You are directly relating Brees' contract to the decline of the offensive line. I say that is completely wrongheaded.

- Nicks - Left because Tampa gave him a contact way over market value. He's barely played since then and didn't make their offensive line any better when he did. You cannot say with any reasonable thought that the Saints made a bad decision in letting him go.

Completely Disagree.

A few points.

First, Nicks was an All-Pro Guard who had not missed a game as a Saint; so as one of the two best guards in the league he is the top of the food chain so he was going to get a max contract...

Second, Nicks was an unrestricted free agent at the same time Brees was; Brees Camp made it clear he was seeking a max contract - so something had to give

Source: Report: Carl Nicks “expected to leave” New Orleans in free agency | ProFootballTalk

Third, Loomis' failed logic then went out and signed Grubbs, who has grossely underwhelmed, at the number he sought to sign Nicks probably thinking he wouldn't affect the level of that unit and still get his numbers he wanted - fail.

Source: New Orleans Saints replace Carl Nicks with OG Ben Grubbs - ESPN

Concession: the Nicks signing was a completely bust for the Bucs as Nicks contracted a staph infection while there which the Bucs ended up agreeing to a settlement - but that's on the Bucs for not maintaining a healthy environment for the invested athletes they've got under contract.

Source: Third Tampa Bay Buccaneers player tests positive for MRSA staph infection - ESPN

So to say that Brees contract has nothing to do with the decline in the roster quality, whether maintaining an elite unit or being able to improve it is naive, even foolhardy...

I need to step away from this board for a while because people are just getting absolutely ridiculous with all this crap. I'm embarrassed for some of you, I really am.

You are neglecting to mention that Nicks already had the bad foot before he even left. He got the MSRA as result a foot surgery, which was needed because he had a history of chronic injury history there. That was no secret. There were also rumors that he was not the best guy in the locker room even then - not totally farfetched considering we got him in the fourth round of the draft on similar concerns.

That's totally wrong, why would Tampa have agreed to an injury settlement regarding the MRSA and injury?!?

Read post and sources.

And in so far as rumors, cite sources. Because what I've read, that's totally wrong.

Source: Saints to face former teammate Carl Nicks - FOX 8 WVUE New Orleans News, Weather, Sports, Social

Now Nicks had a bad rap out of college and that's why he fell to the fifth, but he got right with the Saints.

Source: Wikipedia - Carl Nicks

You are neglecting to mention that Nicks already had the bad foot before he even left. He got the MSRA as result a foot surgery, which was needed because he had a history of chronic injury history there. That was no secret. There were also rumors that he was not the best guy in the locker room even then - not totally farfetched considering we got him in the fourth round of the draft on similar concerns.

You are also neglecting to mention that we had plenty of space to sign Nicks if we had wanted to. Loomis/Payton/whoever makes these decisions decided he wasn't worth what he was demanding. You are also neglecting to mention that Brees cap hit in 2012 was only 10.4 million, and you are also neglecting to mention that the Saints had well more than the $3 million cap space that would have been needed to re-sign Nicks instead of going out and getting Grubbs. And in that scenario, you would kiss any chance of getting Curtis Lofton goodbye. IIRC we also had to sign Colston that year and an extension for Greer.

You can call that a mistake if you want but it has nothing whatsoever to do with being handcuffed by Brees salary. Those are personnel decisions, plain and simple. Blaming Brees contract for the offensive line's decline in performance 3 years later is just flat out simplistic thinking and quite frankly, kind of retarded.

I am kind of disgusted by people calling out Brees for being selfish. He has done more for the Saints and the town than any other player and perhaps any other person in franchise history. He deserves every penny he has gotten and more. Going after him for being selfish is just childish and shows a severe lack of brainpower, for all the reasons I have pointed out in this thread and many more which I'm sure we are not privy to because we are not in the front office and locker room every day.

I need to step away from this board for a while because people are just getting absolutely ridiculous with all this crap. I'm embarrassed for some of you, I really am.

Well is so far as the comments of "retarded", "severe lack of brainpower" that's pretty funny considering you are unable to substantiate or produce one link to corroborate your arguments, especially those rumors you alleged...

Before you start trying to personalize and insult, you may want to pause and look at the thread...

In so much as blaming Brees, it's naive to say his salary and the percentage of the salary cap it consumes has no bearing on other personnel decisions...

No one has questioned his contributions to the Saints success and it's impact on the city's morale - some simply question why a max deal that takes away from the team's ability to maintain or improve the roster which counteracts the very success Brees has been a part of building to this point...

And if he wanted to maximize his monetary gain, there are other revenue streams outside of the Salary/Salary Cap domain, namely Endorsements, that are even more lucrative (especially for SuperBowl Winning Quarterbacks)...

You are neglecting to mention that Nicks already had the bad foot before he even left. He got the MSRA as result a foot surgery, which was needed because he had a history of chronic injury history there. That was no secret. There were also rumors that he was not the best guy in the locker room even then - not totally farfetched considering we got him in the fourth round of the draft on similar concerns.

You are also neglecting to mention that we had plenty of space to sign Nicks if we had wanted to. Loomis/Payton/whoever makes these decisions decided he wasn't worth what he was demanding. You are also neglecting to mention that Brees cap hit in 2012 was only 10.4 million, and you are also neglecting to mention that the Saints had well more than the $3 million cap space that would have been needed to re-sign Nicks instead of going out and getting Grubbs. And in that scenario, you would kiss any chance of getting Curtis Lofton goodbye. IIRC we also had to sign Colston that year and an extension for Greer.

You can call that a mistake if you want but it has nothing whatsoever to do with being handcuffed by Brees salary. Those are personnel decisions, plain and simple. Blaming Brees contract for the offensive line's decline in performance 3 years later is just flat out simplistic thinking and quite frankly, kind of retarded.

I am kind of disgusted by people calling out Brees for being selfish. He has done more for the Saints and the town than any other player and perhaps any other person in franchise history. He deserves every penny he has gotten and more. Going after him for being selfish is just childish and shows a severe lack of brainpower, for all the reasons I have pointed out in this thread and many more which I'm sure we are not privy to because we are not in the front office and locker room every day.

I need to step away from this board for a while because people are just getting absolutely ridiculous with all this crap. I'm embarrassed for some of you, I really am.

I agree with your sentiment. Blaming Brees and his contract for the decline of the Saints is an easy way to absolve the front office for its lack of foresight. Brees's contract was a looming issue for three seasons before he became a free agent. Either the front office didn't care or they were naive in their belief that Brees would not seek market value. Even in seeking that value, Brees gave them a very flexible deal in the first three years. These last two are the paying of the piper.

What the front office should have done was in the season following the Super Bowl, they should have offered to renegotiate with Brees and pay him more in the final years of his previous deal in exchange for some guaranteed years at a lower cost in the future. They chose to ride out the deal he signed when he first came to New Orleans and in return have to deal with that now and in the future. That isn't Drew's fault, it's on the front office for its lack of either foresight (which I doubt) or concern.