NFC South

CHACHING · 02-19-2005, 11:02 AM

How do you guys see us finishing in the division next season?
If you look at the last 3 seasons it's our turn to take the division.
2002 Tampa
2003 Carolina
2004 Atlanta
2005 ?????

FireVenturi · 02-19-2005, 11:07 AM

Saints
Atlanta
Tampa
Carolina

GumboBC · 02-19-2005, 11:34 AM

The NFC South is always a tough division. There really aren\'t any easy games.

Here\'s the way I see the division:

1. Atlanta Falcons: With Mike Vick, they have a legit shot of winning any game. But it ain\'t just Vick. Their defense is solid. Their running game is very good. And their special teams are outstanding11

2. Carolina Panthers: The defense will keep them in most games. Their running game is good. Jake Delhomme isn\'t gonna win any games on his own, but he\'s capiable of making some plays. Jake also has TWO probowl receivers. But the Panthers have some concerns. The offensive line is suspect. And Stephen Davis is getting up their in age. And Mushin is gonna want a HUGE contract. It\'s gonna be an interesting offseason for them.

3. New Orleans Saints: Deuce needs to stay healthy and return to form. Donte\' needs to have the breakout year we\'ve been waiting on. Brooks needs to have a solid year. But, the one thing that will help all the skilled-position players is a solid offensive line. If Haz can get the offensive line to play well, it\'ll go a long ways towards fixing most of the probems.

On defense, the secondary looks solid. The pass rush looks strong. And the young linebackers came on strong towards the end of the season. Right now, I\'d have to say the defense might be ahead of the offense.

4. Tampa Bay Bucs: Oh how the mighty have fallen. Just goes to show ya that schemes and coaching only play a small part in the equasion. Wonder how Parcells would do in Tampa? The Bucs have got to get some more talent if they want to compete. The defense will still be solid. But, not dominating. The offense? They aren\'t gonna scare anyone!!

CHACHING · 02-19-2005, 12:20 PM

Come on Gumbo
3RD PLACE?
I think we will be a little better than that.........
I think FireVent is closer to the mark......

GumboBC · 02-19-2005, 12:24 PM

Come on Gumbo
3RD PLACE?
I think we will be a little better than that.........
I think FireVent is closer to the mark......

Right now, at this point in time, I can definately say that Atlanta is a better team than us.

And Carolina .... hmmmm .... Do you get the feeling that we\'re going to sweep them? I don\'t.

The only team I think we are better than is the Bucs.

Now, a lot can change between now at the regular season. Until we get that offensive line repaired ... I rank us 3rd!!

turbo_dog · 02-19-2005, 12:27 PM

The NFC South is always a tough division. There really aren\'t any easy games.

Here\'s the way I see the division:

1. Atlanta Falcons: With Mike Vick, they have a legit shot of winning any game. But it ain\'t just Vick. Their defense is solid. Their running game is very good. And their special teams are outstanding11

2. Carolina Panthers: The defense will keep them in most games. Their running game is good. Jake Delhomme isn\'t gonna win any games on his own, but he\'s capiable of making some plays. Jake also has TWO probowl receivers. But the Panthers have some concerns. The offensive line is suspect. And Stephen Davis is getting up their in age. And Mushin is gonna want a HUGE contract. It\'s gonna be an interesting offseason for them.

3. New Orleans Saints: Deuce needs to stay healthy and return to form. Donte\' needs to have the breakout year we\'ve been waiting on. Brooks needs to have a solid year. But, the one thing that will help all the skilled-position players is a solid offensive line. If Haz can get the offensive line to play well, it\'ll go a long ways towards fixing most of the probems.

On defense, the secondary looks solid. The pass rush looks strong. And the young linebackers came on strong towards the end of the season. Right now, I\'d have to say the defense might be ahead of the offense.

4. Tampa Bay Bucs: Oh how the mighty have fallen. Just goes to show ya that schemes and coaching only play a small part in the equasion. Wonder how Parcells would do in Tampa? The Bucs have got to get some more talent if they want to compete. The defense will still be solid. But, not dominating. The offense? They aren\'t gonna scare anyone!!

Is this the reverse agenda?
I have to disagree, sort of. He may not win a game by running the ball down the field like Vick. However, there aren\'t many QBs who will. Yeah, he won\'t win many games on his own, but its a team game. However, it\'s his fiery spirit, winning attitude, and never-say-die performance that rubs off on his teammates and makes everybody believe.

