AB doomed Braylon Edwards

GumboBC · 02-05-2005, 05:34 PM

saintswhodi --

I\'m pretty good at reading people. And you don\'t seem like the type of person who doesn\'t give 100%... no matter who your boss might be.

You seem too competetive to be like that. At least on here.

I think you just said that to try and prove a point?

saintswhodi · 02-05-2005, 06:24 PM

Definitely. I am all out at MOST things I do, not everything. But from being in the Army, and in military intelligence no less, I have seen how shoddy leadership can effect morale and effort given. I had my down days too, but more often than not I always gave my all. I had many fellow soldiers though who did not simply cause they did not believe in the ability of those leading them. And low morale is like a virus, it spreads and soon more and more are not believing in the leadership and it gets bad all around. I just know from experience how much poor leadership can doom you and how much competent leadership can help.

ScottyRo · 02-05-2005, 06:37 PM

I think you\'re both pretty close to being right.

I think players should put out 100% regardless of who the QB is or whatever. Catching balls is the main thing WRs are supposed to do. Since our guys are having trouble with it, I can only say that they aren\'t focusing as they should. That\'s their problem.

On the other side, some leaders can take a group of individuals and make them more than they were capable of without that leader. AB lacks the ability to do this.

Catching passes shouldn\'t be as difficult as some of our WR, including Horn, are making it out to be. Someof this must be physiological in that we all know AB throws darts and bullets without much, if any, touch on the ball. He\'s got a strong arm and it\'s got to be pretty difficult to catch a hard thrown ball - especially on short routes. It may be impossible but an investigation into how far downfield most of the drops occur may prove this to be the case.

GumboBC · 02-05-2005, 06:40 PM

I just know from experience how much poor leadership can doom you and how much competent leadership can help

I can agree with that. But not how it relates to Aaron Brooks.

Here\'s the thing. Leaders need to have the ability to make changes if they can\'t get their followers to follow.

In the military, the personell have ranks. The higher the rank, the more power they have. In other words, a general can cause a soldier to suffer if he doesn\'t do his job. If he didn\'t have that ability, I suspect there would be chaos and you\'d have a bunch of soldiers that didn\'t try nearly as hard. Afterall, there would be no concequinces to suffer.

I don\'t see where Brooks can do anything to a player. He can\'t put him on the bench. He can\'t cut him. He can\'t do too much.

So, leadership at the QB position is much different than a general in the military.

Maybe Haslett is the one who isn\'t a great leader?

He\'s the one that\'s got the power.

Now, I think if we\'ve got some players who need Brooks in order to get their act together, then we really need to look at those players closely.

I know of NO player on the offense who Brooks could help.

Do you?

saintswhodi · 02-05-2005, 07:59 PM

This isn\'t about who Brooks can \"help.\" It is about how improved leadership from him may cause others players around him to react. Can affect how much effort they put out. Players can help themselves, but they are human. They aren\'t robots. You can\'t say do your job no matter what your personal feelings are cause no matter if they get paid to do that or not, they are humans. Leadership from Brooks may cayse his lineman to dig in harder on a block, may cause Donte to cut harder on a route, may cause a RB to put his head down for that extra yard. He doesn\'t have to \"help\" anyone. What he should be able to do is lay it on the line every game, which you know he doesn\'t, and inspire his teammates to do the same, which we know he doesn\'t. People tend to see football players as robots who should do their jobs no matter what. I don\'t. I realize many factors effect how you perform, and Brooks\' inability or unwillingness to grab a leadership role effects this team more than can be measured I feel. But ti\'s all a matter of opinion and how you feel about leadership. You see it as diddly poo. That\'s cool. I and many others do not.

FireVenturi · 02-05-2005, 08:00 PM

and almost hurt Mark Clayton as well with awful passes at the College Football Challenge on Fox. Other than that, if he put some touch on some of those balls he throws to our guys, we may see a new AB.

Besides that one pass to Edwards he looked fine to me, but AB is the only Qb in the NFL who throws some bad passes.....not

FireVenturi · 02-05-2005, 08:00 PM

But Boo, Pathon, Conwell, and Donte do.

That is cause they can\'t catch :casstet:

FireVenturi · 02-05-2005, 08:01 PM

I suppose AB only throws good passes to Horn..

