secondary

halloween 65 · 09-22-2014, 11:31 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

Who would have thought after 3 games our top rated CB would be Corey White?

I'm starting to worry that SJB was a bad pick. We have an UDFA CB playing CB while SJB is riding the pine.

Hopefully its just a case of Dixon playing so much better than anyone thought, another diamond in the rough.

White is ony going to get better.I got Dixon pushing Robinson if he goes down, maybe if he don't. Robinson needs some good games to change things around. How do you think Bush has been? With the tools in the secondary if they got there crap together as one, we might get by with the inside lb.ers sloth like movement, they should concentrate at least shoring up the run. I wish we would trade to get a stud ILB. we could afford it.

Danno · 09-22-2014, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by halloween 65

White is ony going to get better.I got Dixon pushing Robinson if he goes down, maybe if he don't. Robinson needs some good games to change things around. How do you think Bush has been? With the tools in the secondary if they got there crap together as one, we might get by with the inside lb.ers sloth like movement, they should concentrate at least shoring up the run. I wish we would trade to get a stud ILB. we could afford it.

I've never been impressed with Bush. He's an OK starter, but certainly nothing special. He's often way out of the picture when a WR catches the ball.

We could do worse, and have, but he's just average in my opinion.

VegasSaint9 · 09-22-2014, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by dizzle88

Vikings are in I formation, with 2 receivers to the left, play action fake
The full back comes through the line and heads to the sideline
NOW, Ramon Humber backs up but does not go for the full back, Keenan lewis and Humber end up covering the same zone where the full back has leaked out to.
Which Vacates a huge space on the deep left off the field where I believe Keenan Lewis should have dropped back into, Patterson runs a corner route and Byrd is covering jennings running a deep route.

Patterson was left completely unmarked and byrd has to come back to make the tackle, from the way Keenan lewis acted I believe he was at fault, he jumped the full back when he came through the line when humber already had that zone covered

I dont know the coverage on the play but if it was a cover 3/1 with byrd up top(probably 50 yards back for whatever reason), in most defenses the cover 3 corner is supposed to come down on rollouts and floods while the safety is supposed is supposed to occupy the zone previously occupied by the corner. The far side corner then should assume the safety role, the safety assumes the corners old role as deep third to that play. I think Byrd either was covering for a a bigger potential play/ just playing deepest threat. Humber then has responsibility for chasing the qb and lewis for the outside threat. I think the far side corner should've had responsibility of Jennings then.

VegasSaint9 · 09-22-2014, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by Danno

I've never been impressed with Bush. He's an OK starter, but certainly nothing special. He's often way out of the picture when a WR catches the ball.

We could do worse, and have, but he's just average in my opinion.

I believe that's improper coaching or just plain bad instincts. None of our players ever appear to be a prime position helping each other out making plays on the ball. It always seems to be single coverage and none of our players seem to flow to the ball as quickly as Carolina or Seattle or any other team that creates any turnovers. That could be the reason for lack of turnovers/ plays on the ball, but it sure isn't fun to watch.

I think they're just playing too far off the ball or too spread out.

rezburna · 09-22-2014, 11:54 AM

Our linebackers are slow.

halloween 65 · 09-22-2014, 11:54 AM

I think they should play tighter also, Byrd playing that far off makes me wonder if his back is up to 100% or not.When totally healthy thats one bad guy a turnover machine.

halloween 65 · 09-22-2014, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by Danno

I've never been impressed with Bush. He's an OK starter, but certainly nothing special. He's often way out of the picture when a WR catches the ball.

We could do worse, and have, but he's just average in my opinion.

He is O.K., I want him to hit more, I like his pop.It has took a long time for me to warm up to him I hope he stays solid. Average can be good.

jnormand · 09-22-2014, 01:13 PM

I just keep waiting for all these "turnovers" to happen. 1 game against a decent QB with a shaky online and 2 games against below average QBs and we have 1 fumble recovery and 0 pics. Wtf?

