jokeray

going after injured players is NOT the same as a team paying their players BONUS' for injuring players.

It's one thing for players to do it, it's another thing for a team to endorse it/pay their players for doing it.

Not trying to start a fight, just voicing my opinion that it's NOT the same thing.

Supertek

This whole thing is just screwed up. The Saints got theirs but I wish someone else would take their hits too. There has to be penalities for others otherwish Goodell is disgraced.

OldMaid

No jokeray, both are the same in that both are wrong. Wrong. Immoral. Not part of this sport.


Goodell wants to put player safety first.
great. NFL has some lawsuits against it for severe injuries , concussions , by past players.

Well, the NFL is not protecting themselves by being so severe with Saints' punishments.
As if former players' atty's, insurance companies will look at this Giants ' record in print. Other teams bounty talk that is out there on record.

This was a very good effort and great bandaid by Goodell.
You know what happens to bandaids.

PatMcIrish

I keep hearing you guys asking penalties for others, who else has been taped and up against this kind of clear evidence? If it's out there you're absolutely right, they should be punished as well.

And FTR I agree about Goodell, not sure what he is thinking sometime. The Pats should have gotten a lot more than they did. But in the end none of that is relevant, what you guys did was wrong and frankly I'm shocked so many of you are okay with it.

I'm a Bucs fan first, like the Saints 2nd, but I remember when Sapp kicked someone in the head. I pissed everyone on the Bucs board off for jumping on but I knew he did it on purpose. The old "accidently" kick the QB in the head as you pretend to try and step over the pile.

I guess we're all different, to me as a Saint fan or not I'd be outraged at what my boys were doing. There's no excuse for that kind of crap, but since it's your team most are giving a pass.

SaintsBro

Pat, people ARE outraged about it.

But there are links all over the internet, including IN THIS THREAD, to actual players admitting about the Giants targeting opposing players for specific injuries (concussions in the 49ers game) and about the Packers having a similar cash bounty program to the Saints in 2007 (it's called Googling something, you should try "Packers bounty 2007" and read). That, including the Saints, means that the last three Super Bowl teams ALL recently had either bounty programs in place, or specific targeting of players with malicious intent to injure. Not to even mention, known past bounty systems in places like Washington, the Ravens, the Titans and others. Where are their fines and suspensions? Where is the investigation of them? Where was Goodell and the league on this issue, before 2010 and the concussion lawsuits? YOU tell me what the league did to crack down on it.

YOU prove it -- YOU prove the league is out there actually investigating these other teams, and not sweeping this whole phenomenon under the rug after "sending a message" to the Saints. YOU show me some other team that is being investigated by the NFL. It's my turn to smugly stand up and yell "Link, please!" like a total *******.

It's not an EXCUSE, dummy. Get a clue, NOBODY is sticking up for bounties and Gregg Williams!!!! What people here are pissed off about, is that these other stories about other teams are not getting ANY media or league attention, and that idiotic people Like you seem to want to come here and smugly lecture Saints fans about morality and ethics, as if WE were the ones who were paying the bounties. News flash. We are not small children. We don't need you to come here and spank us and smugly lecture to us. And yet you're acting LIKE WE ARE the ones who paid the bounties and told the players to target the ACL! Come on, get a clue, man!

PatMcIrish

Links on the net? That's your evidence?


Wow, just wow.


I understand not wanting to take a stand because other Saint fans might bash you, for some respect is hard to acquire. But for the love of GOD I don't see why at least a few men here wouldn't have the balls to speak out for what happened here.

If it happened on every other team it still wouldn't change a thing. GW and your head coach should never work in the NFL again. EVER! That would be a good start. Nip this crap in the bud before it gets out of hand. I sure expected better from the Saints.

SaintsBro

Where were you in January when this story broke? Oh that's right, I can see by your join date on the left, you WEREN'T here. Virtually everybody in this forum and every Saints fan I know on Facebook or in person, has already spoken out about it -- believe me, people were horrified and outraged. It doesn't change the fact that you are STILL acting like WE were the ones who were paying the bounties or were supporting it. We are not small children. Thank you for stopping by to deliver the smug morality lesson, but we don't need it, we've already been there and done that. Thank you so much for coming here and spanking us and making us stand in the corner like little children, we really needed that.

