QB only

spkb25 · 01-27-2005, 11:57 PM

i\'d like to get a rookie in here and keep brooks for at least one more year as the starter. if you dont see someone doing worse then looom at the giants with eli. im not ready for a complete overhaul just yet. i\'d like to give it one more year. but we have to bring someone in. he is not our answer anymore for the future like i once thought. but i\'d give him one more year.

spkb25 · 01-27-2005, 11:58 PM

i didnt mean loom at the giants i meant look at the giants sorry about that

SaintFanInATLHELL · 01-28-2005, 12:18 AM

Keep him and bring in some quality competition.

SFIAH

LongTimeFan · 01-28-2005, 09:21 PM

A rookie?, are you guys kidding me?
Look, I don\'t think AB is a top 5 QB first of all but If AB would be traded than I want a top 5 QB not a rookie, a rookie would really set us back, we have a good RB and WR\'s, with free agents going and coming all the time wouldn\'t you think the time for the Saints is in the next two years?, I for one think we will make the playoffs in the next couple of years, start a rookie and now we\'re looking at 3-5 years if we were to be lucky and we all know the Saints have no luck.
the only way that I would want AB traded would be for a better QB (top 5), like a Drew Brees type, a QB who can come in and improve our chances of winning, I don\'t want no freaking rookie, look at the Giants, you think that they will be a winning team soon with a young Eli? I say no
Whcih rookie would you want to bring in thinkinh you could win in the next 2 years?

LongTimeFan

[Edited on 29/1/2005 by LongTimeFan]

saintswhodi · 01-28-2005, 09:52 PM

Hey LongTime, look at Eli? Look at Roethlisberger. Honestly, I would rather have Eli over AB last year, and this year. How can you say, AB is not a top 5 QB, then say but if we trade him I want a top 5 QB? Huh? IF, HUGE IF, AB is a top 20 qb(around number 20 by most stats) if we get a guy who is top 15, isn\'t that better? Peyton Manning started as a rookie and was 3-13, think that has worked out for the Colts since? I understand how you feel, but if we aren\'t winning with AB, does it really matter if we have a rookie in there now? McNabb started as a rookie also. So did Carr, on an expansion team, and he is now posting the same record as AB. Explain to me again how a rookie can be worse? A rookie set us back? AB is setting us back NOW, and for the last FOUR years. He led the league in red zone turnovers this past season. Fumbles the year before. I think a rookie can come in and do that just fine at a lower salary, don\'t you?

LongTimeFan · 01-28-2005, 10:15 PM

How often does a Roethilsberger come along?, not very often why I\'m not a big fan of rookies, now when you look into the free agent market than I feel that you have a much better chance to win sooner than later with the free-agent player, that goes for all postions....
I agree, AB make dum mistakes, again, look at Eli this season, he looked awful and will look almost as bad next year..
How do you feel the OL played this season?
Our line this season was the worst that I\'ve seen in sometime, hell even when Deuch came back close to 100% the line never gave him a chance, no holes, no blocks..
In a past post I said that I wanted Brooks traded, cut or whatever at the end of last season, my thinking for this season was the poor effort by our OL, did you notice how Brooks had almost no time to look down field?, I did
A lot of plays he had only 2-3 seconds per play to work with,
Could another QB have done better?, like let say Manning, maybe, but who\'s to know for sure.
What makes Manning so good is he has all the time that he needs to look the entire field over, lots of protection for him.
A friend of mine asked me how Brooks would have played this year if he was the starter for the Colts, I said that Brooks would have had a better chance to play well there,
I remember well here on this site whenBrooks became the starter when Blake got hurt, he had a good line then, people here loved him because he helped win our very first playoof game, wouldn\'t you say that we had a much better OL then compared to the last couple of years?
I will say this though, Brooks will have to learn a new system next year, it may set him back big time, so if the Saints front office doesn\'t see Brooks as a Saints in the very near future than and only than I say go ahead and draft a rookie and build a team around the rookie QB.
We\'re just to close right now to have a set back, the next 2 years in important for the Saints, if we can\'t make it to the playoffs during this time then it\'s time to try a totally new system, and then the the rebuilding begin

LKelley67 · 01-28-2005, 10:15 PM

the more i have contemplated 6mil a yr the more i think we could do better with the money. i favor getting the defense up to mediocrity at least and make do with a make do qb like kitna with a top flight youngster in the wings. there have been some darn journeyman qbs in the superbowl with decent defenses. subtract AB and there are still some quality tools on offense. but even if not that, if you insisted on a top tier qb... when getting rid of AB, DH, and JP that is 20mil fresh cap to spend. that could land a hasslebeck, holcombe, ot garcia (via trade). any of those if not statistically better than leon would not be worse. at least do 7-9 to 9-7 with a fresh face (and fewer gaffes).

saintswhodi · 01-28-2005, 10:33 PM

Agreed LKelley, the money can be better spent on a QB of equal value as AB either being a rookie or a free agent, that would cost us less. More money for other positions.

