Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag

03-03-2014, 09:06 AM

The only player I can think of that had as much success elsewhere as they did here was Jonathan Goodwin, and maybe Reggie Bush.

And it could be said that at 10 million, Bush didn't exactly set the world on fire in Miami, and they dumped him after 2 seasons.

TheOak · 03-03-2014, 09:08 AM

Originally Posted by ScottF

The Pats currently have the highest paid TE in the NFL. The diff is they have significantly less money tied up at QB.

Brady 15m
Brees 18m

3m delta

xan · 03-03-2014, 09:12 AM

He disappeared against good teams. He can't get separation at the line. He can't block, or doesn't want to. He's had alligator arms since September.

I'm sure he's worth something. Probably more than Gronk. But Wes Welker had a better year.

I'm starting to get tired of individual performers in team activities believing their hype. I'm half expecting JG to start saying he's his own hero...

Danno · 03-03-2014, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by xan

He disappeared against good teams. He can't get separation at the line. He can't block, or doesn't want to. He's had alligator arms since September.

I'm sure he's worth something. Probably more than Gronk. But Wes Welker had a better year.

I'm starting to get tired of individual performers in team activities believing their hype. I'm half expecting JG to start saying he's his own hero...

I used to think that too, but looking at his game logs, he was only shut down against New England, St Louis and Seattle.

In 14 of 18 games, many against good teams, he showed up just fine.

Jimmy Graham Game By Game Stats and Performance - New Orleans Saints - ESPN

Saintaintso · 03-03-2014, 09:52 AM

It's not about stats ... When we needed a score in Seattle he was absent all game. And to think that he disappeared against the Pats and Hawks is ironic. Both had elite corners , only Elite Recivers beat elite corners which further justifies why he shouldn't be paid as an elite Reciver. As he wasn't able to muster up more than 2 or 3 catches in those entire games !

Let him walk ... He's nothing we can't recreate and dare I say Brees was worlds better before throwing to Graham. More than Half of his Picks happen when targeting Graham.

Graham is a special guy I get it , he's my favorite player but he's only going to be that good if he has an elite QB throwing to him. Let him go on and learn that lesson Meachem did. By the time he comes to his senses well have another version that might even be able to block and create separation.

Drew makes our Recivers good. He throws them open , they are never wide open.

I'd gladly take 2 1st round picks ...

K Major · 03-03-2014, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

I used to think that too, but looking at his game logs, he was only shut down against New England, St Louis and Seattle.

In 14 of 18 games, many against good teams, he showed up just fine.

Jimmy Graham Game By Game Stats and Performance - New Orleans Saints - ESPN

+1. No shame in having a bad day against any of those defensive minded teams. It happens..

TheOak · 03-03-2014, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by Saintaintso

It's not about stats ... When we needed a score in Seattle he was absent all game. And to think that he disappeared against the Pats and Hawks is ironic. Both had elite corners , only Elite Recivers beat elite corners which further justifies why he shouldn't be paid as an elite Reciver. As he wasn't able to muster up more than 2 or 3 catches in those entire games !

Let him walk ... He's nothing we can't recreate and dare I say Brees was worlds better before throwing to Graham. More than Half of his Picks happen when targeting Graham.

Graham is a special guy I get it , he's my favorite player but he's only going to be that good if he has an elite QB throwing to him. Let him go on and learn that lesson Meachem did. By the time he comes to his senses well have another version that might even be able to block and create separation.

Drew makes our Recivers good. He throws them open , they are never wide open.

I'd gladly take 2 1st round picks ...

You contradict your self a good bit and as far as attendance at games.

None of these guys are elite.
When Cleveland needed a TD against Green bay, Josh Gordon was absent.
When Pittsburgh needed a score against Baltimore, Antonio Brown was absent.
When Detroit needed score against Tampa Bay, Calvin Johnson was absent.
When Houston needed a score in 14 games, Andre' Johnson was absent.
When Philly needed a TD against Dallas, DeSean Jackson was absent.

Comparing stats has a lot fewer holes than your logic.

Saintaintso · 03-03-2014, 12:22 PM

Yeah but jimmy isn't drawing the oppositions best corner in route to putting up those stats ,

The guys you mentioned are getting it from the gate , and the hole in your logic is none of those guys have a Drew Brees throwing to them either so they probably would've shown up had they had a decent QB on their side.

