Nitpicking 101

vulture · 04-11-2004, 09:40 PM

When will people start to learn that size is not the end all. If a guy goes out there and plays big, who gives a damn how big he actually is. Time after time the smaller guys end up being the better than some big guy that was drafted before them.

That sounds like a quote from the Mike Ditka Draft Handbook. Draft these guys:

a. With heart.
b. With no measurables from a winning college program.
c. With no measurables from a big college program.

On other words, I can teach a monkey to play a slot machine but he has to be able to reach the coin slot.

BlackandBlue · 04-12-2004, 07:48 AM

In this case, weight is a non-factor. Vilma only needs about 20 more pounds to be considered legit, and with any NFL program, he can do that within two years. He\'s got the frame to add the weight. Weight should almost be a non-issue (be more concerned with how much weight can be added rather than how much is there now).

Danno · 04-12-2004, 08:33 AM

Vilma was 6\'-1\", 232 lbs.
Why does everyone think this is small?
Many quality MLB in the NFL are about this size.

Starting NFL Middle Linebackers
5-11, 230 Zack Thomas, MIA
6-1, 225 Shelton Quarles, TB
6-0, 234 Mark Simeneu, PHL
6-0, 229 Robert Thomas, STL
6-1, 230 Mike Peterson, JAX

And the best middle linebacker in the NFL,
Ray Lewis 6-0 245 (came into NFL @ 225 lbs)

[Edited on 12/4/2004 by Danno]

WhoDat · 04-12-2004, 01:38 PM

Amen to that Danno. I seem to remember a fierce LB from up around my way by the name of Singletary who was pretty fierce as a smaller guy... and lest we forget the best LB to ever wear black and gold. They called him the field mouse, and if you don\'t know then you don\'t know.

DatFu · 04-12-2004, 04:30 PM

yeah and huge linemen used to be 265 too. vilma would have been great if he\'d been playing with butkus. and if i had a nickle for every time i seen zach thomas get run over the last couple of year, i\'d be havin dinner at commander\'s every night.

BlackandBlue · 04-12-2004, 04:33 PM

Yeah, I\'d bet all the money in the world that Mills could still be a great linebacker, even in \"today\'s\" NFL.

WhoDat · 04-12-2004, 07:23 PM

Damn right.

JimBone · 04-13-2004, 09:11 PM

OK...here is what i dont get...If all of you are pretty much dead set that Hall and Robinson and gonna be gone when we pick and you all believe that Vilma is gonna be there...then why would you be upset if the Saints would draft one of CB\'s over Vilma? If Vilma were as good as rAGE says he is...he would be a top 5 pick. I like Vilma, i really do, but the guy is not Ray Lewis and i dont like the comparison. Until he wins the SuperBowl, wins defensive MVP awards...establishes his mark of dominance...and stabs 2 or 3 people...I dont want to hear the argument. I think Hall and Robinson are safer picks than Vilma and you must too because you think they will be gone and Vilma will still be there. Who is to say that Keyaron Fox wont be better than Vilma and that Keith Smith wont be better than Hall and Robinson. None of us know and i cant wait for the draft so i can stop hearing about Vilma. rAGE should be the guy\'s agent because he does a good job of talking him up but i am still not sold on him. I wouldnt mind him in black and gold but hearing all this is making me dislike the guy already.

Euphoria · 04-13-2004, 09:50 PM

I seriously doubt that Vilma will be there past 12. He is a stud and will be a great LB in the NFL.

There are a lot of different senerios and they change every hour... but take a look at our (B&G Mock Draft).

[Edited on 14/4/2004 by Euphoria]

Boogro · 04-14-2004, 02:44 PM

I am with Jimbone. It seems everybody has a draft history almanac right infront of them when they talk. Who cares who went 26th in 1998 draft and 50th in the 2000 draft? That\'s all a bunch of crap. These prospects go through the Combine where they look at every little thing on a players anatomy, run them through drills, interview them, give wonderlic tests etc etc. Now all of the best coaches, scouts, and everyone else to do with an organizion and testing every player invited\'s abilities. Now, if a person like Vilma comes along and everyone there says \"He\'s a bit undersized\", you might believe them. Hell, I do. These guys are the best at what they do and that is study football players. Now, of course they are not always right. There are busts and there are diamonds in the rough. Also, these scouts have been watching these guys all year long, go to their schools workout days and everything else. Would you give these guys just a little credit? You know, you can compare every player coming out to a guy in the NFL in the same position with the same height and weight and say \"Well this guy is sucessful so this guy is a sure bet. He\'s going to be Ray Lewis.\" All of these so called \"experts\" and scouts deserve a little credit. If oyu have your heart set on a certain player, no matter what anyone else says about him, then fine, say he is the greatest thing to come alone since Ray Lewis. I just know I am not buying it.

