Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints

stickman · 08-08-2022, 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

How would they accomplish that? Who would get the 2023 first and who would get 2024 third? I can see your point, but can't see any way to pull it off fairly without pissing off other teams. Apparently tampering at some level goes on all the time across the league from what I have read. The problem with Miami though is that they carried it to an extreme AND also threatened the "integrity of the game" with the blatant tanking wishes of the owner. That's why they threw the book at Ross, I believe.

What about compensatory picks? Those are at best a 3rd rounder.

Just throwing that out there. In this case, the Dolphins didn't actually sign either Payton or Brady, so it's not like a team actually lost someone. Unless you can prove the tampering caused Payton to resign, and that would be difficult if not impossible.

TheOak · 08-08-2022, 08:35 AM

If you think the Dolphins throwing an offer at Sean Payton had anything to do with him leaving you have to believe that Sean has not had a/multiple offers thrown at him in the last 13 years which I am willing to speculate is easily in excess of 15-20. F**k, Jerry Jones along probably throws an offer at him every single off season.

If Sean Payton decided to coach again it wouldn't be a bidding war. As per his own comment, it would have to be the "right fit".. meaning he isn't on an auction block. In case you didn't read into that "right fit" comment of his, it isn't New Orleans or he would be here and people focus on a "right fit" after leaving because of a bad fit.

One thing that people who spend their entire lives in Louisiana don't recognize that those that move there do.. That place can burn you the f*** out.... Like being Guido's Siamese twin.

keithday123 · 08-08-2022, 11:15 AM

I’m here in Dallas and make no mistake about it short of going to a Super Bowl this is it for McCarthy. Everything is lining up for Peyton to be here next year. He gets his year off, McCarthy gets one more year of underachieving football and Jerry gets what he has coveted since he took that whoopin in Dallas back in ‘06. Give Mickey what he wants and you can have Sean. If there is ever a place where overrated under achieving coaches need to go it’s Dallas.

Rugby Saint II · 08-08-2022, 11:38 AM

I don't think that Sean Payton retired because of tampering. I think he retired cause he was surely burned out. On the other hand, he will have had a year off to rest and be able to judge the market better. I wish him well anywhere except Dallas. Although, he can go there and I'll take those draft picks. 3 1st round draft exactly. Lol

SmashMouth · 08-08-2022, 12:32 PM

Are the Chargers a better destination for SP? What team will give up the multitude of draft picks Saints will demand ?

Boston Saint · 08-08-2022, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II

I don't think that Sean Payton retired because of tampering. I think he retired cause he was surely burned out. On the other hand, he will have had a year off to rest and be able to judge the market better. I wish him well anywhere except Dallas. Although, he can go there and I'll take those draft picks. 3 1st round draft exactly. Lol

It doesn’t have to be one reason or the other. It could have been a combination of factors that “pushed” Payton to retire so to speak. Burn out, weariness from being screwed over by the league, not having Brees, not enough belief in his QBs, stress in dealing with Kamara’s legal issues and the doubts about Thomas’s return and the overall quality of the offense talent in general coupled with other things could have all been building up
in him. Then, along comes this Miami tampering/offer to Payton. Seems ignorant to deny that this outside influence COULD have played a factor and been the straw that broke the camel’s back.

neugey · 08-08-2022, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by stickman

What about compensatory picks? Those are at best a 3rd rounder.

Just throwing that out there. In this case, the Dolphins didn't actually sign either Payton or Brady, so it's not like a team actually lost someone. Unless you can prove the tampering caused Payton to resign, and that would be difficult if not impossible.

That's an even better idea. Take away the picks as described by the Dolphins and add compensatory (end of 3rd round) picks for the Saints and Pats. IMO if the league office is to be taken seriously about tampering, not only do they need to punish a team caught in serious violation, but they also need to compensate the team(s) victimized by the tampering. Since the player/coach were not actually poached (although it was attempted), a compensatory pick for each team seems fair. Maybe multiple compensatory picks for the Pats if it's been proven they were tampered with on more than one separate occasion.

TheOak · 08-08-2022, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

It doesn’t have to be one reason or the other. It could have been a combination of factors that “pushed” Payton to retire so to speak. Burn out, weariness from being screwed over by the league, not having Brees, not enough belief in his QBs, stress in dealing with Kamara’s legal issues and the doubts about Thomas’s return and the overall quality of the offense talent in general coupled with other things could have all been building up
in him. Then, along comes this Miami tampering/offer to Payton. Seems ignorant to deny that this outside influence COULD have played a factor and been the straw that broke the camel’s back.

After BountyGate, suspension, Vicodin, divorce.... I am not sure the recent items amount to much more than background noise.

Boston Saint · 08-08-2022, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by TheOak

After BountyGate, suspension, Vicodin, divorce.... I am not sure the recent items amount to much more than background noise.

Maybe not. Be he still had a high performing Brees/offense when those issues happened and he was still fairly young. I’m just saying it’s certainly possible that this tampering helped him decide to retire….even in a small amount. Why would there be a penalty for doing it if it weren’t possible?

SaintGnome · 08-08-2022, 02:29 PM

I remember seeing a special back in the day about coaching they spoke with Ditka, Vermeil, others and the point was brought up that after 10+ years in a job everybody in the building has heard everything you had to say.

08-08-2022, 07:42 AM	#11
stickman 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Gonzales, LA Posts: 1,687	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints Originally Posted by AsylumGuido How would they accomplish that? Who would get the 2023 first and who would get 2024 third? I can see your point, but can't see any way to pull it off fairly without pissing off other teams. Apparently tampering at some level goes on all the time across the league from what I have read. The problem with Miami though is that they carried it to an extreme AND also threatened the "integrity of the game" with the blatant tanking wishes of the owner. That's why they threw the book at Ross, I believe. What about compensatory picks? Those are at best a 3rd rounder. Just throwing that out there. In this case, the Dolphins didn't actually sign either Payton or Brady, so it's not like a team actually lost someone. Unless you can prove the tampering caused Payton to resign, and that would be difficult if not impossible. neugey, SmashMouth and Rugby Saint II like this.