LongTime, noone denies the line was poor this year, they were better last year, did AB lead the league in fumbles, half of them when noone even touched him? Yup. Did you know the Saints were 7-4 before Blake got hurt since you brought up that time? You know AB\'s record, 3-2 to finish the regular season, 4-3 overall that first year, he has been medioce ever since. So has the team. Did you also know AB led ALL qbs in red zone turnovers this year? Did you also know that on the 4 game winning streak, AB played absolutely terrible in 11 out of 16 quarters, when the line AND defense were better? Again, when Eli makes mistakes, at least you can say he is a rookie. Did you know he almost led his team to a victory over the Steelers?Team with the best record in the league? Did you know his line and receivers are crap compared to ours? So I would choose Eli over AB in a heartbeat. So blame the line, I have seen AB look horrible WITH good protection. He has done NOTHING in 5 years that I don\'t think a rookie could do with the same offense. I simply disagree. If Peyton Manning was in our offense, we would be in the playoffs. I have yet to see anyone here deny that.

GumboBC · 01-28-2005, 10:42 PM

saintwhodi --

You want to talk about QB and win/losses?

Tell me this.

Eli Manning vs. Ben Rothlisberger.

Both Rookies. Eli Drafted #1 and Ben drafted 22nd.

What was Eli\'s win/loss record?

What was Ben\'s win/loss record.

Why the difference? Hey, both were rookies!!

saintswhodi · 01-28-2005, 11:06 PM

If Eli played for the Steelers, he woulda been 15-1 also. Look what happened when Ben played like AB, they got bounced from the playoffs. He looked like crap in the first playoff game verses the Jets, but Brien kicked his team out of a win. Then against the Pats he did NOTHING in the first half but turn the ball over and not score(sound familiar) then pad numbers when the game was over(sounds familiar). Yeah, I see the difference. One similarity between Ben and Eli though, either would be an improvement over what we have. That\'s my point.

01-27-2005, 11:57 PM	#11
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,097	QB only i\'d like to get a rookie in here and keep brooks for at least one more year as the starter. if you dont see someone doing worse then looom at the giants with eli. im not ready for a complete overhaul just yet. i\'d like to give it one more year. but we have to bring someone in. he is not our answer anymore for the future like i once thought. but i\'d give him one more year.

01-27-2005, 11:58 PM	#12
spkb25 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 13,097	QB only i didnt mean loom at the giants i meant look at the giants sorry about that

01-28-2005, 12:18 AM	#13
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,773	QB only Keep him and bring in some quality competition. SFIAH

01-28-2005, 09:21 PM	#14
LongTimeFan Moderator Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Louisiana Posts: 2,403	QB only A rookie?, are you guys kidding me? Look, I don\'t think AB is a top 5 QB first of all but If AB would be traded than I want a top 5 QB not a rookie, a rookie would really set us back, we have a good RB and WR\'s, with free agents going and coming all the time wouldn\'t you think the time for the Saints is in the next two years?, I for one think we will make the playoffs in the next couple of years, start a rookie and now we\'re looking at 3-5 years if we were to be lucky and we all know the Saints have no luck. the only way that I would want AB traded would be for a better QB (top 5), like a Drew Brees type, a QB who can come in and improve our chances of winning, I don\'t want no freaking rookie, look at the Giants, you think that they will be a winning team soon with a young Eli? I say no Whcih rookie would you want to bring in thinkinh you could win in the next 2 years? LongTimeFan [Edited on 29/1/2005 by LongTimeFan]
	Rest In Peace JoeSam, thanks for everything my friend.

01-28-2005, 09:52 PM	#15
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	QB only Hey LongTime, look at Eli? Look at Roethlisberger. Honestly, I would rather have Eli over AB last year, and this year. How can you say, AB is not a top 5 QB, then say but if we trade him I want a top 5 QB? Huh? IF, HUGE IF, AB is a top 20 qb(around number 20 by most stats) if we get a guy who is top 15, isn\'t that better? Peyton Manning started as a rookie and was 3-13, think that has worked out for the Colts since? I understand how you feel, but if we aren\'t winning with AB, does it really matter if we have a rookie in there now? McNabb started as a rookie also. So did Carr, on an expansion team, and he is now posting the same record as AB. Explain to me again how a rookie can be worse? A rookie set us back? AB is setting us back NOW, and for the last FOUR years. He led the league in red zone turnovers this past season. Fumbles the year before. I think a rookie can come in and do that just fine at a lower salary, don\'t you?