CHACHING · 02-19-2005, 12:28 PM

Fair enough but I just don\'t see Atl beating us at all next year.
We almost won the first time (with Vick and Crump) and we beat em the last time.....
Unless Atl gets a serious WR in the offseason we will sweep them and the whole division(maybe split with Carolina).....
just a thought.

GumboBC · 02-19-2005, 12:30 PM

Is this the reverse agenda?
I have to disagree, sort of. He may not win a game by running the ball down the field like Vick. However, there aren\'t many QBs who will. Yeah, he won\'t win many games on his own, but its a team game. However, it\'s his fiery spirit, winning attitude, and never-say-die performance that rubs off on his teammates and makes everybody believe.

Jake makes some of the most stupid interceptions in the NFL. Tell me you haven\'t noticed Jake just throwing the ball up for grabs.

Jake had as many, OR MORE, total turnovers than Aaron Brooks over the past 2 years. Go check it out. I speak the truth!!

And without that strong defense, all Jake\'s fiery attitude got him was one less win than the dreadful New Orleans\' Saints.

[Edited on 19/2/2005 by GumboBC]

[Edited on 19/2/2005 by GumboBC]

JKool · 02-19-2005, 01:24 PM

Billy,

On defense, the secondary looks solid. The pass rush looks strong. And the young linebackers came on strong towards the end of the season. Right now, I\'d have to say the defense might be ahead of the offense.

WTF?

Our secondary looks solid? I don\'t know if I\'d say that. Our second CB as of now is going to be a league no namer, no matter who steps in there. Brown was ok, but he got smoked a bunch of times. Thomas might be ok if he remains uninjured, but we all know his limitations. On passing downs, we\'re in trouble in the dime (and maybe even in the nickle).

Want to guess why we used the Cover 3 a lot of the time - Bellamy is getting to old to cover a third WR or even a TE. He\'s great against the running game, but in coverage he\'s been pretty darned mediocre (and even bad at times - a good reason to move him from FS the year before). If he drops off as fast as Ambrose, we have a serious liability here. I\'ll concede that Mitchell may be something, but I have yet to see him under real game conditions. We\'re thread bare at Safety.

Tebucky, IMO, is fine, but people are starting to get me to think his cap number may be a problem. If he goes, the secondary is now MM and who? A big question mark.

Our LBs were strong in comparison to what we started the year with. I\'ll give you Watson and Bockwoldt\'s heart, but a heart isn\'t enough to be a starter. Allen? Blah. We\'ve MAYBE got two guys with any game at all. I guess, I don\'t see that as solid.

Pass rush?! Grant and Smith are good to great, but after that we\'re hurting (well, Whitehead is pretty good too). As long as those guys are reigned in (which will happen a lot when you\'re run D BLOWS), they cannot be as productive. Also, without help in the middle, they will continue to be hindered in production. So, I\'ll give you this one, but we need more strength in the middle, not only to help the run D, but also to help the pass rush on non-obvious passing downs.

The offense? It needs one or two new Tackles and a third WR (since Pathon is probably out). With more pass protection from the line, the TEs could improve (not having to be kept in and/or a chance for Boo to run longer developing patterns against the LBs). With Karney in the backfield we are solid in the running game. Drop the 2TE set and we improve right away.

The defense night be ahead of the offense? I guess it is possible, but I\'m not seeing it yet.

GumboBC · 02-19-2005, 01:33 PM

JKool --

To be perfectly honest with you, I\'m over dreaming about what the offense is capiable of.

They aren\'t capiable of blocking on the offensive line. And that hurts everything else. IF we can fix that, then yeah, I\'ll start to believe. But our pass blocking problems didn\'t just start this year. They\'ve been awful for 2-years. I said it 2 years ago and I said it this past year. And I haven\'t seen anything that\'s been corrected yet. And I\'m still waiting on Donte\'. All I see is Horn, Deuce, and Brooks. And their playing with a terrible offensive line.

On defense, we\'ve got Charles Grant, Darren Howard, Will Smith, and Mike McKenzie. That\'s a lot of talent. Then we\'ve got other players who are very capiable. Like .... Colby Bockwaldt, Tebucky Jones, Brian Young, and Fakir Brown.

Yeah, there are weak spots. But, I truly believe that \"scheming\" has been the big problem. I think Haslett has had enough of Venturi. I really think our defense might be ahead of our offense next year. Yeah, I know it sounds crazy, but I\'m sticking with it...

02-19-2005, 11:02 AM	#1
CHACHING 500th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Golden State Posts: 830	NFC South How do you guys see us finishing in the division next season? If you look at the last 3 seasons it's our turn to take the division. 2002 Tampa 2003 Carolina 2004 Atlanta 2005 ?????

