It's not a disagreement, it's a discussion, and I appreciate your opinions. When you stop talking about stuff is when the problems start, IMO.



I'm just trying to make sense of it all and I do think it's making excuses to some extent, the constant attempt to apply mitigating factors to situations like this vs just applying personal responsibility. It's a mistake we make, IMO, that we don't consider these incidents in a more individual/specific manner. Does growing up poor make you a shooter? Does lack of opportunity remove you from personal responsibility for your actions? I don't think so and in this case, I don't think any of the usual excuses apply and I'm sitting here thinking, "now what?" ... how do we reconcile this one? It wasn't the gun's fault, it wasn't poverty's fault, it wasn't lack of educational/employment opportunities fault. I agree, some people are just no damn good and what you said there about proper guidance is very profound, IMO.



I just don't see how Hayes would ever know Smith and Ceravolo were acquainted and how he would use that as a motive vs Smith. I would have thought had Hayes harbored a grudge, it would be vs Ceravolo more so than Smith ... and they did find a few more guns.



Well, I hope I didn't imply that in making my point that there's gzillions of poor people, uneducated people, unemployed people, et ... that go about their daily business without shooting each other, so maybe we should start focusing on some of the other root causes.



I hear ya bro, and there's a lot you just posted that I agree with ... some, not so much, but I knew we'd eventually get to this point, . I agree this incident (and a lot of others) "just happened" and it just gets harder all the time for me to wrap my head around it. I don't disagree that socioeconomic conditions play a big role in some of these incidents, but when we have situations where socioeconomic roles don't play as big a part, where do we go from there? At that point, when the mitigating factors have been removed or minimized, I think you have to start applying personal responsibility and looking elsewhere for a root cause.

Good point about homicides, which is why I get a miffed at the attention paid to a homicide committed by a cop when, IMO, there's the much larger issue of intraracial, intrafamily/domestic type homicides. I realize organizations like BLM, MoveOn.org are using these incidents as platforms to call attention to socioeconomic & race issues as a whole, but IDK, I'd like to see them apply as much time & effort to some of the Black-on-Black issues as they do the White-on-Black issues, #shrug. I guess one of my questions is, "What is the end-game?". Like you said, it's hard to play 400yrs of catch-up and we'll never get there. So are we to consider the Black community permanent victims? At what point do we acknowledge that there's actually been quite a bit of progress and then try to move on from there? It just seems to me the current civil rights movement can't find a way to build on their successes and so instead remains mired in the past. Just my perspective, #shrug. IDK, I've dealt with this my whole life and just seems like we're going backwards, on all levels, all issues, et ... in all communities. Considering the progress I've seen in civil rights, I'd personally like to see it focus more on a poor-person level vs an ethnic level, but I'm not saying there still aren't issues to address, just maybe change focus/direction a little bit to align with the new millennium.

And I applaud/commend your efforts/goals. I had a neighbor who started a school for nursing assistants, LPN's, phlebotomists and medical type careers that you could get into with just a license and without having to attend a four-year college, et ... I really admired that because she didn't just pay lip service to helping people and/or the community, she actually went out and did it, . One time when I was laid off, she even got me to go through the CNA course, but that's another story, ... and don't think I don't appreciate the "save the culture because no one else will" sentiment, because I do. That's one thing we're all hard-wired to do, look out for our own, but we still have to be considerate of others & that's something everyone could probably work on more, IMO. .



Yes, you can. Seeing as how PTSD is triggered by exposure to traumatic events, growing up da' hood can be pretty traumatic, and it's not unique to Black males, any ethnicity can experience it. You ever wonder why people who have been subjected to years of abuse commit heinous crimes or engage in dangerous behaviors? It's a form of PTSD, they just have to come up with a civilian term for it, #shrug.