saintswhodi

spk, I definitely agree.

Kool, and that seems more than reasonable. Although I value a good MLB over OLB, unless I am mis-reading what you have you may have the same.

JKool

I did have some trouble deciding on that one. I think that the pass rush advantages and the advantages in pass coverage of a (usually) more agile and speedy OLB outweigh the more situational advantages of a good MLB.

saintswhodi

Not much pass rush from an OLB unless thay are in a 3-4, which we are not. And we saw how much difference a good MBL can make in what Trotter has done for the Eagles. I lend more importance to that position.

shadowdrinker

[quote:d05e7047fd]sd, just so I can be clear, you think we only need one OT and one LB, and that those are both less important than getting a Safety and a Corner? That is a merely clarificatory question, so please don\'t take it the wrong way.


We would need only one of each position..if we got good players to fill the spots...

In your 20 point scenario...I would much rather spend 5 points on a weakness..rather than just say..every position is in need..and assign 1 or 2 points to each...

know what I mean?...

Get a Great Safety..and a Great CB...ok..now we have a good backfield...

Get a good LB...we have two young guys...One of which I think will ultimatley start for us long term...we have several other guys who can fill in the weak lb position...

One good OT will anchor the line...Stinchcomb should be able to contribute...and if we had a solid LT...it would greatly improve our durability..and we could use rotation of players..to keep them fresh...

One decent backup QB - get a guy who can sit back one year and try to beat out Brooks next year....

No one scenario could possibly fix the team with one swipe of the hand...but..I think fixing the backfield this year..can be done...we have tried to fix the front 7 for 4 years now...Let\'s get some talent to back them up...

My theory is..get a good back field..and the LB\'s can focus more on the run...and won\'t be fooled by play action as much...

With the Lb\'s now more in tune with the run...we can blitz more..and give our D line some help...and make the opposing team adjust to the pressure..and put more blockers..and have less of those short passes...to RB\'s and TE\'s...

Plus..a physical safety is worth his wieght in gold...punishing recivers...and stepping up in the box..to blitz and stop the run...it\'s awesome to be ablr to do that...and we haven\'t been able to in so long...maybe some of you guys forot how much of an impact a player like that can make?...

did you see Harrison in the Superbowl?...dude was Defensive MVP..no doubt...heck...could\'ve been MVP overall...

having a top shelf safety is a must for a good Defense....I feel like we would be taking that first step to improving our D..with a Safety in the 1st round...

heck..we have bolstered the D line and Lb corps for 3-4 solid years now...and..nothing has helped....yet..we get one decent corner..and our d looks way better....It\'s clear to me where we need help the most....and Haslett is right in thinking so also...He\'ll fianlly do the team right this year...even if he has to drag you all, kicking and screaming towards the 1st round pick

Danno

WLB-4
DT-3
RT-3
SS-2
FS-2
TE-1
OG-1
QB-1
CB-1
RB-1
WR-1

Just my 2 cents,
I think we\'re gonna get one good free-agent LB. The biggest impact position is the WLB. Atlanta moved Brookings to WLB because thats the playmaker in Mora\'s defense.

I\'d much rather keep Watson where he is. He\'s the perfect size for a MLB, has excellent speed, is extremely intelligent and a hard worker. That position isn\'t nearly as shaky as the SLB/WLB positions.

At SLB we have Allen/Hodge. I think Hodge is over. He never developed past his 1st year. Allen has progressed some, especially late this past season. But I really don\'t think its wise to count on him because of 4 good games to close out the season. He looked POSITIVELY horrid starting the season.

At WLB we have Rodgers/Bockwoldt. Rodgers is aging fast, and Bockwoldt is a liabilty versus the run. He\'s going to need to get MUCH stronger to avoid being exploited by teams with power RB\'s. I\'m impressed with Colby, but he was a 2-3 year project when we drafted him. I think his success simply shows how bad our other LB\'s were. THIS IS THE POSITION OF GREATEST IMPACT VALUE.

I could live with moving Watson here if a stud MLB became available, but I\'d rather get a proven stud WLB if possible.

The 2nd area would be DT. Plugging in a 2-gap fat boy lets Brian Young do what he was brought here to do. He was never brought in here to be the clogger. He is an excellent role-player DT. But without a 2-gap, he\'s as useless as Deuce in the 2-TE set.

Just a WLB and DT would improve this defense tremendously. Then quality depth elsewhere becomes the main goal.