02-19-2005, 11:07 AM	#2
FireVenturi Cold as Ice! Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Da Big Easy Posts: 2,978	NFC South Saints Atlanta Tampa Carolina

02-19-2005, 11:34 AM	#3
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	NFC South The NFC South is always a tough division. There really aren\'t any easy games. Here\'s the way I see the division: 1. Atlanta Falcons: With Mike Vick, they have a legit shot of winning any game. But it ain\'t just Vick. Their defense is solid. Their running game is very good. And their special teams are outstanding11 2. Carolina Panthers: The defense will keep them in most games. Their running game is good. Jake Delhomme isn\'t gonna win any games on his own, but he\'s capiable of making some plays. Jake also has TWO probowl receivers. But the Panthers have some concerns. The offensive line is suspect. And Stephen Davis is getting up their in age. And Mushin is gonna want a HUGE contract. It\'s gonna be an interesting offseason for them. 3. New Orleans Saints: Deuce needs to stay healthy and return to form. Donte\' needs to have the breakout year we\'ve been waiting on. Brooks needs to have a solid year. But, the one thing that will help all the skilled-position players is a solid offensive line. If Haz can get the offensive line to play well, it\'ll go a long ways towards fixing most of the probems. On defense, the secondary looks solid. The pass rush looks strong. And the young linebackers came on strong towards the end of the season. Right now, I\'d have to say the defense might be ahead of the offense. 4. Tampa Bay Bucs: Oh how the mighty have fallen. Just goes to show ya that schemes and coaching only play a small part in the equasion. Wonder how Parcells would do in Tampa? The Bucs have got to get some more talent if they want to compete. The defense will still be solid. But, not dominating. The offense? They aren\'t gonna scare anyone!!
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-19-2005, 12:20 PM	#4
CHACHING 500th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Golden State Posts: 830	NFC South Come on Gumbo 3RD PLACE? I think we will be a little better than that......... I think FireVent is closer to the mark......

02-19-2005, 12:24 PM	#5
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	NFC South Come on Gumbo 3RD PLACE? I think we will be a little better than that......... I think FireVent is closer to the mark...... Right now, at this point in time, I can definately say that Atlanta is a better team than us. And Carolina .... hmmmm .... Do you get the feeling that we\'re going to sweep them? I don\'t. The only team I think we are better than is the Bucs. Now, a lot can change between now at the regular season. Until we get that offensive line repaired ... I rank us 3rd!!
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

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02-19-2005, 12:27 PM	#6
turbo_dog 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Atlanta Posts: 1,592	NFC South The NFC South is always a tough division. There really aren\'t any easy games. Here\'s the way I see the division: 1. Atlanta Falcons: With Mike Vick, they have a legit shot of winning any game. But it ain\'t just Vick. Their defense is solid. Their running game is very good. And their special teams are outstanding11 2. Carolina Panthers: The defense will keep them in most games. Their running game is good. Jake Delhomme isn\'t gonna win any games on his own, but he\'s capiable of making some plays. Jake also has TWO probowl receivers. But the Panthers have some concerns. The offensive line is suspect. And Stephen Davis is getting up their in age. And Mushin is gonna want a HUGE contract. It\'s gonna be an interesting offseason for them. 3. New Orleans Saints: Deuce needs to stay healthy and return to form. Donte\' needs to have the breakout year we\'ve been waiting on. Brooks needs to have a solid year. But, the one thing that will help all the skilled-position players is a solid offensive line. If Haz can get the offensive line to play well, it\'ll go a long ways towards fixing most of the probems. On defense, the secondary looks solid. The pass rush looks strong. And the young linebackers came on strong towards the end of the season. Right now, I\'d have to say the defense might be ahead of the offense. 4. Tampa Bay Bucs: Oh how the mighty have fallen. Just goes to show ya that schemes and coaching only play a small part in the equasion. Wonder how Parcells would do in Tampa? The Bucs have got to get some more talent if they want to compete. The defense will still be solid. But, not dominating. The offense? They aren\'t gonna scare anyone!! Is this the reverse agenda? I have to disagree, sort of. He may not win a game by running the ball down the field like Vick. However, there aren\'t many QBs who will. Yeah, he won\'t win many games on his own, but its a team game. However, it\'s his fiery spirit, winning attitude, and never-say-die performance that rubs off on his teammates and makes everybody believe.

