Observations from games impacting Saints

Boston Saint · 09-13-2022, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by TheOak

Yes this is an onion regardless of how the talking heads portray it. Saints own the rights to Sean through 2024 and you are correct that's two seasons.

Quite a few stars have to align.
- Sean has to find what he called "the right fit".
- The Saints have to agree to releasing him. I wouldn't take a pick to let Sean go to the NFC South.
- The destination team has to offer something the Saints want. I suspect a 58yo winning-est coach for a franchise would be very expensive for a destination team.
- The destination team has to offer Sean something he wants. That Miami 100MM offer he turned down set a very high floor.

Lets assume all of the stars align... The Saints don't decide to hold on to his contract hoping he wants to come back to New Orleans after another year off, Dallas offers the moon to the Saints, and the Stars to Sean Payton.. While Sean and Jerry do have a good friendship, they are polar opposites in terms of Owner HC culture, Jerry can not keep his hands off and Sean requires autonomy. There would be a funeral after the first draft. I have some very close friends that I would never work with, and I believe that is where Sean is with Dallas/Jones.

What you say makes sense Oak. But all the stars don’t have to align quite like that. I’m not hoping for a Dallas trade. My main point is the team has 2 off-seasons to get something/anything (could be a little, could be a lot) for Payton. Trying to be hard nosed about it is not going to help the front office. If you act like you’re willing to release him then you are likely to have more interested parties do drive up the asking price. From what I saw on Sunday evening and the previous years in Dallas I think it’s highly likely Dallas will have a Head coaching vacancy after this season. There is at least rumored mutual interest between the cowboys and Payton. Telling them to hit the road if they called would be unwise IMO. That kind of negotiating is what netted them so little for the CGJ trade.

AsylumGuido · 09-13-2022, 01:30 PM

I agree with The Oak. I just don't see Payton as a fit with the Cowboys. His whole philosophy runs counter to everything that Jerry Jones insists upon from a head coach. People bring up the "past ties" with the Cowboys. That's been almost two decades ago. If McCarthy is gone after this season I see Dan Quinn as the much better fit. The players love him. He'll give way to Jerry's management style and he'll come at a bargain. Jerry loves his draft picks far too much to give them away.

Boston Saint · 09-13-2022, 01:35 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

I agree with The Oak. I just don't see Payton as a fit with the Cowboys. His whole philosophy runs counter to everything that Jerry Jones insists upon from a head coach. People bring up the "past ties" with the Cowboys. That's been almost two decades ago. If McCarthy is gone after this season I see Dan Quinn as the much better fit. The players love him. He'll give way to Jerry's management style and he'll come at a bargain. Jerry loves his draft picks far too much to give them away.

That’s fine Guido. But that is a lot different than your previous post of:

“I hope he tells Jones to go to hell and wait for the contract to expire.”

I think that would be the wrong move.

AsylumGuido · 09-13-2022, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

That’s fine Guido. But that is a lot different than your previous post of:

“I hope he tells Jones to go to hell and wait for the contract to expire.”

I think that would be the wrong move.

How is that different? I hate the Cowboys with a passion. Just because they would be a bad fit for the Cowboys doesn't mean I would ever want him to go there. Anywhere but the Cowboys if he comes back.

iceshack149 · 09-13-2022, 01:41 PM

Week One was a pretty ideal week for the Saints. They beat a division rival on the road, the Panthers lost, and all the teams in the NFC West except the Seahawks

lost.
Like all the other teams in the league the Saints have some cleaning up to do but they're in a good spot to start the season.

Boston Saint · 09-13-2022, 01:52 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

How is that different? I hate the Cowboys with a passion. Just because they would be a bad fit for the Cowboys doesn't mean I would ever want him to go there. Anywhere but the Cowboys if he comes back.

But in your emotional viewpoint, you wouldn’t trade him even if it was a good fit. WTF does it matter if he fits Dallas’ situation or not? That doesn’t matter to the Saints. You made an irrelevant post trying to explain how you “Just don’t see Payton as a fit” as a reason to argue against making a trade to Dallas when the truth is you wouldn’t do it just because it’s Dallas. THAT’S the difference.

AsylumGuido · 09-13-2022, 01:55 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

But in your emotional viewpoint, you wouldn’t trade him even if it was a good fit. WTF does it matter if he fits Dallas’ situation or not? That doesn’t matter to the Saints. You made an irrelevant post trying to explain how you “Just don’t see Payton as a fit” as a reason to argue against making a trade to Dallas when the truth is you wouldn’t do it just because it’s Dallas. THAT’S the difference.

My God you are in the mood to argue today. Over anything. What is it with you, Boston?

neugey · 09-13-2022, 01:57 PM

I have a weird hunch of the older coaches - Carroll, Belichick, Reid might retire and Payton becomes a suitor. Again, just a hunch.

AsylumGuido · 09-13-2022, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by neugey

I have a weird hunch of the older coaches - Carroll, Belichick, Reid might retire and Payton becomes a suitor. Again, just a hunch.

Now Kansas City would be a perfect fit for Payton. He'd get Mahomes like he's always wanted. He'd get full autonomy. And best yet, he'd be in the AFC!

Boston Saint · 09-13-2022, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

My God you are in the mood to argue today. Over anything. What is it with you, Boston?

Guido, have some self reflection. This entire thread was started by me making observations. You proceeded to disagree with me on at least two of them. Who is the one being argumentative? My God you dish it out but you won’t take it.

