Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later'

SaintFanInATLHELL · 02-17-2021, 01:30 PM

Originally Posted by neugey

If Payton sticks with Hill as the heir apparent, then Winston is surely going to leave in free agency. Payton is putting his best foot forward to try to keep Winston at something close to last year's rate and give the team more options to work with. I think the QB situation could still be wide open going into June and July.

Payton's doing a piss poor job of it then. One's market value doesn't stay down by gushing about the guy's talent and talking about how much you want to sign him.

I certainly hope that folks understand that last year was an internship for Winston. One doesn't hire the intern into the company at the same rate as they were paid for the internship.

Take a look at the cap/cash numbers for QBs in 2020: https://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/2020/

Of course they are all over the place. But there are a few common buckets:

1. Rookie contracts (Mahomes, Watson, Jackson, Mayfield)
2. Backups (Shaub, Keenum, McCoy, Daniel)
3. Bridge (Fitzpatrick, Taylor)
4. Veteran starters on 2nd or later contract (pretty much everyone one the list from Prescott down to Bridgewater)

I think I finally figured out that most Saints fans think that Winston is going to end up in category 3 and should be paid as such. I believe that Winston is going to join category 4 with the others. As you can see the salaries and cap numbers for the most part start in the mid $20 millions range.

Unfortunately, I also think that means that the Saints will not be able to retain Winston's services. And I do understand being leery about gambling big money. Indianapolis is literally looking for their 4th QB after Luck retired, Brissett flamed out, and Rivers retired too after paying each of them upwards of $25 million a year.

SFIAH

Boston Saint · 02-17-2021, 10:36 AM

I’ll put a little different spin on this. If Winston is signed and given the starting job (I’m ok with this), then I don’t see a QB being drafted early (round 1 or
2). By the Saints. I’m guessing Winston will take at least a 3 year deal. I don’t see drafting a guy to ride the bench for that long and then planning on starting him in the last year or 2 of his rookie contract. But, if Winston isn’t signed, I see a QB taken round 1 and a Trubisky or Fitzmagic type signed for a one or 2 year deal. Thoughts?

stickman · 02-17-2021, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

I’ll put a little different spin on this. If Winston is signed and given the starting job (I’m ok with this), then I don’t see a QB being drafted early (round 1 or
2). By the Saints. I’m guessing Winston will take at least a 3 year deal. I don’t see drafting a guy to ride the bench for that long and then planning on starting him in the last year or 2 of his rookie contract. But, if Winston isn’t signed, I see a QB taken round 1 and a Trubisky or Fitzmagic type signed for a one or 2 year deal. Thoughts?

I'd like to see Winston get a shot.

As for the draft, I think it is going to come down to who is available when they pick. The Saints can't afford to trade up and if a run on QBs starts, they'll be left out by pick 28. Unless they reach a little bit, which is a bad idea.

Boston Saint · 02-17-2021, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by stickman

I'd like to see Winston get a shot.

As for the draft, I think it is going to come down to who is available when they pick. The Saints can't afford to trade up and if a run on QBs starts, they'll be left out by pick 28. Unless they reach a little bit, which is a bad idea.

Let’s say they do sign Winston, but then a QB they like is a available at 28. Would you draft that QB then Stick ?

stickman · 02-17-2021, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

Let’s say they do sign Winston, but then a QB they like is a available at 28. Would you draft that QB then Stick ?

If he's the best player on the teams list, then yes. Give Winston a chance to prove the job should be his and the rookie the chance to learn the system.

If the problem you end up with is that Winston is playing so well he's keeping a first round draft choice on the bench, do you really have a problem?

AsylumGuido · 02-17-2021, 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by stickman

If he's the best player on the teams list, then yes. Give Winston a chance to prove the job should be his and the rookie the chance to learn the system.

If the problem you end up with is that Winston is playing so well he's keeping a first round draft choice on the bench, do you really have a problem?

That's exactly what happened when the Chargers acquired Philip Rivers in the first round (via trade). A guy named Brees stepped it up.

Boston Saint · 02-17-2021, 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by stickman

If he's the best player on the teams list, then yes. Give Winston a chance to prove the job should be his and the rookie the chance to learn the system.