02-19-2005, 12:28 PM	#7
CHACHING 500th Post Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Golden State Posts: 830	NFC South Fair enough but I just don\'t see Atl beating us at all next year. We almost won the first time (with Vick and Crump) and we beat em the last time..... Unless Atl gets a serious WR in the offseason we will sweep them and the whole division(maybe split with Carolina)..... just a thought.

02-19-2005, 12:30 PM	#8
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	NFC South Is this the reverse agenda? I have to disagree, sort of. He may not win a game by running the ball down the field like Vick. However, there aren\'t many QBs who will. Yeah, he won\'t win many games on his own, but its a team game. However, it\'s his fiery spirit, winning attitude, and never-say-die performance that rubs off on his teammates and makes everybody believe. Jake makes some of the most stupid interceptions in the NFL. Tell me you haven\'t noticed Jake just throwing the ball up for grabs. Jake had as many, OR MORE, total turnovers than Aaron Brooks over the past 2 years. Go check it out. I speak the truth!! And without that strong defense, all Jake\'s fiery attitude got him was one less win than the dreadful New Orleans\' Saints. [Edited on 19/2/2005 by GumboBC] [Edited on 19/2/2005 by GumboBC]
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616

02-19-2005, 01:24 PM	#9
JKool 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,423	NFC South Billy, On defense, the secondary looks solid. The pass rush looks strong. And the young linebackers came on strong towards the end of the season. Right now, I\'d have to say the defense might be ahead of the offense. WTF? Our secondary looks solid? I don\'t know if I\'d say that. Our second CB as of now is going to be a league no namer, no matter who steps in there. Brown was ok, but he got smoked a bunch of times. Thomas might be ok if he remains uninjured, but we all know his limitations. On passing downs, we\'re in trouble in the dime (and maybe even in the nickle). Want to guess why we used the Cover 3 a lot of the time - Bellamy is getting to old to cover a third WR or even a TE. He\'s great against the running game, but in coverage he\'s been pretty darned mediocre (and even bad at times - a good reason to move him from FS the year before). If he drops off as fast as Ambrose, we have a serious liability here. I\'ll concede that Mitchell may be something, but I have yet to see him under real game conditions. We\'re thread bare at Safety. Tebucky, IMO, is fine, but people are starting to get me to think his cap number may be a problem. If he goes, the secondary is now MM and who? A big question mark. Our LBs were strong in comparison to what we started the year with. I\'ll give you Watson and Bockwoldt\'s heart, but a heart isn\'t enough to be a starter. Allen? Blah. We\'ve MAYBE got two guys with any game at all. I guess, I don\'t see that as solid. Pass rush?! Grant and Smith are good to great, but after that we\'re hurting (well, Whitehead is pretty good too). As long as those guys are reigned in (which will happen a lot when you\'re run D BLOWS), they cannot be as productive. Also, without help in the middle, they will continue to be hindered in production. So, I\'ll give you this one, but we need more strength in the middle, not only to help the run D, but also to help the pass rush on non-obvious passing downs. The offense? It needs one or two new Tackles and a third WR (since Pathon is probably out). With more pass protection from the line, the TEs could improve (not having to be kept in and/or a chance for Boo to run longer developing patterns against the LBs). With Karney in the backfield we are solid in the running game. Drop the 2TE set and we improve right away. The defense night be ahead of the offense? I guess it is possible, but I\'m not seeing it yet.
	"... I was beating them with my eyes the whole game..." - Aaron Brooks

02-19-2005, 01:33 PM	#10
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616	NFC South JKool -- To be perfectly honest with you, I\'m over dreaming about what the offense is capiable of. They aren\'t capiable of blocking on the offensive line. And that hurts everything else. IF we can fix that, then yeah, I\'ll start to believe. But our pass blocking problems didn\'t just start this year. They\'ve been awful for 2-years. I said it 2 years ago and I said it this past year. And I haven\'t seen anything that\'s been corrected yet. And I\'m still waiting on Donte\'. All I see is Horn, Deuce, and Brooks. And their playing with a terrible offensive line. On defense, we\'ve got Charles Grant, Darren Howard, Will Smith, and Mike McKenzie. That\'s a lot of talent. Then we\'ve got other players who are very capiable. Like .... Colby Bockwaldt, Tebucky Jones, Brian Young, and Fakir Brown. Yeah, there are weak spots. But, I truly believe that \"scheming\" has been the big problem. I think Haslett has had enough of Venturi. I really think our defense might be ahead of our offense next year. Yeah, I know it sounds crazy, but I\'m sticking with it...
GumboBC Banned Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,616