09-13-2022, 01:23 PM	#21
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints Originally Posted by TheOak Yes this is an onion regardless of how the talking heads portray it. Saints own the rights to Sean through 2024 and you are correct that's two seasons. Quite a few stars have to align. - Sean has to find what he called "the right fit". - The Saints have to agree to releasing him. I wouldn't take a pick to let Sean go to the NFC South. - The destination team has to offer something the Saints want. I suspect a 58yo winning-est coach for a franchise would be very expensive for a destination team. - The destination team has to offer Sean something he wants. That Miami 100MM offer he turned down set a very high floor. Lets assume all of the stars align... The Saints don't decide to hold on to his contract hoping he wants to come back to New Orleans after another year off, Dallas offers the moon to the Saints, and the Stars to Sean Payton.. While Sean and Jerry do have a good friendship, they are polar opposites in terms of Owner HC culture, Jerry can not keep his hands off and Sean requires autonomy. There would be a funeral after the first draft. I have some very close friends that I would never work with, and I believe that is where Sean is with Dallas/Jones. What you say makes sense Oak. But all the stars don’t have to align quite like that. I’m not hoping for a Dallas trade. My main point is the team has 2 off-seasons to get something/anything (could be a little, could be a lot) for Payton. Trying to be hard nosed about it is not going to help the front office. If you act like you’re willing to release him then you are likely to have more interested parties do drive up the asking price. From what I saw on Sunday evening and the previous years in Dallas I think it’s highly likely Dallas will have a Head coaching vacancy after this season. There is at least rumored mutual interest between the cowboys and Payton. Telling them to hit the road if they called would be unwise IMO. That kind of negotiating is what netted them so little for the CGJ trade.
	You think you know, but you don’t know...and you never will! Coach Jim Mora

09-13-2022, 01:30 PM	#22
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,220	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints I agree with The Oak. I just don't see Payton as a fit with the Cowboys. His whole philosophy runs counter to everything that Jerry Jones insists upon from a head coach. People bring up the "past ties" with the Cowboys. That's been almost two decades ago. If McCarthy is gone after this season I see Dan Quinn as the much better fit. The players love him. He'll give way to Jerry's management style and he'll come at a bargain. Jerry loves his draft picks far too much to give them away.

09-13-2022, 01:35 PM	#23
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints Originally Posted by AsylumGuido I agree with The Oak. I just don't see Payton as a fit with the Cowboys. His whole philosophy runs counter to everything that Jerry Jones insists upon from a head coach. People bring up the "past ties" with the Cowboys. That's been almost two decades ago. If McCarthy is gone after this season I see Dan Quinn as the much better fit. The players love him. He'll give way to Jerry's management style and he'll come at a bargain. Jerry loves his draft picks far too much to give them away. That’s fine Guido. But that is a lot different than your previous post of: “I hope he tells Jones to go to hell and wait for the contract to expire.” I think that would be the wrong move.

09-13-2022, 01:40 PM	#24
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,220	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints Originally Posted by Boston Saint That’s fine Guido. But that is a lot different than your previous post of: “I hope he tells Jones to go to hell and wait for the contract to expire.” I think that would be the wrong move. How is that different? I hate the Cowboys with a passion. Just because they would be a bad fit for the Cowboys doesn't mean I would ever want him to go there. Anywhere but the Cowboys if he comes back.

09-13-2022, 01:41 PM	#25
iceshack149 1000 Posts + Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Fairbanks, AK Posts: 4,258 Blog Entries: 1	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints Week One was a pretty ideal week for the Saints. They beat a division rival on the road, the Panthers lost, and all the teams in the NFC West except the Seahawks lost. Like all the other teams in the league the Saints have some cleaning up to do but they're in a good spot to start the season. AsylumGuido and Boston Saint like this.

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09-13-2022, 01:52 PM	#26
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints Originally Posted by AsylumGuido How is that different? I hate the Cowboys with a passion. Just because they would be a bad fit for the Cowboys doesn't mean I would ever want him to go there. Anywhere but the Cowboys if he comes back. But in your emotional viewpoint, you wouldn’t trade him even if it was a good fit. WTF does it matter if he fits Dallas’ situation or not? That doesn’t matter to the Saints. You made an irrelevant post trying to explain how you “Just don’t see Payton as a fit” as a reason to argue against making a trade to Dallas when the truth is you wouldn’t do it just because it’s Dallas. THAT’S the difference.

09-13-2022, 01:55 PM	#27
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,220	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints Originally Posted by Boston Saint But in your emotional viewpoint, you wouldn’t trade him even if it was a good fit. WTF does it matter if he fits Dallas’ situation or not? That doesn’t matter to the Saints. You made an irrelevant post trying to explain how you “Just don’t see Payton as a fit” as a reason to argue against making a trade to Dallas when the truth is you wouldn’t do it just because it’s Dallas. THAT’S the difference. My God you are in the mood to argue today. Over anything. What is it with you, Boston?

09-13-2022, 01:57 PM	#28
neugey Hu Dat! Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 6,697 Blog Entries: 13	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints I have a weird hunch of the older coaches - Carroll, Belichick, Reid might retire and Payton becomes a suitor. Again, just a hunch. AsylumGuido likes this.

09-13-2022, 02:00 PM	#29
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,220	Re: Observations from games impacting Saints Originally Posted by neugey I have a weird hunch of the older coaches - Carroll, Belichick, Reid might retire and Payton becomes a suitor. Again, just a hunch. Now Kansas City would be a perfect fit for Payton. He'd get Mahomes like he's always wanted. He'd get full autonomy. And best yet, he'd be in the AFC!