08-08-2022, 08:35 AM	#12
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints If you think the Dolphins throwing an offer at Sean Payton had anything to do with him leaving you have to believe that Sean has not had a/multiple offers thrown at him in the last 13 years which I am willing to speculate is easily in excess of 15-20. Fk, Jerry Jones along probably throws an offer at him every single off season. If Sean Payton decided to coach again it wouldn't be a bidding war. As per his own comment, it would have to be the "right fit".. meaning he isn't on an auction block. In case you didn't read into that "right fit" comment of his, it isn't New Orleans or he would be here and people focus on a "right fit" after leaving because of a bad fit. One thing that people who spend their entire lives in Louisiana don't recognize that those that move there do.. That place can burn you the f* out.... Like being Guido's Siamese twin. subguy, iceshack149, SmashMouth and 1 others like this.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

08-08-2022, 11:15 AM	#13
keithday123 Texasaint Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints I’m here in Dallas and make no mistake about it short of going to a Super Bowl this is it for McCarthy. Everything is lining up for Peyton to be here next year. He gets his year off, McCarthy gets one more year of underachieving football and Jerry gets what he has coveted since he took that whoopin in Dallas back in ‘06. Give Mickey what he wants and you can have Sean. If there is ever a place where overrated under achieving coaches need to go it’s Dallas. Rugby Saint II likes this.
keithday123 Texasaint Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 188

08-08-2022, 11:38 AM	#14
Rugby Saint II Bounty Money $$$ Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: 5800 Airline Dr. Metairie, LA. Posts: 24,073	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints I don't think that Sean Payton retired because of tampering. I think he retired cause he was surely burned out. On the other hand, he will have had a year off to rest and be able to judge the market better. I wish him well anywhere except Dallas. Although, he can go there and I'll take those draft picks. 3 1st round draft exactly. Lol jeanpierre and stickman like this.

08-08-2022, 12:32 PM	#15
SmashMouth I donated, did you? Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Mandeville, LA Posts: 38,201 Blog Entries: 29	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints Are the Chargers a better destination for SP? What team will give up the multitude of draft picks Saints will demand ?

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08-08-2022, 12:54 PM	#16
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints Originally Posted by Rugby Saint II I don't think that Sean Payton retired because of tampering. I think he retired cause he was surely burned out. On the other hand, he will have had a year off to rest and be able to judge the market better. I wish him well anywhere except Dallas. Although, he can go there and I'll take those draft picks. 3 1st round draft exactly. Lol It doesn’t have to be one reason or the other. It could have been a combination of factors that “pushed” Payton to retire so to speak. Burn out, weariness from being screwed over by the league, not having Brees, not enough belief in his QBs, stress in dealing with Kamara’s legal issues and the doubts about Thomas’s return and the overall quality of the offense talent in general coupled with other things could have all been building up in him. Then, along comes this Miami tampering/offer to Payton. Seems ignorant to deny that this outside influence COULD have played a factor and been the straw that broke the camel’s back. iceshack149, SmashMouth and Rugby Saint II like this.
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08-08-2022, 01:49 PM	#17
neugey Hu Dat! Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 6,715 Blog Entries: 13	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints Originally Posted by stickman What about compensatory picks? Those are at best a 3rd rounder. Just throwing that out there. In this case, the Dolphins didn't actually sign either Payton or Brady, so it's not like a team actually lost someone. Unless you can prove the tampering caused Payton to resign, and that would be difficult if not impossible. That's an even better idea. Take away the picks as described by the Dolphins and add compensatory (end of 3rd round) picks for the Saints and Pats. IMO if the league office is to be taken seriously about tampering, not only do they need to punish a team caught in serious violation, but they also need to compensate the team(s) victimized by the tampering. Since the player/coach were not actually poached (although it was attempted), a compensatory pick for each team seems fair. Maybe multiple compensatory picks for the Pats if it's been proven they were tampered with on more than one separate occasion. SmashMouth and Rugby Saint II like this.

08-08-2022, 02:04 PM	#18
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints Originally Posted by Boston Saint It doesn’t have to be one reason or the other. It could have been a combination of factors that “pushed” Payton to retire so to speak. Burn out, weariness from being screwed over by the league, not having Brees, not enough belief in his QBs, stress in dealing with Kamara’s legal issues and the doubts about Thomas’s return and the overall quality of the offense talent in general coupled with other things could have all been building up in him. Then, along comes this Miami tampering/offer to Payton. Seems ignorant to deny that this outside influence COULD have played a factor and been the straw that broke the camel’s back. After BountyGate, suspension, Vicodin, divorce.... I am not sure the recent items amount to much more than background noise. Rugby Saint II likes this.

08-08-2022, 02:27 PM	#19
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints Originally Posted by TheOak After BountyGate, suspension, Vicodin, divorce.... I am not sure the recent items amount to much more than background noise. Maybe not. Be he still had a high performing Brees/offense when those issues happened and he was still fairly young. I’m just saying it’s certainly possible that this tampering helped him decide to retire….even in a small amount. Why would there be a penalty for doing it if it weren’t possible? Rugby Saint II likes this.

08-08-2022, 02:29 PM	#20
SaintGnome 500th Post Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Bradenton,FL Posts: 642	Re: Dolphins Tampering Penalty Harmed Saints I remember seeing a special back in the day about coaching they spoke with Ditka, Vermeil, others and the point was brought up that after 10+ years in a job everybody in the building has heard everything you had to say.