If the problem you end up with is that Winston is playing so well he's keeping a first round draft choice on the bench, do you really have a problem?

Not really a problem, but you are wasting a first round pick on a guy that’s not seeing the field. I’d rather use that first round pick on a CB, LB, WR that has a good chance of playing than a bench warmer. That’s why I don’t think you can commit to Winston and draft a QB first round.

vpheughan · 02-17-2021, 02:32 PM

THE COULD'A WOULD'A SHOULD'A AND WHAT IF wheel.............just keeps turning.

Everyone keeps ignoring SP's keen QB drafting ability. Palko, Canfield and Grayson

All the QB's he's had success with weren't drafted by him.

Boston Saint · 02-17-2021, 05:16 PM

Originally Posted by vpheughan

THE COULD'A WOULD'A SHOULD'A AND WHAT IF wheel.............just keeps turning.

Everyone keeps ignoring SP's keen QB drafting ability. Palko, Canfield and Grayson

All the QB's he's had success with weren't drafted by him.

Well in fairness, Palko was undrafted and Canfield was a 7th rounder. Grayson was a mid third, but many third rounders do not pan out. It’s not like has failed with a first or early second round choice.

vpheughan · 02-20-2021, 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

Well in fairness, Palko was undrafted and Canfield was a 7th rounder. Grayson was a mid third, but many third rounders do not pan out. It’s not like has failed with a first or early second round choice.

Really? How many QB's HAS PAYTON DRAFTED in the first or early second round?

Ten quarterbacks were selected past the third round in the draft and later went on to win Pro Bowls and even Super Bowls. While their draft positions may have been low, it didn't stop them from being motivated enough to accomplish rare feats in NFL history.

02-17-2021, 01:30 PM	#1
SaintFanInATLHELL The Professor Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Lithonia, GA Posts: 2,781	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by neugey If Payton sticks with Hill as the heir apparent, then Winston is surely going to leave in free agency. Payton is putting his best foot forward to try to keep Winston at something close to last year's rate and give the team more options to work with. I think the QB situation could still be wide open going into June and July. Payton's doing a piss poor job of it then. One's market value doesn't stay down by gushing about the guy's talent and talking about how much you want to sign him. I certainly hope that folks understand that last year was an internship for Winston. One doesn't hire the intern into the company at the same rate as they were paid for the internship. Take a look at the cap/cash numbers for QBs in 2020: https://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/2020/ Of course they are all over the place. But there are a few common buckets: 1. Rookie contracts (Mahomes, Watson, Jackson, Mayfield) 2. Backups (Shaub, Keenum, McCoy, Daniel) 3. Bridge (Fitzpatrick, Taylor) 4. Veteran starters on 2nd or later contract (pretty much everyone one the list from Prescott down to Bridgewater) I think I finally figured out that most Saints fans think that Winston is going to end up in category 3 and should be paid as such. I believe that Winston is going to join category 4 with the others. As you can see the salaries and cap numbers for the most part start in the mid $20 millions range. Unfortunately, I also think that means that the Saints will not be able to retain Winston's services. And I do understand being leery about gambling big money. Indianapolis is literally looking for their 4th QB after Luck retired, Brissett flamed out, and Rivers retired too after paying each of them upwards of $25 million a year. SFIAH jnormand likes this.
	Super Bowl Championships: New Orleans Saints:1, Carolina:0, Atlanta Chokers: STILL ZERO Only Atlanta choked in an unchokable situation... Life is definitely good.

02-17-2021, 10:36 AM	#2
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' I’ll put a little different spin on this. If Winston is signed and given the starting job (I’m ok with this), then I don’t see a QB being drafted early (round 1 or 2). By the Saints. I’m guessing Winston will take at least a 3 year deal. I don’t see drafting a guy to ride the bench for that long and then planning on starting him in the last year or 2 of his rookie contract. But, if Winston isn’t signed, I see a QB taken round 1 and a Trubisky or Fitzmagic type signed for a one or 2 year deal. Thoughts?
	You think you know, but you don’t know...and you never will! Coach Jim Mora

