Graham is not better than Gronkowski

burningmetal · 06-25-2012, 08:17 AM

Originally Posted by pherein

Thats a Very good point. He might have been a little clumsy last season with all the added weight, that never occurred to me.

There is that aswell, but mainly I meant that he would need to bulk up more to break tackles like Gronkowski. I just didn't word it quite right. But to your point, he may indeed still be adjusting to playing at a higher weight. I think his weight is about right, at this point, being a receiving tight end.

burningmetal · 06-25-2012, 08:20 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

YAC is a bit different than breaking tackles. If Graham gets behind the LB's and splits the safeties he can get 40 to 50 yards after the catch without ever being touched.

I think he gets tackled too easily for a man his size. He's not bad, just not as good as he can be.

As he improves he'll start turning those 7 - 8 yard gains into 10 - 15 yard gains.

He needs to improve his Yards After Contact more than he does his Yards After Catch.

Understood, but Jimmy is a different breed. He isn't as strong to break tackles, but plenty strong enough to fight for position and then faster than any TE out there to get away if he can manage to escape the initial defender.

I don't think you'll ever see Graham mauling people over the middle, but I think he'll develop some elusiveness.

ScottF · 06-25-2012, 10:22 AM

Graham is still pretty raw fundamentally, so comparisons right now might not be fair. He still cuts off routes and misses the occasional blocking assignment. He's the perfect example of a talent that will get markedly with experience.
Is he better than Gronk? If it saves us money on his contract, I'll say no.

mutineer10 · 06-25-2012, 10:40 AM

They're both awfully good ... and fortunately for TE fans like myself, there's a veritable cornucopia of good TE's in the league right now.

Like most here, it looks to me like Gronk throws his weight around a little better than Graham, but Graham probably tops Gronk in speed & athleticism. Criticisms of either are really nit-picking, though.

papz · 06-25-2012, 10:49 AM

1. Gronk
2. Graham

It's not like it's a slap in the face to Graham or anything. Gronk is 2 years younger, more polished(due to playing football throughout his career), a better blocker, and has better hands as well as concentration. He's also built like a tank.

It's like the Brady/Manning/Brees debate. Does it really even matter? They're all elite beast.

Ashley · 06-25-2012, 10:58 AM

Originally Posted by SloMotion

To me, Gronkowski vs Graham is like arguing Brees vs Stafford ... the first guy is a record-setting, polished veteran and the second guy is right behind him, making headlines with a bright future ahead, but not quite ready to take the #1 spot ... yet.

I'd take either one on my team, but if I had a vote, it would be Gronkowski #1/Graham #2 ... for now.

Like what you had to say in the first paragraph. But dead wrong in the second. Well its like saying i like Coke better than Pepsi. It's the same thing..., matter of opinion. Mine Graham all day. Gronk is like dink, but if I would be too, money young, being a stud. Party Party like a star... ha, I would be in the league maybe three years???

pherein · 06-25-2012, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by papz

1. Gronk
2. Graham

It's not like it's a slap in the face to Graham or anything. Gronk is 2 years younger, more polished(due to playing football throughout his career), a better blocker, and has better hands as well as concentration. He's also built like a tank.

It's like the Brady/Manning/Brees debate. Does it really even matter? They're all elite beast.

I agree with everything except hand and concentration during the catch. I think Graham is clearly better at this, and the stats and visuals support it.
Gronk doesn't have the vertical or reach Graham has, and Brady rarely throws him a hard one to catch. Some of the stuff Graham pulls down is WR Sh*t, its nuts. Gronk wouldn't make those catches.

Rob Gronkowski Highlights 2011-2012 - YouTube

Jimmy Graham 2011-12 Highlights \|HD\| - YouTube

I still say their even

goguxxx · 06-26-2012, 12:39 AM

The guy used to play basketball,give him a brake.He is what he is,but what worries me is the fact that after his rookie contract he will ask gazillions and we dont have a second good TE like the Pats have in Hernandez.

SloMotion · 06-26-2012, 06:33 AM

Originally Posted by Ashley

Like what you had to say in the first paragraph. But dead wrong in the second. Well its like saying i like Coke better than Pepsi. It's the same thing..., matter of opinion. Mine Graham all day. Gronk is like dink, but if I would be too, money young, being a stud. Party Party like a star... ha, I would be in the league maybe three years???

Yeah, I agree it's like Coke/Pepsi when you're debating two guys so close in talent #1 and #2, but I gave Gronkowski a slight edge because he does what I like to see a TE do, run block/YAC, a little better then Graham ... now, if we're considering off-field personality & shenanigens, that's a knock on Gronkowski and I'm putting Graham #1 all day long ... I hate that 'party-like-a-rock-star/gangsta' persona so many of today's athletes like to project, but that's for another thread.

