I was wrong

SaintFanInATLHELL · 11-11-2016, 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by burningmetal

Yeah when the Saints play a team of note, they have to talk about us a little bit. There's no doubt that, especially in this very weak year in the NFL, this team is right in the middle of the playoff race. Forget down the road, we're in it now. But nobody is going to take this team seriously as true contenders to make some noise in the postseason until the defense gets better.

You give national media too much credit. There are only about 3 criteria for currying their favor:

1. Be on the east coast + Dallas who plays teams on the east coast, or last years SB participants.
2. Have a winning record.
3. Beat or play teams from group #1.

The Saints are not in group #1. However, they can be 6-4 in less than a week and get there by beating both of last year's SB participants. That will put them squarely on the national media radar.

It's true about the touchdown passes against being way down, but the overall points against are about the same.

On average I agree. But the Saints' defense has been a tale of two streaks: the losing streak in the beginning (1-3) and the current winning streak (3-1).

Also I never attribute points to the defense when the defense isn't on the field. This season so far there's been 2 pick-6s, a fumble and a blocked kick all returned for TD. So let's look at the averages with those removed points:

losing streak: 34+9+38+34: 28.75 PPG
winning streak: 38+20+13+23 : 23.5 PPG

Compared to 462/16 (Brees had 2 pick-6s in 2015) : 28.875 the defense is 5 PPG down during the winning streak and is close to 3 PPG down overall.

I have no idea what to expect from any of the players who are coming back. We got two back last week and it didn't go well for the unit, as a whole. But hopefully they will shake off the rust and improve. IF they do, then people will really take notice.

This defense is never going to be great this season. They are never going to be lockdown. Not this season with the personnel and injuries they have. But if they can stay in the top 10 in takeaways, and can get scoring towards 23 where they have been the last 3 weeks, then the middle of the road is a substantial improvement over the train wreck of the last couple of seasons.

SFIAH

burningmetal · 11-11-2016, 07:59 PM

Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL

You give national media too much credit. There are only about 3 criteria for currying their favor:

1. Be on the east coast + Dallas who plays teams on the east coast, or last years SB participants.
2. Have a winning record.
3. Beat or play teams from group #1.

The Saints are not in group #1. However, they can be 6-4 in less than a week and get there by beating both of last year's SB participants. That will put them squarely on the national media radar.

On average I agree. But the Saints' defense has been a tale of two streaks: the losing streak in the beginning (1-3) and the current winning streak (3-1).

Also I never attribute points to the defense when the defense isn't on the field. This season so far there's been 2 pick-6s, a fumble and a blocked kick all returned for TD. So let's look at the averages with those removed points:

losing streak: 34+9+38+34: 28.75 PPG
winning streak: 38+20+13+23 : 23.5 PPG

Compared to 462/16 (Brees had 2 pick-6s in 2015) : 28.875 the defense is 5 PPG down during the winning streak and is close to 3 PPG down overall.

This defense is never going to be great this season. They are never going to be lockdown. Not this season with the personnel and injuries they have. But if they can stay in the top 10 in takeaways, and can get scoring towards 23 where they have been the last 3 weeks, then the middle of the road is a substantial improvement over the train wreck of the last couple of seasons.

SFIAH

I'm actually giving the media less credit than you are. I already identified the Dallas "america's team" bias. We are mostly in agreement except that you say having a winning record makes the media pay attention. I'm saying you have to beat a couple of teams of note (they have one so far, against Seattle) and you have to show enough balance as a team for people to respect you. You are of the opinion that beating the Panthers matters to them, but we've already done that and everyone said "well, the Panthers are a train wreck".

As far as the defense is concerned, I didn't say they needed to be lock down. I just said they need to get better than they are, and consistently creating more turnovers is something I already mentioned. That's an obvious one.

And I agree about pick sixes not being the fault of the defense, but giving up almost 500 yards to the last place offense is a sure sign that this defense has a lot of improving to do.