[Edited on 14/4/2004 by Boogro]

04-11-2004, 09:40 PM	#1
vulture Registered Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 83	Nitpicking 101 When will people start to learn that size is not the end all. If a guy goes out there and plays big, who gives a damn how big he actually is. Time after time the smaller guys end up being the better than some big guy that was drafted before them. That sounds like a quote from the Mike Ditka Draft Handbook. Draft these guys: a. With heart. b. With no measurables from a winning college program. c. With no measurables from a big college program. On other words, I can teach a monkey to play a slot machine but he has to be able to reach the coin slot.
vulture Registered Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 83

04-12-2004, 07:48 AM	#2
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	Nitpicking 101 In this case, weight is a non-factor. Vilma only needs about 20 more pounds to be considered legit, and with any NFL program, he can do that within two years. He\'s got the frame to add the weight. Weight should almost be a non-issue (be more concerned with how much weight can be added rather than how much is there now).

04-12-2004, 08:33 AM	#3
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,756	Nitpicking 101 Vilma was 6\'-1\", 232 lbs. Why does everyone think this is small? Many quality MLB in the NFL are about this size. Starting NFL Middle Linebackers 5-11, 230 Zack Thomas, MIA 6-1, 225 Shelton Quarles, TB 6-0, 234 Mark Simeneu, PHL 6-0, 229 Robert Thomas, STL 6-1, 230 Mike Peterson, JAX And the best middle linebacker in the NFL, Ray Lewis 6-0 245 (came into NFL @ 225 lbs) [Edited on 12/4/2004 by Danno]

04-12-2004, 01:38 PM	#4
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Nitpicking 101 Amen to that Danno. I seem to remember a fierce LB from up around my way by the name of Singletary who was pretty fierce as a smaller guy... and lest we forget the best LB to ever wear black and gold. They called him the field mouse, and if you don\'t know then you don\'t know.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631

04-12-2004, 04:30 PM	#5
DatFu Registered Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 57	Nitpicking 101 yeah and huge linemen used to be 265 too. vilma would have been great if he\'d been playing with butkus. and if i had a nickle for every time i seen zach thomas get run over the last couple of year, i\'d be havin dinner at commander\'s every night.
DatFu Registered Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 57

04-12-2004, 04:33 PM	#6
BlackandBlue Kinder, gentler Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: dirty south Posts: 3,889	Nitpicking 101 Yeah, I\'d bet all the money in the world that Mills could still be a great linebacker, even in \"today\'s\" NFL.

04-12-2004, 07:23 PM	#7
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631	Nitpicking 101 Damn right.
WhoDat 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,631

04-13-2004, 09:11 PM	#8
JimBone 500th Post Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Thibodaux, La Posts: 614	Nitpicking 101 OK...here is what i dont get...If all of you are pretty much dead set that Hall and Robinson and gonna be gone when we pick and you all believe that Vilma is gonna be there...then why would you be upset if the Saints would draft one of CB\'s over Vilma? If Vilma were as good as rAGE says he is...he would be a top 5 pick. I like Vilma, i really do, but the guy is not Ray Lewis and i dont like the comparison. Until he wins the SuperBowl, wins defensive MVP awards...establishes his mark of dominance...and stabs 2 or 3 people...I dont want to hear the argument. I think Hall and Robinson are safer picks than Vilma and you must too because you think they will be gone and Vilma will still be there. Who is to say that Keyaron Fox wont be better than Vilma and that Keith Smith wont be better than Hall and Robinson. None of us know and i cant wait for the draft so i can stop hearing about Vilma. rAGE should be the guy\'s agent because he does a good job of talking him up but i am still not sold on him. I wouldnt mind him in black and gold but hearing all this is making me dislike the guy already.
	Aaaaaayyyyyy!! -The Fonz

04-13-2004, 09:50 PM	#9
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Nitpicking 101 I seriously doubt that Vilma will be there past 12. He is a stud and will be a great LB in the NFL. There are a lot of different senerios and they change every hour... but take a look at our (B&G Mock Draft). [Edited on 14/4/2004 by Euphoria]

04-14-2004, 02:44 PM	#10
Boogro Nose Digger Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Thibodaux Posts: 341	Nitpicking 101 I am with Jimbone. It seems everybody has a draft history almanac right infront of them when they talk. Who cares who went 26th in 1998 draft and 50th in the 2000 draft? That\'s all a bunch of crap. These prospects go through the Combine where they look at every little thing on a players anatomy, run them through drills, interview them, give wonderlic tests etc etc. Now all of the best coaches, scouts, and everyone else to do with an organizion and testing every player invited\'s abilities. Now, if a person like Vilma comes along and everyone there says \"He\'s a bit undersized\", you might believe them. Hell, I do. These guys are the best at what they do and that is study football players. Now, of course they are not always right. There are busts and there are diamonds in the rough. Also, these scouts have been watching these guys all year long, go to their schools workout days and everything else. Would you give these guys just a little credit? You know, you can compare every player coming out to a guy in the NFL in the same position with the same height and weight and say \"Well this guy is sucessful so this guy is a sure bet. He\'s going to be Ray Lewis.\" All of these so called \"experts\" and scouts deserve a little credit. If oyu have your heart set on a certain player, no matter what anyone else says about him, then fine, say he is the greatest thing to come alone since Ray Lewis. I just know I am not buying it. [Edited on 14/4/2004 by Boogro]