Saint_LB · 06-26-2012, 06:45 AM

Originally Posted by goguxxx

The guy used to play basketball,give him a brake.

Oh...STOP IT!!!

06-25-2012, 08:17 AM	#21
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Originally Posted by pherein Thats a Very good point. He might have been a little clumsy last season with all the added weight, that never occurred to me. There is that aswell, but mainly I meant that he would need to bulk up more to break tackles like Gronkowski. I just didn't word it quite right. But to your point, he may indeed still be adjusting to playing at a higher weight. I think his weight is about right, at this point, being a receiving tight end. pherein likes this.

06-25-2012, 08:20 AM	#22
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Originally Posted by Danno YAC is a bit different than breaking tackles. If Graham gets behind the LB's and splits the safeties he can get 40 to 50 yards after the catch without ever being touched. I think he gets tackled too easily for a man his size. He's not bad, just not as good as he can be. As he improves he'll start turning those 7 - 8 yard gains into 10 - 15 yard gains. He needs to improve his Yards After Contact more than he does his Yards After Catch. Understood, but Jimmy is a different breed. He isn't as strong to break tackles, but plenty strong enough to fight for position and then faster than any TE out there to get away if he can manage to escape the initial defender. I don't think you'll ever see Graham mauling people over the middle, but I think he'll develop some elusiveness.

06-25-2012, 10:22 AM	#23
ScottF 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Atlanta Posts: 6,324	Graham is still pretty raw fundamentally, so comparisons right now might not be fair. He still cuts off routes and misses the occasional blocking assignment. He's the perfect example of a talent that will get markedly with experience. Is he better than Gronk? If it saves us money on his contract, I'll say no. Rugby Saint II likes this.

06-25-2012, 10:49 AM	#25
papz Problem? Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New Orleans Posts: 11,737	1. Gronk 2. Graham It's not like it's a slap in the face to Graham or anything. Gronk is 2 years younger, more polished(due to playing football throughout his career), a better blocker, and has better hands as well as concentration. He's also built like a tank. It's like the Brady/Manning/Brees debate. Does it really even matter? They're all elite beast. Danno, Crusader, ScottF and 1 others like this.

06-25-2012, 10:58 AM	#26
Ashley Site Donor Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Colorado Springs Co Posts: 2,760	Originally Posted by SloMotion To me, Gronkowski vs Graham is like arguing Brees vs Stafford ... the first guy is a record-setting, polished veteran and the second guy is right behind him, making headlines with a bright future ahead, but not quite ready to take the #1 spot ... yet. I'd take either one on my team, but if I had a vote, it would be Gronkowski #1/Graham #2 ... for now. Like what you had to say in the first paragraph. But dead wrong in the second. Well its like saying i like Coke better than Pepsi. It's the same thing..., matter of opinion. Mine Graham all day. Gronk is like dink, but if I would be too, money young, being a stud. Party Party like a star... ha, I would be in the league maybe three years??? Rugby Saint II likes this.

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06-25-2012, 10:40 AM	#24
mutineer10 Site Donor Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Baton Rouge, LA Posts: 1,739	They're both awfully good ... and fortunately for TE fans like myself, there's a veritable cornucopia of good TE's in the league right now. Like most here, it looks to me like Gronk throws his weight around a little better than Graham, but Graham probably tops Gronk in speed & athleticism. Criticisms of either are really nit-picking, though.

06-26-2012, 12:39 AM	#28
goguxxx Registered Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Romania Posts: 63	The guy used to play basketball,give him a brake.He is what he is,but what worries me is the fact that after his rookie contract he will ask gazillions and we dont have a second good TE like the Pats have in Hernandez.

06-26-2012, 06:33 AM	#29
SloMotion 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 6,776 Blog Entries: 15	Originally Posted by Ashley Like what you had to say in the first paragraph. But dead wrong in the second. Well its like saying i like Coke better than Pepsi. It's the same thing..., matter of opinion. Mine Graham all day. Gronk is like dink, but if I would be too, money young, being a stud. Party Party like a star... ha, I would be in the league maybe three years??? Yeah, I agree it's like Coke/Pepsi when you're debating two guys so close in talent #1 and #2, but I gave Gronkowski a slight edge because he does what I like to see a TE do, run block/YAC, a little better then Graham ... now, if we're considering off-field personality & shenanigens, that's a knock on Gronkowski and I'm putting Graham #1 all day long ... I hate that 'party-like-a-rock-star/gangsta' persona so many of today's athletes like to project, but that's for another thread.

06-26-2012, 06:45 AM	#30
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894	Originally Posted by goguxxx The guy used to play basketball,give him a brake. Oh...STOP IT!!!
Saint_LB Deuce Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 2,894

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