How about Horn seems to run more deep routes?
But then how is this even a discussion? Joe is one of the best WRs in the league, of course he catches more.

Yea and he throws the ball to hisself :casstet:

GumboBC · 02-05-2005, 08:32 PM

I think some of you are getting inspiration and leadership confused.

Inspiration is the abiltiy to inspire.

Leadership is the ability to lead.

While inspiration can come from a leader, it really doesn\'t have that much to do with being a leader.

Leaders generally have the abilty to make life tough on someone when they are perfoming poorly.

That\'s true of just about any leader:

1. The C.E.O of a company has the power to fire one of his employees.
2. Your boss has the ability to fire you.
3. An Army General has the abiltiy to make a soldiers life miserable.

I don\'t know of many leaders, if any, who don\'t have the power to make changes or punish anyone.

Any leader in the military has the power to punish someone if they aren\'t doing their job properly. That\'s powerful stuff, man.

The military isn\'t set up the way it is for no reason. There are rules and regulations. And there are \"ranks\".

Imagine for a moment if a general didn\'t have the power to punish any of his soldiers? How effective do you think that general would be if he had no power? You think all those soldiers would listen to him if he couldn\'t make their life miserable?

If General McAuthor told me to do 100 push-ups and I knew there wasn\'t a damn thing he could do to me if I didn\'t, then, I probably ain\'t gonna do them.

But if I knew McAuthor was going to send me to Iceland if I didn\'t do them....then......I\'d say......SIR......YES SIR.....RIGHT AWAY SIR!!!!!!

No punishment............I don\'t follow!!

Punishment.............I follow.

Brooks lacks the power to punish any of the players if they aren\'t getting it done. That\'s a BIG disatvantage.

Now, as far as Brooks inspiring someone. I\'ll let ya\'ll ponder that.

saintswhodi · 02-05-2005, 09:19 PM

As simple as I can put this: Leaders inspire. Non-leaders who runs their mouths don\'t.

02-05-2005, 05:34 PM	#11
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	AB doomed Braylon Edwards saintswhodi -- I\'m pretty good at reading people. And you don\'t seem like the type of person who doesn\'t give 100%... no matter who your boss might be. You seem too competetive to be like that. At least on here. I think you just said that to try and prove a point?
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-05-2005, 06:24 PM	#12
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	AB doomed Braylon Edwards Definitely. I am all out at MOST things I do, not everything. But from being in the Army, and in military intelligence no less, I have seen how shoddy leadership can effect morale and effort given. I had my down days too, but more often than not I always gave my all. I had many fellow soldiers though who did not simply cause they did not believe in the ability of those leading them. And low morale is like a virus, it spreads and soon more and more are not believing in the leadership and it gets bad all around. I just know from experience how much poor leadership can doom you and how much competent leadership can help.

02-05-2005, 06:37 PM	#13
ScottyRo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Williamsburg, VA (ugh, the food here) Posts: 1,704	AB doomed Braylon Edwards I think you\'re both pretty close to being right. I think players should put out 100% regardless of who the QB is or whatever. Catching balls is the main thing WRs are supposed to do. Since our guys are having trouble with it, I can only say that they aren\'t focusing as they should. That\'s their problem. On the other side, some leaders can take a group of individuals and make them more than they were capable of without that leader. AB lacks the ability to do this. Catching passes shouldn\'t be as difficult as some of our WR, including Horn, are making it out to be. Someof this must be physiological in that we all know AB throws darts and bullets without much, if any, touch on the ball. He\'s got a strong arm and it\'s got to be pretty difficult to catch a hard thrown ball - especially on short routes. It may be impossible but an investigation into how far downfield most of the drops occur may prove this to be the case.