Audiotom · 09-22-2014, 01:36 PM

I was at the game yesterday and there were way too many open guys and the Minnesota drives ended on miscue throws not our defenders contesting the ball

it almost seems like they stop the receiver once he catches the ball, not before

SaintsBro · 09-22-2014, 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by Audiotom

I was at the game yesterday and there were way too many open guys and the Minnesota drives ended on miscue throws not our defenders contesting the ball

it almost seems like they stop the receiver once he catches the ball, not before

Exactly right. There were quite a few defensive plays yesterday that were basically 100% pure Minnesota screw ups, and the result of nothing special by the Saints defense at all. Came home from the game and compared this to *cough* Seattle on TV, where guys are literally draped around the receivers neck as the ball arrives, hanging off them, leading to tipped balls, broken passes, instant tackles, and bunches of interceptions. Even the lowly Steelers in the night game, were attacking both the QB and receivers, batting at them, stripping the ball, contesting throws, contesting catches, being aggressive. It's like the Saints defense are playing by an entirely different set of rules than the other teams around the league -- they keep leaving these huge massive cushions and wide open green spaces between them and the receivers. Very passive. And Byrd hanging out 40 yards away from anybody.

I mean the rules are basically now, as long as you sorta turn your head for locating the ball, you can push the guy, or grab jersey, or bump, or clothesline him with your freaking elbow, or pretty much do almost whatever you want to do to the receiver....Seems like the Saints have not really gotten the memo on that yet.

09-22-2014, 11:31 AM	#21
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: secondary Originally Posted by Danno Who would have thought after 3 games our top rated CB would be Corey White? I'm starting to worry that SJB was a bad pick. We have an UDFA CB playing CB while SJB is riding the pine. Hopefully its just a case of Dixon playing so much better than anyone thought, another diamond in the rough. White is ony going to get better.I got Dixon pushing Robinson if he goes down, maybe if he don't. Robinson needs some good games to change things around. How do you think Bush has been? With the tools in the secondary if they got there crap together as one, we might get by with the inside lb.ers sloth like movement, they should concentrate at least shoring up the run. I wish we would trade to get a stud ILB. we could afford it.

09-22-2014, 11:34 AM	#22
Danno Truth Addict Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Spanish Fort, AL (via NO and B/R) Posts: 24,720	Re: secondary Originally Posted by halloween 65 White is ony going to get better.I got Dixon pushing Robinson if he goes down, maybe if he don't. Robinson needs some good games to change things around. How do you think Bush has been? With the tools in the secondary if they got there crap together as one, we might get by with the inside lb.ers sloth like movement, they should concentrate at least shoring up the run. I wish we would trade to get a stud ILB. we could afford it. I've never been impressed with Bush. He's an OK starter, but certainly nothing special. He's often way out of the picture when a WR catches the ball. We could do worse, and have, but he's just average in my opinion.

09-22-2014, 11:40 AM	#23
VegasSaint9 100th Post Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada Posts: 360	Re: secondary Originally Posted by dizzle88 Vikings are in I formation, with 2 receivers to the left, play action fake The full back comes through the line and heads to the sideline NOW, Ramon Humber backs up but does not go for the full back, Keenan lewis and Humber end up covering the same zone where the full back has leaked out to. Which Vacates a huge space on the deep left off the field where I believe Keenan Lewis should have dropped back into, Patterson runs a corner route and Byrd is covering jennings running a deep route. Patterson was left completely unmarked and byrd has to come back to make the tackle, from the way Keenan lewis acted I believe he was at fault, he jumped the full back when he came through the line when humber already had that zone covered I dont know the coverage on the play but if it was a cover 3/1 with byrd up top(probably 50 yards back for whatever reason), in most defenses the cover 3 corner is supposed to come down on rollouts and floods while the safety is supposed is supposed to occupy the zone previously occupied by the corner. The far side corner then should assume the safety role, the safety assumes the corners old role as deep third to that play. I think Byrd either was covering for a a bigger potential play/ just playing deepest threat. Humber then has responsibility for chasing the qb and lewis for the outside threat. I think the far side corner should've had responsibility of Jennings then. hagan714 and dizzle88 like this.

