with your ass on the line you'd come out and say "look Mo Fo's... we didn't have one". I know I would but the apologized for it already, hmmm.

A system in place and carrying out are two different things.

I can give you a gun, set up a meeting, and tell you to kill someone. That doesn't mean you went out to do it.

Unless the NFL in their documents have actual proof that these transactions went for injury specifically, they have absolutely no basis for serious punishment except speculation.

The Saints admitted to performance incentives such as interceptions. What's to say that the money in the envelopes that were exchanged weren't for those? You can't speculate and hand out serious suspensions and such for something if you can't prove what the money was exchanged for. That'll be the NFLPA's stance, and you bet that will hold up in court.

The coaches owned up to having a system in place, therefore their punishment is what it is. However if it can't be proven the players were paid for injury specifically, as in, no doubt the money was for that, then sever punishment isn't warranted because they have no proof that they acted on the system. Not every "illegal hit" was due to a bounty.

Euphoria · 04-11-2012, 05:39 PM

If you give me a gun and tell me to kill someone... you still go to jail.

I don't have to actually go and kill someone for you to go to jail.

04-11-2012, 12:58 PM	#22
SaintGup 500th Post Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: London, England Posts: 580	Wow! Have just listened to the audio on the Canal Street Chronicles. Are you telling me, that Goodell punished the Saints with the severest penalty known due to information that may have been fabricated, that the tape on Greg Williams was edited and had an important statement at the end which was not heard? Next thing is you'll be telling me that Roger Goodell is more interested in the liability of the NFL than player safety! Which we all know isn't true... Halo, saintfan, SloMotion and 1 others like this.

04-11-2012, 01:34 PM	#25
mikesaintfan 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2006 Location: new jersey Posts: 1,070	Originally Posted by AlaskaSaints Put Sheriff Joe Arpaio on the case! He'll get to the bottom of it! His investigators are specialists at sniffing out forged documents. LOL Alaska good analagy....2 dictators with forged documents and nothing will be done

04-11-2012, 04:35 PM	#26
BGWhoDat Who Dat Writer Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 241	Originally Posted by Halo The entire situation is just weird. The problem is the NFL has no "Judicial system" in place to handle these matters, it's just a dictatorship. The Saints are the perfect scapegoat for the Commish and the NFL to make their point. I, like so many other Saints fans, grow so weary of the entire Bountygate matter that I'm ready to completely move on. Would need Watergate-esque hard cold evidence to make a case, and by the time anything got started, draft and training camp will be underway and we'll be watching our team do whatever in their power to salvage a chance at a superbowl. If pending suspensions cripple the team, then I'd say YES the Saints as an organization need to take the commish down not by legal means but by manipulation of the owners to have him removed or reverse harsh suspensions. Loomis, Sean Payton and at least Vilma and a few others will not be factors in this season. It just is what it is. Great journalism on the part of our friends at Canal Street Chronicles - really appreciate this contribution. Problem is, all the other owners are against the Saints.

04-11-2012, 04:41 PM	#27
BGWhoDat Who Dat Writer Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 241	I'm glad ya'll enjoyed the post as much as I did when CSC posted it. I listened and thought it was definitely worth posting on here given the alleged whistleblower leak. That's why the NFLPA wants to see the evidence because if they believe this evidence doesn't stand up, they have lawyers on stand-by to appeal the process outside of Goodell. I think whether or not they actually paid players for cart-offs, the intent was there, and that's the NFL's basis of punishment. Sort of like carrying around marijuana with "intent to distribute" when in reality you didn't. It's pretty ridiculous. I see the players getting a "slap on the wrist" outside Vilma's alleged bounty payment. The thing with Vilma is, how do they have proof he actually did that and that also wasn't fabricated?
	Twitter: @BGWhoDat Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/bgwhodat Website: http://www.rantsports.com

04-11-2012, 05:03 PM	#29
BGWhoDat Who Dat Writer Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: New Orleans, LA Posts: 241	Originally Posted by Euphoria Some people are still in denial I see. If there was no program then ya think with your ass on the line you'd come out and say "look Mo Fo's... we didn't have one". I know I would but the apologized for it already, hmmm. A system in place and carrying out are two different things. I can give you a gun, set up a meeting, and tell you to kill someone. That doesn't mean you went out to do it. Unless the NFL in their documents have actual proof that these transactions went for injury specifically, they have absolutely no basis for serious punishment except speculation. The Saints admitted to performance incentives such as interceptions. What's to say that the money in the envelopes that were exchanged weren't for those? You can't speculate and hand out serious suspensions and such for something if you can't prove what the money was exchanged for. That'll be the NFLPA's stance, and you bet that will hold up in court. The coaches owned up to having a system in place, therefore their punishment is what it is. However if it can't be proven the players were paid for injury specifically, as in, no doubt the money was for that, then sever punishment isn't warranted because they have no proof that they acted on the system. Not every "illegal hit" was due to a bounty.
	Twitter: @BGWhoDat Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/bgwhodat Website: http://www.rantsports.com

04-11-2012, 12:48 PM	#21
Ava's Daddy Rookie Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: slidell Posts: 10	If it is or isn't is probably of little matter now. People have their minds made up one way or the other. I don't care. The main reason I would like for it to be proven fake (at least the pay for injury scenario cause they already admitted to pay for performance) is how stupid it would make goodell and all the sky is falling crowd look. Otherwise let's get past this crap cause it serves no purpose to keep re hashing what can't be changed. Get ready for an exciting season to come and get brees to retire as a saint.

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04-11-2012, 01:30 PM	#23
mikesaintfan 1000 Posts + Join Date: May 2006 Location: new jersey Posts: 1,070	i think the players are safe...they have a union...i dont think HC's have a union

04-11-2012, 01:30 PM	#24
AlaskaSaints 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Anchorage, AK Posts: 2,484 Blog Entries: 2	Put Sheriff Joe Arpaio on the case! He'll get to the bottom of it! His investigators are specialists at sniffing out forged documents. LOL Alaska

04-11-2012, 04:56 PM	#28
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Some people are still in denial I see. If there was no program then ya think with your ass on the line you'd come out and say "look Mo Fo's... we didn't have one". I know I would but the apologized for it already, hmmm.

04-11-2012, 05:39 PM	#30
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	If you give me a gun and tell me to kill someone... you still go to jail. I don't have to actually go and kill someone for you to go to jail.

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