WhoDat

Brooks\' Number 1 fan is criticizing a QB for stupid mistakes?????

That HAS to be a joke.

GumboBC

I know it\'s hard to accept that Jake turned the ball over more than Brooks. And I know it\'s hard to accept that Brooks LED the Saints to more wins than Jake LED the Panthers to.

And Brooks did it with the 32nd ranked defense and the 27th ranked running game. And to boot, Brooks knocked Jake and the Panthers out of the playoffs. Well, Delhomme\'s 2 fumbles helped him out some....

NO JOKE!!

[Edited on 19/2/2005 by GumboBC]

WhoDat

Billy - do you know what the word myopic means?

\"Jake had as many, OR MORE, total turnovers than Aaron Brooks over the past 2 years.\"

So AB has more wins under his belt and more success than Jake in the last TWO seasons?

Wasn\'t Carolina\'s O-line worse than ours (AB excuse)? Didn\'t Delhomme have a RB who started something like 187th on the depth chart?

But you want to look at one game? OK, Jake\'s record was better than Brooks over the last 8 games of last season. Nanny nanny poo poo. Jakes stats were better in first quarters all season. Hey this is fun - I like it when I get to pick and choose whatever stats I want and not consider all of them.

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

GumboBC

Yeah, I know what \"myopic\" means.

Do you know what \"makes no sense\" means?

I\'m talking about QB stats. In other words, I\'m evaluating the QB.

You, on the other hand, are talking about \"wins.\" That\'s a TEAM stat. Want to evaluate QBs on \"wins\"? That\'s gonna automatically knock Peyton out of the top spot. And put McNabb in second place.

You\'ve got to be joking...

WhoDat

You\'re absolutely right Billy. Wins are TEAM stats. I just thought I could misapply them as you do to QBs like Delhomme or Manning when you bash them.

But you\'re right, let\'s look at individual stats to compare the two QBs LAST SEASON, shall we?

Jake Delhomme
Yards: 3886
Comp %: 58.2%
Yards per Att: 7.3
TDs: 29
INTs: 15
TD:INT Ratio: 1.9:1
Long: 63
QB Rating: 87.3

Aaron Brooks
Yards: 3810
Comp %: 57%
Yards per Att: 7.0
TDs: 21
INTS: 16
TD:INT Ratio: 1.3:1
Long: 57
QB Rating: 79.5

Wait a minute... I don\'t get it. Jake Delhomme is ahead of Aaron Brooks in EVERY category - whether raw numbers like Yards and TDs, or representative measures like Comp % and QB Rating. Hhhmmmm. But you say AB is a better QB right? And they both had a bad O-line, the Saints rushed for MORE yards than Carolina (Saints 1606, Car 1582), and both had a Pro Bowl WR. I guess it\'s the defense\'s fault AB can\'t complete passes regularly huh? Care to explain your position?

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

GumboBC

Jake had a better season than Brooks.

But, Carolina\'s offensive line was better than ours.

Delhomme was sacked 33 times. Brooks was sacked 41 times. Seems odd that a mobile QB is sacked more than a pocket passer. I wonder how many times Jake would have gotten sacked behind our offensive line? And a \"fullback\" was able to rush for over 100-yards in every game behind the Panther\'s offensive line.

But, I\'ll give it to Jake. He had a better statistical season than Brooks. But isn\'t all that matters to you are wins? Isn\'t that always what you preach? Now, you want to use stats? That\'s convinient....

TayTay

Gumbo, I will give you that having a weak O-Line doesn\'t help, however, even with a good line to protect Brooks still has no accuracy. Example: Senoir Bowl week. Each of the top college receivers are competing in a challenge in which several random routes are run. Each WR is paired with a pro quarterback. Unfortunatley for him, Braylon Edwards was pared with AB. Edwards, the top college receiver, got last out of 5 because Aaron through the ball OVER his head on a crossing and post route. How bad does your acccuracy have to be to through a ball over the head of a 6 foot 4 athlete with a 40 inch vertical? Just food for thought.

http://img188.echo.cx/img188/2215/untitled29jc.jpg

WhoDat

No, wins aren\'t all that matter to me when analyzing a position - if you believe that\'s all I care about, then you don\'t understand my opinion at all. I seek to stack up all of the information in full context. For example: stats are important when examining a QB, no doubt. But we agree that they don\'t tell the whole story, right? I think intangibles matter a lot - probably more than anything else at the QB position. Think AB\'s intangibles are better than Jake\'s? Is AB a better leader? More vocal? Does he play with more heart? Is he smarter? I think the answer to all of those questions has to be no, but if anyone can argue it, I\'m sure it\'s you.

Additionally, there are a couple of other factors that I think you have to consider. Talent and potential is an important piece. On the talent front, AB is clearly superior. On the potential front, I think they\'re about even, but if I had to pick I\'d give the edge to Brooks. AB\'s talent makes him attractive, but his inconsistency and intangibles hurt him. Delhomme is unspectacular as an athlete, but his heart and leadership make him play above his station, IMO. Overall - the two about equal out in terms of their play on the field. I also look to two other areas - value and team success. On the value front, there\'s no doubt in my mind that Brooks isn\'t earning his pay and the Delhomme is giving the Panthers their fair share. There are two pieces to that, in my mind. What you expect, and what you get. Delhomme is doing for the Panthers what they wanted when they signed him - he\'s playing a role. Brooks is not the top 5 QB that he demanded he was and that the Saints pay him to be. Finally, the team\'s results do matter. Sometimes, a guy can do everything right, but simply be in the worng place at the wrong time - or be bad for the system - or whatever. In these cases, it\'s not necessarily the QBs fault, but that doesn\'t change the fact that change is needed (see Buffalo as an example). There you have it. Care to explain your position on Brooks and why you think he is the right guy for the Saints?

\"Excuses, excuses, excuses. That’s all anyone ever makes for the New Orleans Saints’ organization.\" - Eric Narcisse


\"Being a Saints fan is almost like being addicted to crack,\" he said.[i]\"You know you should stop, but you just can\'t.\"

saintswhodi

He also badly underthrew one to Clayton TAYTAY that Clayton had to come back on his knees and get. This is with no rush, and no outside factors. I made a post about it. After all, we are talking about a guy who has NEVER completed 60% of his passes in any season.

TayTay

Thanks for the extra info whodi. I\'m glad that other people also see that the O-Line doesn\'t matter if the QB is a BUM