09-22-2014, 11:45 AM	#24
VegasSaint9 100th Post Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada Posts: 360	Re: secondary Originally Posted by Danno I've never been impressed with Bush. He's an OK starter, but certainly nothing special. He's often way out of the picture when a WR catches the ball. We could do worse, and have, but he's just average in my opinion. I believe that's improper coaching or just plain bad instincts. None of our players ever appear to be a prime position helping each other out making plays on the ball. It always seems to be single coverage and none of our players seem to flow to the ball as quickly as Carolina or Seattle or any other team that creates any turnovers. That could be the reason for lack of turnovers/ plays on the ball, but it sure isn't fun to watch. I think they're just playing too far off the ball or too spread out.

09-22-2014, 11:54 AM	#25
rezburna 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Kenner, LA Posts: 7,903	Re: secondary Our linebackers are slow. hagan714, saintsfan1976, K Major and 1 others like this.

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09-22-2014, 11:54 AM	#26
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: secondary I think they should play tighter also, Byrd playing that far off makes me wonder if his back is up to 100% or not.When totally healthy thats one bad guy a turnover machine.

09-22-2014, 12:35 PM	#27
halloween 65 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Grand Haven, Michigan by way of a little Mississippi River town in Louisiana Posts: 5,893	Re: secondary Originally Posted by Danno I've never been impressed with Bush. He's an OK starter, but certainly nothing special. He's often way out of the picture when a WR catches the ball. We could do worse, and have, but he's just average in my opinion. He is O.K., I want him to hit more, I like his pop.It has took a long time for me to warm up to him I hope he stays solid. Average can be good. Danno likes this.

09-22-2014, 01:13 PM	#28
jnormand 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: The Free State of Idaho Posts: 5,662	Re: secondary I just keep waiting for all these "turnovers" to happen. 1 game against a decent QB with a shaky online and 2 games against below average QBs and we have 1 fumble recovery and 0 pics. Wtf?

09-22-2014, 01:36 PM	#29
Audiotom 1000 Posts + Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 1,094 Blog Entries: 1	Re: secondary I was at the game yesterday and there were way too many open guys and the Minnesota drives ended on miscue throws not our defenders contesting the ball it almost seems like they stop the receiver once he catches the ball, not before hagan714 and WHODATINCA like this.

09-22-2014, 03:42 PM	#30
SaintsBro Site Donor Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: in line with my ridiculous CLEAR PLASTIC BAG Posts: 3,650 Blog Entries: 3	Re: secondary Originally Posted by Audiotom I was at the game yesterday and there were way too many open guys and the Minnesota drives ended on miscue throws not our defenders contesting the ball it almost seems like they stop the receiver once he catches the ball, not before Exactly right. There were quite a few defensive plays yesterday that were basically 100% pure Minnesota screw ups, and the result of nothing special by the Saints defense at all. Came home from the game and compared this to cough Seattle on TV, where guys are literally draped around the receivers neck as the ball arrives, hanging off them, leading to tipped balls, broken passes, instant tackles, and bunches of interceptions. Even the lowly Steelers in the night game, were attacking both the QB and receivers, batting at them, stripping the ball, contesting throws, contesting catches, being aggressive. It's like the Saints defense are playing by an entirely different set of rules than the other teams around the league -- they keep leaving these huge massive cushions and wide open green spaces between them and the receivers. Very passive. And Byrd hanging out 40 yards away from anybody. I mean the rules are basically now, as long as you sorta turn your head for locating the ball, you can push the guy, or grab jersey, or bump, or clothesline him with your freaking elbow, or pretty much do almost whatever you want to do to the receiver....Seems like the Saints have not really gotten the memo on that yet. hagan714 likes this.

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