If he wants elite WR money he ought to be an elite WR ... Where's the misstep in that logic ?

Both times he drew #1 corners attention he was a dud ... Checkmate

Utah_Saint · 03-03-2014, 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by Saintaintso

Yeah but jimmy isn't drawing the oppositions best corner in route to putting up those stats ,

...Both times he drew #1 corners attention he was a dud ... Checkmate

So every team's #1 corner could stop him, but the team chooses not to? Why do you think they'd chose to allow Graham to keep scoring against them if they could stop him?

TheOak · 03-03-2014, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by Saintaintso

Yeah but jimmy isn't drawing the oppositions best corner in route to putting up those stats ,

The guys you mentioned are getting it from the gate , and the hole in your logic is none of those guys have a Drew Brees throwing to them either so they probably would've shown up had they had a decent QB on their side.

If he wants elite WR money he ought to be an elite WR ... Where's the misstep in that logic ?

Both times he drew #1 corners attention he was a dud ... Checkmate

Perhaps you need an interpreter, I never mentioned QBs or Drew brees.

You do not play much Chess do you?
He drew the best CBs when the opponent had top CBs.
Talib
Chancelor/Thomas
Ogletree

The top tier WRs that I listed do not always dray the best CBs either, they get a variety just like Jimmy does.

Andre' Johnson drew coverage from 6 defenders against Indi, and 8 defenders against Jax. All elite WRs were kept off the boards at one time or another. Graham still put up more TDs than any other player that wasn't a QB in the entire NFL in 2013.

If Jimmy isn't drawing their best, who is? Lance Moore? Or do opponents not try anf put their best against our best?

Yahtzee!

03-03-2014, 09:06 AM	#41
Threaded by Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,723 Rating: (0 votes - average) The only player I can think of that had as much success elsewhere as they did here was Jonathan Goodwin, and maybe Reggie Bush. And it could be said that at 10 million, Bush didn't exactly set the world on fire in Miami, and they dumped him after 2 seasons.
Views: 12830

03-03-2014, 09:08 AM	#42
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag Originally Posted by ScottF The Pats currently have the highest paid TE in the NFL. The diff is they have significantly less money tied up at QB. Brady 15m Brees 18m 3m delta
	Last edited by TheOak; 03-03-2014 at 09:10 AM..

03-03-2014, 09:12 AM	#43
xan Professor Crab and Site Donor 2014 Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Princeton Posts: 3,371 Blog Entries: 34	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag He disappeared against good teams. He can't get separation at the line. He can't block, or doesn't want to. He's had alligator arms since September. I'm sure he's worth something. Probably more than Gronk. But Wes Welker had a better year. I'm starting to get tired of individual performers in team activities believing their hype. I'm half expecting JG to start saying he's his own hero...

03-03-2014, 09:24 AM	#44
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,723	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag Originally Posted by xan He disappeared against good teams. He can't get separation at the line. He can't block, or doesn't want to. He's had alligator arms since September. I'm sure he's worth something. Probably more than Gronk. But Wes Welker had a better year. I'm starting to get tired of individual performers in team activities believing their hype. I'm half expecting JG to start saying he's his own hero... I used to think that too, but looking at his game logs, he was only shut down against New England, St Louis and Seattle. In 14 of 18 games, many against good teams, he showed up just fine. Jimmy Graham Game By Game Stats and Performance - New Orleans Saints - ESPN K Major likes this.

03-03-2014, 09:52 AM	#45
Saintaintso 500th Post Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 937	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag It's not about stats ... When we needed a score in Seattle he was absent all game. And to think that he disappeared against the Pats and Hawks is ironic. Both had elite corners , only Elite Recivers beat elite corners which further justifies why he shouldn't be paid as an elite Reciver. As he wasn't able to muster up more than 2 or 3 catches in those entire games ! Let him walk ... He's nothing we can't recreate and dare I say Brees was worlds better before throwing to Graham. More than Half of his Picks happen when targeting Graham. Graham is a special guy I get it , he's my favorite player but he's only going to be that good if he has an elite QB throwing to him. Let him go on and learn that lesson Meachem did. By the time he comes to his senses well have another version that might even be able to block and create separation. Drew makes our Recivers good. He throws them open , they are never wide open. I'd gladly take 2 1st round picks ...
Saintaintso 500th Post Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 937	You Can't Say Impossible without first saying Im Possible ...

