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Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

this is a discussion within the Saints Community Forum; Drew Brees is easily one of the Top 5 greatest Quarterbacks in NFL history. But this Version of Brees isn't exactly the 2011 Brees. Now I fully understand that I'll be ridiculed and possibly hung or stoned to death ( ...

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Old 09-16-2013, 02:59 PM   #1
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Question Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

Drew Brees is easily one of the Top 5 greatest Quarterbacks in NFL history.

But this Version of Brees isn't exactly the 2011 Brees. Now I fully understand that I'll be ridiculed and possibly hung or stoned to death ( Witchitheth !!! )
for even insinuating this , but I think either one of two things is happening.


1. Something's up with Brees

2. We lost key pieces and chemistry by giving Brees the huge contract.


In theory 1 I have noticed on countless occasions that it doesn't seem like Drew can hit the home-run ball anymore. Stills Twice in Atlanta , and so on a so forth. I'm sure you all have noticed as well. The good old cockback throw from Drew in the past 9/10 meant a touchdown , it now puts fear into any Saints supporter. Perhaps he's having shoulder issues or something that's being kept under wraps.

In theory 2 much more likely .. I think cap space has been the most prominent thing crippling our team. Brees's contract came at the casualty of Bushrod , Nicks and at the time Meachem and Henderson. Now we know from a standpoint of talent we if anything upgraded at the receiver position but what about chemistry ? What about Kromer ? What about pass protection and Run Blocking ?


It is very likely that both are contributors to our woes at 2-0 but it does bring the question of whether or not Brees should restructure his contract to allow space to give him quality protection..

What's your take ?

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Old 09-16-2013, 03:04 PM   #2
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

Personally I would rule out #1. I don't think something is up with him per se but he is not getting any younger. Everyone will turn to Brady and Manning and say that isn't an excuse but he is unlikely to be improving at this stage in his career.

As for #2, I'm not entirely sure that is the issue. I mean it will have made a massive difference for sure, but ultimately on any team, the Cap balances out. So if you sign players like Nicks to big contracts then you have smaller contracts for your QB and presumably a less capable QB than Brees.

You have however inadvertently touched on what I think may be the exact problem ... Aaron Kromer.

We have had a superb O-line for a good number of years and we certainly have personnel for that to continue but we have lost Kromer and so we may need time to re-gel what we have. With an inferior O-line, the run game is obviously less effective and I think Drew has half an eye on being whacked every play.

For those that think losing Kromer was not such a big thing, the Chicago O-line which has been swiss cheese for years has now succumbed to just one sack in 2 games....
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Old 09-16-2013, 03:06 PM   #3
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

Brees is still the man, no question. Being able to orchestrate that final drive against the Bucs when he was having a bad game just proves it. Agreed, he has been short on the long balls, so far, but is that his arm or lack of protection?
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Old 09-16-2013, 03:09 PM   #4
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

Good analysis
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Old 09-16-2013, 03:35 PM   #5
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

Yeah MG9. I think what we've seen as far as the long passing game goes is a combination of a lot of factors. For one thing I don't think Stills is the deep threat Henderson or even Morgan is/was. Defenses just aren't scared of him. I think we're also seeing how vital Jhari Evans is now that he's struggling with his back issues. It's no secret that the way to get Brees off his game is to pressure him up the middle. Till now though nobody has been able to do it. I think this will work itself out because we have a great interior line.

Let's face it, this is kind of a mini rebuilding year. We have new faces all over the roster. I think we'll get better as the season goes along and we start getting healthier. (And once Payton finally faces the fact that Mark Ingram just isn't who he thought he was.)
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Old 09-16-2013, 03:53 PM   #6
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

You ask a man to attempt over 650 passes a season and it takes its toll.
Its no surprise that the zip isnt there at the moment/anymore.Its why a run game is needed,get him down to 550 attempts and 4300/4500 yards with the rest being made up in rushing yards and the team will be in a better position.
So far we have 153 rushing yards this year,Oaklands QB has more rushing yards than our entire RB combined as do 6 other players.It cant go on like it is.Brees has gone from the 10th most attempts in 09 to first or second since and the team has not benefitted from it.

"Two receivers to the left, Garcon to the right. Manning in the shotgun, puts Collie in motion. Looks in his direction...it's picked off! It's picked off! It's Tracy Porter again! He's runnin' free! He's gonna go all the way!
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Old 09-16-2013, 04:10 PM   #7
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

Brees is only going to take x amount of hits, sacks or shoves before his body hurts, then starts to get antsy which will cause a lot of mistakes. Our O-line better get their act together soon, from what I've seen so far our 100 million dollar man better roll out a lot more. It's very early in the season to have to worry about this, it should not be happening!!
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Old 09-16-2013, 04:16 PM   #8
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

The protection does look like it has some issues.

I thing Payton being back is causing issues. In 2011 and 2012 (Brees's best years) Payton was not calling the plays, Carmichael was. As it stands year to date I would much rather see Carmichael calling the plays.
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Old 09-16-2013, 04:23 PM   #9
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

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Old 09-16-2013, 04:36 PM   #10
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Re: Between a Rock and a Hard Place ...

You don't throw the ball 6,000 + times in 172 games and not have wear.

It's obvious Drew is losing some of his arm strength.

What will save it however is a run game that's worth a spit.
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