02-05-2005, 06:40 PM	#14
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	AB doomed Braylon Edwards I just know from experience how much poor leadership can doom you and how much competent leadership can help I can agree with that. But not how it relates to Aaron Brooks. Here\'s the thing. Leaders need to have the ability to make changes if they can\'t get their followers to follow. In the military, the personell have ranks. The higher the rank, the more power they have. In other words, a general can cause a soldier to suffer if he doesn\'t do his job. If he didn\'t have that ability, I suspect there would be chaos and you\'d have a bunch of soldiers that didn\'t try nearly as hard. Afterall, there would be no concequinces to suffer. I don\'t see where Brooks can do anything to a player. He can\'t put him on the bench. He can\'t cut him. He can\'t do too much. So, leadership at the QB position is much different than a general in the military. Maybe Haslett is the one who isn\'t a great leader? He\'s the one that\'s got the power. Now, I think if we\'ve got some players who need Brooks in order to get their act together, then we really need to look at those players closely. I know of NO player on the offense who Brooks could help. Do you?
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-05-2005, 07:59 PM	#15
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	AB doomed Braylon Edwards This isn\'t about who Brooks can \"help.\" It is about how improved leadership from him may cause others players around him to react. Can affect how much effort they put out. Players can help themselves, but they are human. They aren\'t robots. You can\'t say do your job no matter what your personal feelings are cause no matter if they get paid to do that or not, they are humans. Leadership from Brooks may cayse his lineman to dig in harder on a block, may cause Donte to cut harder on a route, may cause a RB to put his head down for that extra yard. He doesn\'t have to \"help\" anyone. What he should be able to do is lay it on the line every game, which you know he doesn\'t, and inspire his teammates to do the same, which we know he doesn\'t. People tend to see football players as robots who should do their jobs no matter what. I don\'t. I realize many factors effect how you perform, and Brooks\' inability or unwillingness to grab a leadership role effects this team more than can be measured I feel. But ti\'s all a matter of opinion and how you feel about leadership. You see it as diddly poo. That\'s cool. I and many others do not.

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02-05-2005, 08:00 PM	#16
FireVenturi Cold as Ice! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Da Big Easy Posts: 2,978	AB doomed Braylon Edwards and almost hurt Mark Clayton as well with awful passes at the College Football Challenge on Fox. Other than that, if he put some touch on some of those balls he throws to our guys, we may see a new AB. Besides that one pass to Edwards he looked fine to me, but AB is the only Qb in the NFL who throws some bad passes.....not

02-05-2005, 08:00 PM	#17
FireVenturi Cold as Ice! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Da Big Easy Posts: 2,978	AB doomed Braylon Edwards But Boo, Pathon, Conwell, and Donte do. That is cause they can\'t catch :casstet:

02-05-2005, 08:01 PM	#18
FireVenturi Cold as Ice! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Da Big Easy Posts: 2,978	AB doomed Braylon Edwards I suppose AB only throws good passes to Horn.. How about Horn seems to run more deep routes? But then how is this even a discussion? Joe is one of the best WRs in the league, of course he catches more. Yea and he throws the ball to hisself :casstet:

02-05-2005, 08:32 PM	#19
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	AB doomed Braylon Edwards I think some of you are getting inspiration and leadership confused. Inspiration is the abiltiy to inspire. Leadership is the ability to lead. While inspiration can come from a leader, it really doesn\'t have that much to do with being a leader. Leaders generally have the abilty to make life tough on someone when they are perfoming poorly. That\'s true of just about any leader: 1. The C.E.O of a company has the power to fire one of his employees. 2. Your boss has the ability to fire you. 3. An Army General has the abiltiy to make a soldiers life miserable. I don\'t know of many leaders, if any, who don\'t have the power to make changes or punish anyone. Any leader in the military has the power to punish someone if they aren\'t doing their job properly. That\'s powerful stuff, man. The military isn\'t set up the way it is for no reason. There are rules and regulations. And there are \"ranks\". Imagine for a moment if a general didn\'t have the power to punish any of his soldiers? How effective do you think that general would be if he had no power? You think all those soldiers would listen to him if he couldn\'t make their life miserable? If General McAuthor told me to do 100 push-ups and I knew there wasn\'t a damn thing he could do to me if I didn\'t, then, I probably ain\'t gonna do them. But if I knew McAuthor was going to send me to Iceland if I didn\'t do them....then......I\'d say......SIR......YES SIR.....RIGHT AWAY SIR!!!!!! No punishment............I don\'t follow!! Punishment.............I follow. Brooks lacks the power to punish any of the players if they aren\'t getting it done. That\'s a BIG disatvantage. Now, as far as Brooks inspiring someone. I\'ll let ya\'ll ponder that.
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-05-2005, 09:19 PM	#20
saintswhodi 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 6,941	AB doomed Braylon Edwards As simple as I can put this: Leaders inspire. Non-leaders who runs their mouths don\'t.