Riley? I don\'t know. His whole career has been good-bad-good-bad-good-bad.
If his pattern holds true, he could be OK next year. If he comes into camp in good shape, great. If he comes in fat again, cut him immediately.

JKool

sd, I hear ya bud. I agree that we need another DB. I\'m just not sure we need two. I\'m actually starting to lean toward a SS.

It just seemed to me that an OT and a LB were certainly more important to the success of a team than a SS. I do like your Harrison example though.

Danno, nice work as always. I guess, you and I agree on the value of an OLB over a MLB. Nicely argued from cases as well.

I note though that you don\'t think we need any real work on our LT. Here are three quick thoughts on that:
(1) Even if Gandy can hold up next year, he is middling at best. He won\'t make it two more seasons - this would reduce our window to next year.
(2) Gandy has a large cap number that we could eliminate.
(3) There are a number of quality LTs available in FA this year, so we could get a new, younger one for slightly less than we will be able to after next season.

I also see we disagree on Tebucky, since you list that as an area of need. I would have said SS first, since Bellamy is aging.

"... I was beating them with my eyes the whole game..." - Aaron Brooks

baronm

ok-i\'m going to read the entire thread later-but just want to comment:

I think that LB is our bigest weakness because improved linebacker play takes some stress off the safeties.

so i gotta go LB first.

then offensive line-we need tackles. THe trenches is where it starts and ends.

then we look for depth. I think DL and DB goes next.
I think these will be most easily gotten in Free agency ala Hovan and smoot/rolle

then backup rb, gb and wideout. If we keep brooks we need a backup that will push him and would let us bench him if he gets erratic.

same with duece he needs a backup that will push him.

Now with wide out-I\'m wondering what we could get for horn? He is looking for Price like numbers and is worth it..but I don\'t think he can get it without killing the saints. we have too many other needs.

Howard should be traded as well. we could get some quality depth for him.

GumboBC

Since this discussion is about ranking our problems and discussing them, I\'m going to hit this from another angle..

9- Tom Benson not hiring a competent GM.
5- Not competing in free-agency.
3- Haslett not making changes.
2- Venturi\'s scheme.
1- McCarthy\'s game day plan.

Tom Benson: Winning starts at the top and that\'s where I place the most blame. It\'s clear by some of the decisions Benson has made that he doesn\'t understand what it takes to build a winner. A GM is where it all starts at, and until a team has one they will not win the big one.

Free Agency: You\'ve got to keep up with the Jones\'. One big name free-agent can make a big difference. While we\'re signing the Orlando Ruff\'s of the world, other teams are improving their roster by signing guys who are proven.

Haslett not making changes: Venturi is still here. That\'s enough said about that. And Haslett needs to step in and make changes during the game when things aren\'t going well. That is the coaches job isn\'t it?

Venturi\'s scheme We\'ve got enough talent to be much better on defense than we\'ve been over the past 4 years. I don\'t need to say much about how bad Venturi\'s schemes have been. I think we ALL agree with that.

McCarthy\'s game day plan: He sticks to whatever his plan was before the game. Not enough adjustments are made to counter what the other team is doing.


[Edited on 7/2/2005 by GumboBC]

baronm

I don\'t think the problem stops there.

I honestly think hasslett is a good coach-may an DC, and not a head coach..but I think he does the best with what he has to work with.

I think that mid game adjustments do need alot of work, though.

yes, the problems start with benson-then go to GM. but lets also look at the players.

there is no accountability, no leadership, no inspiration to do less than what is absolutley neccessary.

THat is mybiggest problem with this team and why I think brooks and duece need someone to push them-I think that hte new RB coach will do that with duece..but brooks needs to get over his \"i\'m micheal vicks cousin so therefore i\'m as good as he is\"....syndrome.

the problem is also with the fans-why should benson pay to have a contender when the fans are complacently satisfied with an 8-8 team?

Danno

I wouldn\'t go that far. The boo birds seem to escalate every year. Fans boo Brooks, cheer certain players getting hurt. The call in shows are absolutely lambasting this team and its owners. The local media rips them a new one constantly. I think the fans are sick and tired of 8-8 and have been for a very long time.

The only thing fans haven\'t done is stop buying tickets. But they aren\'t stupid. Stop buying tickets and the Saints will be headed elsewhere. Buying tickets does not equate to being satisfied with 8-8.