OldMaid

PatMcIrish, like rat99, read. Try reading around here.
No Real Saints ' fans here and around think, hey this was ok.
SB when GWilliams said to media about giving PManning " don't forget me hits " was NOT funny, fun. It was not ok. No one here thought it was funny esp when the Saints had so much on the line. Being the unfavored team. Not being called the legit team. Knowing the league and PTB (powers that be) wanted Old Brett there against PM. Ratings. Money. Match up.

Everyone here is outraged.
No one here is giving Saints a pass.

Ok, did you READ this?
Now, you must learn comprehension skills.
I think problem is that you and rat99 do not have comprehension skills.
That is a big problem with the school children taking the state tests . Many read well enough. They are on tasks with their reading skills, but they cannot comprehend. That is the other half of reading.
Everything is reading. The Math problems are all word problems.

Pat, rat99,
use your RUBIES.
R-read
U-underline
B-
I-
E-
S-

Ok, off my rant.

I hope you understand now.
No one here is saying the Saints should be given a pass if the other teams on record are given a pass.
We are saying, other teams should be punished as well. They are on record.
Hey, I get it though. Saints, small market, no powerful owner, team that got there that was never to make it to the big prize got there and blew out wrong teams and people namely Old Man Brett and PM, ehhh, not good for business.
I get that.
I also get player safety is number one.
Like I said in previous posts, this is a bandaid effect.

People like you and Belicheck is that you don't accept the Saint's punishments no more than we do. Opposite reasons.
Saints' fans think it is too severe and other teams slipped under radar even though they are on record. Ok, Saints ' punishment is done. A done deal. We Saints' fans think it is too severe and other teams on record have slipped by, but now I am thinking, fine. Take this punishment with no appeals.
Fess up. Be the bigger person, team.
Take your bitter pil and chew it. Savor it.
Done. Maybe it is good , a real favor from the league by giving the Saint's the worst puinshment ever in NFL history.
No other fans and teams cannot say the Saints' got no fair punishment for wrong doing.

However, it seems people like you , Belicheck, Colts fans, Falcons fans, other fans wont' be satisfied until Saint's SB is recalled and Saints' team is disbanned.
That aint' happening!!!
Saint's won SB and that season fair and square. They also lost games fair and square too.
Saints' franchise is not going anywhere.


I just hope and pray these Saints' players and coaching staff comes out fighting this year.
Go for broke!
Play every game as if it is a Playoff game or SB. Put up and shut up the rest of the league.
When you get in a situation like this, there is no place to go but up.
Sorry Coach Spags inherited this, but then, I am glad he is the man to have inherited this.
For his career record this can be a good thing. He can add savior to his record. Turn this thing around.

PatMcIrish

A couple fair points, I am new so haven't read what everyone has posted, maybe some did step up to the plate. Since I got here though and reading it lately it's mostly crying about other teams doing the same thing, it being no big deal, and that Goodall is a jerk. Have seen nobody step up and say I'M DISGUSTED WITH THE SAINTS AND WHAT THEY HAVE DONE!!!

Also, since more information is coming out then opinions will change. Just because you said something in January doesn't mean that opinion will be the same. As information is obtained then opinions can/will change as well. So what I posted here is new, this just happened. Not the whole issue but all these details about going for ACL's and trying to injure specific players was something I wasn't aware of.

In the end I have to say both SP and GW should not ever coach again. You get young kids right out of college and these are the coaches that are trying to shape their career? They're really trying to make the NFL more about hurting guys then trying to win legally? That's my beef, I'm afraid this crap will catch on, as a fan I would be clear to anyone that listens I'm not okay with it.

PatMcIrish

And BTW I'm not sure your ring should be taken away. I doubt the NFL does that although there is talk of "everything still being on the table". This latest stuff was done when the team knew very clearly an investigation was in order. Both GW and SP should pay the ultimate price, this goes beyond arrogance.

Take your ring away? Naw. Although some will look at you guys winning it much differently now, me included. Nor do I want to see the team disbanded or anything else, just think both SP and GW should never coach again in the NFL. A clear and powerful message should be sent here. If proof of other teams doing it then the same measures should apply.