02-17-2021, 10:43 AM	#3
stickman 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Gonzales, LA Posts: 1,754	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by Boston Saint I’ll put a little different spin on this. If Winston is signed and given the starting job (I’m ok with this), then I don’t see a QB being drafted early (round 1 or 2). By the Saints. I’m guessing Winston will take at least a 3 year deal. I don’t see drafting a guy to ride the bench for that long and then planning on starting him in the last year or 2 of his rookie contract. But, if Winston isn’t signed, I see a QB taken round 1 and a Trubisky or Fitzmagic type signed for a one or 2 year deal. Thoughts? I'd like to see Winston get a shot. As for the draft, I think it is going to come down to who is available when they pick. The Saints can't afford to trade up and if a run on QBs starts, they'll be left out by pick 28. Unless they reach a little bit, which is a bad idea.

02-17-2021, 11:20 AM	#4
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by stickman I'd like to see Winston get a shot. As for the draft, I think it is going to come down to who is available when they pick. The Saints can't afford to trade up and if a run on QBs starts, they'll be left out by pick 28. Unless they reach a little bit, which is a bad idea. Let’s say they do sign Winston, but then a QB they like is a available at 28. Would you draft that QB then Stick ?

02-17-2021, 01:03 PM	#5
stickman 1000 Posts + Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Gonzales, LA Posts: 1,754	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by Boston Saint Let’s say they do sign Winston, but then a QB they like is a available at 28. Would you draft that QB then Stick ? If he's the best player on the teams list, then yes. Give Winston a chance to prove the job should be his and the rookie the chance to learn the system. If the problem you end up with is that Winston is playing so well he's keeping a first round draft choice on the bench, do you really have a problem?

02-17-2021, 01:17 PM	#6
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,472	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by stickman If he's the best player on the teams list, then yes. Give Winston a chance to prove the job should be his and the rookie the chance to learn the system. If the problem you end up with is that Winston is playing so well he's keeping a first round draft choice on the bench, do you really have a problem? That's exactly what happened when the Chargers acquired Philip Rivers in the first round (via trade). A guy named Brees stepped it up. Rugby Saint II likes this.

02-17-2021, 02:13 PM	#7
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by stickman If he's the best player on the teams list, then yes. Give Winston a chance to prove the job should be his and the rookie the chance to learn the system. If the problem you end up with is that Winston is playing so well he's keeping a first round draft choice on the bench, do you really have a problem? Not really a problem, but you are wasting a first round pick on a guy that’s not seeing the field. I’d rather use that first round pick on a CB, LB, WR that has a good chance of playing than a bench warmer. That’s why I don’t think you can commit to Winston and draft a QB first round.

02-17-2021, 02:32 PM	#8
vpheughan 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 4,543	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' THE COULD'A WOULD'A SHOULD'A AND WHAT IF wheel.............just keeps turning. Everyone keeps ignoring SP's keen QB drafting ability. Palko, Canfield and Grayson All the QB's he's had success with weren't drafted by him.
vpheughan 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 4,543

02-17-2021, 05:16 PM	#9
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by vpheughan THE COULD'A WOULD'A SHOULD'A AND WHAT IF wheel.............just keeps turning. Everyone keeps ignoring SP's keen QB drafting ability. Palko, Canfield and Grayson All the QB's he's had success with weren't drafted by him. Well in fairness, Palko was undrafted and Canfield was a 7th rounder. Grayson was a mid third, but many third rounders do not pan out. It’s not like has failed with a first or early second round choice.

02-20-2021, 06:48 PM	#10
vpheughan 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 4,543	Re: Sean Payton wants New Orleans Saints to re-sign QB Jameis Winston 'sooner than later' Originally Posted by Boston Saint Well in fairness, Palko was undrafted and Canfield was a 7th rounder. Grayson was a mid third, but many third rounders do not pan out. It’s not like has failed with a first or early second round choice. Really? How many QB's HAS PAYTON DRAFTED in the first or early second round? Ten quarterbacks were selected past the third round in the draft and later went on to win Pro Bowls and even Super Bowls. While their draft positions may have been low, it didn't stop them from being motivated enough to accomplish rare feats in NFL history.
vpheughan 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 4,543

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