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01-28-2005, 10:15 PM	#16
LongTimeFan Moderator Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Louisiana Posts: 2,403	QB only How often does a Roethilsberger come along?, not very often why I\'m not a big fan of rookies, now when you look into the free agent market than I feel that you have a much better chance to win sooner than later with the free-agent player, that goes for all postions.... I agree, AB make dum mistakes, again, look at Eli this season, he looked awful and will look almost as bad next year.. How do you feel the OL played this season? Our line this season was the worst that I\'ve seen in sometime, hell even when Deuch came back close to 100% the line never gave him a chance, no holes, no blocks.. In a past post I said that I wanted Brooks traded, cut or whatever at the end of last season, my thinking for this season was the poor effort by our OL, did you notice how Brooks had almost no time to look down field?, I did A lot of plays he had only 2-3 seconds per play to work with, Could another QB have done better?, like let say Manning, maybe, but who\'s to know for sure. What makes Manning so good is he has all the time that he needs to look the entire field over, lots of protection for him. A friend of mine asked me how Brooks would have played this year if he was the starter for the Colts, I said that Brooks would have had a better chance to play well there, I remember well here on this site whenBrooks became the starter when Blake got hurt, he had a good line then, people here loved him because he helped win our very first playoof game, wouldn\'t you say that we had a much better OL then compared to the last couple of years? I will say this though, Brooks will have to learn a new system next year, it may set him back big time, so if the Saints front office doesn\'t see Brooks as a Saints in the very near future than and only than I say go ahead and draft a rookie and build a team around the rookie QB. We\'re just to close right now to have a set back, the next 2 years in important for the Saints, if we can\'t make it to the playoffs during this time then it\'s time to try a totally new system, and then the the rebuilding begin
	Rest In Peace JoeSam, thanks for everything my friend.

01-28-2005, 10:15 PM	#17
LKelley67 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: baton rouge Posts: 2,540	QB only the more i have contemplated 6mil a yr the more i think we could do better with the money. i favor getting the defense up to mediocrity at least and make do with a make do qb like kitna with a top flight youngster in the wings. there have been some darn journeyman qbs in the superbowl with decent defenses. subtract AB and there are still some quality tools on offense. but even if not that, if you insisted on a top tier qb... when getting rid of AB, DH, and JP that is 20mil fresh cap to spend. that could land a hasslebeck, holcombe, ot garcia (via trade). any of those if not statistically better than leon would not be worse. at least do 7-9 to 9-7 with a fresh face (and fewer gaffes).

01-28-2005, 10:33 PM	#18
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	QB only Agreed LKelley, the money can be better spent on a QB of equal value as AB either being a rookie or a free agent, that would cost us less. More money for other positions. LongTime, noone denies the line was poor this year, they were better last year, did AB lead the league in fumbles, half of them when noone even touched him? Yup. Did you know the Saints were 7-4 before Blake got hurt since you brought up that time? You know AB\'s record, 3-2 to finish the regular season, 4-3 overall that first year, he has been medioce ever since. So has the team. Did you also know AB led ALL qbs in red zone turnovers this year? Did you also know that on the 4 game winning streak, AB played absolutely terrible in 11 out of 16 quarters, when the line AND defense were better? Again, when Eli makes mistakes, at least you can say he is a rookie. Did you know he almost led his team to a victory over the Steelers?Team with the best record in the league? Did you know his line and receivers are crap compared to ours? So I would choose Eli over AB in a heartbeat. So blame the line, I have seen AB look horrible WITH good protection. He has done NOTHING in 5 years that I don\'t think a rookie could do with the same offense. I simply disagree. If Peyton Manning was in our offense, we would be in the playoffs. I have yet to see anyone here deny that.

01-28-2005, 10:42 PM	#19
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	QB only saintwhodi -- You want to talk about QB and win/losses? Tell me this. Eli Manning vs. Ben Rothlisberger. Both Rookies. Eli Drafted #1 and Ben drafted 22nd. What was Eli\'s win/loss record? What was Ben\'s win/loss record. Why the difference? Hey, both were rookies!!
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

01-28-2005, 11:06 PM	#20
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	QB only If Eli played for the Steelers, he woulda been 15-1 also. Look what happened when Ben played like AB, they got bounced from the playoffs. He looked like crap in the first playoff game verses the Jets, but Brien kicked his team out of a win. Then against the Pats he did NOTHING in the first half but turn the ball over and not score(sound familiar) then pad numbers when the game was over(sounds familiar). Yeah, I see the difference. One similarity between Ben and Eli though, either would be an improvement over what we have. That\'s my point.