11-11-2016, 01:08 PM	#1
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,789	Re: I was wrong Originally Posted by burningmetal Yeah when the Saints play a team of note, they have to talk about us a little bit. There's no doubt that, especially in this very weak year in the NFL, this team is right in the middle of the playoff race. Forget down the road, we're in it now. But nobody is going to take this team seriously as true contenders to make some noise in the postseason until the defense gets better. You give national media too much credit. There are only about 3 criteria for currying their favor: 1. Be on the east coast + Dallas who plays teams on the east coast, or last years SB participants. 2. Have a winning record. 3. Beat or play teams from group #1. The Saints are not in group #1. However, they can be 6-4 in less than a week and get there by beating both of last year's SB participants. That will put them squarely on the national media radar. It's true about the touchdown passes against being way down, but the overall points against are about the same. On average I agree. But the Saints' defense has been a tale of two streaks: the losing streak in the beginning (1-3) and the current winning streak (3-1). Also I never attribute points to the defense when the defense isn't on the field. This season so far there's been 2 pick-6s, a fumble and a blocked kick all returned for TD. So let's look at the averages with those removed points: losing streak: 34+9+38+34: 28.75 PPG winning streak: 38+20+13+23 : 23.5 PPG Compared to 462/16 (Brees had 2 pick-6s in 2015) : 28.875 the defense is 5 PPG down during the winning streak and is close to 3 PPG down overall. I have no idea what to expect from any of the players who are coming back. We got two back last week and it didn't go well for the unit, as a whole. But hopefully they will shake off the rust and improve. IF they do, then people will really take notice. This defense is never going to be great this season. They are never going to be lockdown. Not this season with the personnel and injuries they have. But if they can stay in the top 10 in takeaways, and can get scoring towards 23 where they have been the last 3 weeks, then the middle of the road is a substantial improvement over the train wreck of the last couple of seasons. SFIAH AsylumGuido likes this.
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

11-11-2016, 07:59 PM	#2
burningmetal 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 3,923 Blog Entries: 3	Re: I was wrong Originally Posted by SaintFanInATLHELL You give national media too much credit. There are only about 3 criteria for currying their favor: 1. Be on the east coast + Dallas who plays teams on the east coast, or last years SB participants. 2. Have a winning record. 3. Beat or play teams from group #1. The Saints are not in group #1. However, they can be 6-4 in less than a week and get there by beating both of last year's SB participants. That will put them squarely on the national media radar. On average I agree. But the Saints' defense has been a tale of two streaks: the losing streak in the beginning (1-3) and the current winning streak (3-1). Also I never attribute points to the defense when the defense isn't on the field. This season so far there's been 2 pick-6s, a fumble and a blocked kick all returned for TD. So let's look at the averages with those removed points: losing streak: 34+9+38+34: 28.75 PPG winning streak: 38+20+13+23 : 23.5 PPG Compared to 462/16 (Brees had 2 pick-6s in 2015) : 28.875 the defense is 5 PPG down during the winning streak and is close to 3 PPG down overall. This defense is never going to be great this season. They are never going to be lockdown. Not this season with the personnel and injuries they have. But if they can stay in the top 10 in takeaways, and can get scoring towards 23 where they have been the last 3 weeks, then the middle of the road is a substantial improvement over the train wreck of the last couple of seasons. SFIAH I'm actually giving the media less credit than you are. I already identified the Dallas "america's team" bias. We are mostly in agreement except that you say having a winning record makes the media pay attention. I'm saying you have to beat a couple of teams of note (they have one so far, against Seattle) and you have to show enough balance as a team for people to respect you. You are of the opinion that beating the Panthers matters to them, but we've already done that and everyone said "well, the Panthers are a train wreck". As far as the defense is concerned, I didn't say they needed to be lock down. I just said they need to get better than they are, and consistently creating more turnovers is something I already mentioned. That's an obvious one. And I agree about pick sixes not being the fault of the defense, but giving up almost 500 yards to the last place offense is a sure sign that this defense has a lot of improving to do.
	If I had a nickel for every time I heard that, the NFL would fine and suspend me.

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