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03-03-2014, 10:18 AM	#46
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,622 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag Originally Posted by Danno I used to think that too, but looking at his game logs, he was only shut down against New England, St Louis and Seattle. In 14 of 18 games, many against good teams, he showed up just fine. Jimmy Graham Game By Game Stats and Performance - New Orleans Saints - ESPN +1. No shame in having a bad day against any of those defensive minded teams. It happens..

03-03-2014, 12:04 PM	#47
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag Originally Posted by Saintaintso It's not about stats ... When we needed a score in Seattle he was absent all game. And to think that he disappeared against the Pats and Hawks is ironic. Both had elite corners , only Elite Recivers beat elite corners which further justifies why he shouldn't be paid as an elite Reciver. As he wasn't able to muster up more than 2 or 3 catches in those entire games ! Let him walk ... He's nothing we can't recreate and dare I say Brees was worlds better before throwing to Graham. More than Half of his Picks happen when targeting Graham. Graham is a special guy I get it , he's my favorite player but he's only going to be that good if he has an elite QB throwing to him. Let him go on and learn that lesson Meachem did. By the time he comes to his senses well have another version that might even be able to block and create separation. Drew makes our Recivers good. He throws them open , they are never wide open. I'd gladly take 2 1st round picks ... You contradict your self a good bit and as far as attendance at games. None of these guys are elite. When Cleveland needed a TD against Green bay, Josh Gordon was absent. When Pittsburgh needed a score against Baltimore, Antonio Brown was absent. When Detroit needed score against Tampa Bay, Calvin Johnson was absent. When Houston needed a score in 14 games, Andre' Johnson was absent. When Philly needed a TD against Dallas, DeSean Jackson was absent. Comparing stats has a lot fewer holes than your logic.

03-03-2014, 12:22 PM	#48
Saintaintso 500th Post Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 937	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag Yeah but jimmy isn't drawing the oppositions best corner in route to putting up those stats , The guys you mentioned are getting it from the gate , and the hole in your logic is none of those guys have a Drew Brees throwing to them either so they probably would've shown up had they had a decent QB on their side. If he wants elite WR money he ought to be an elite WR ... Where's the misstep in that logic ? Both times he drew #1 corners attention he was a dud ... Checkmate
Saintaintso 500th Post Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 937

03-03-2014, 12:38 PM	#49
Utah_Saint Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 3,521	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag Originally Posted by Saintaintso Yeah but jimmy isn't drawing the oppositions best corner in route to putting up those stats , ...Both times he drew #1 corners attention he was a dud ... Checkmate So every team's #1 corner could stop him, but the team chooses not to? Why do you think they'd chose to allow Graham to keep scoring against them if they could stop him? ScottF likes this.

03-03-2014, 12:51 PM	#50
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,027	Re: Saints could lose Jimmy Graham with non-exclusive tag Originally Posted by Saintaintso Yeah but jimmy isn't drawing the oppositions best corner in route to putting up those stats , The guys you mentioned are getting it from the gate , and the hole in your logic is none of those guys have a Drew Brees throwing to them either so they probably would've shown up had they had a decent QB on their side. If he wants elite WR money he ought to be an elite WR ... Where's the misstep in that logic ? Both times he drew #1 corners attention he was a dud ... Checkmate Perhaps you need an interpreter, I never mentioned QBs or Drew brees. You do not play much Chess do you? He drew the best CBs when the opponent had top CBs. Talib Chancelor/Thomas Ogletree The top tier WRs that I listed do not always dray the best CBs either, they get a variety just like Jimmy does. Andre' Johnson drew coverage from 6 defenders against Indi, and 8 defenders against Jax. All elite WRs were kept off the boards at one time or another. Graham still put up more TDs than *any* other player that wasn't a QB in the entire NFL in 2013. If Jimmy isn't drawing their best, who is? Lance Moore? Or do opponents not try anf put their best against our best? Yahtzee! Saintaintso and AliJee like this.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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