Observations from the Saints preseason loss to the Texans

TheOak · 08-18-2022, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by AsylumGuido

I know EXACTLY what I am talking about, Oak. Part of the OT's job is to keep the pocket intact from the outside. When the QB leaves the security of the pocket (ie. dropping back too far) the OT cannot see behind him that the QB is too far back and what would normally be herding the rusher around the back of the pocket can lead the rusher directly to the out of place QB.

I don't know how many times I have heard about inexperienced QB's not properly utilizing the pocket. It's hard to imagine you haven't heard the same with your extensive knowledge.

Besides, iceshack was the one that pointed this out first if you would have taken the time to read the posts. My reply was just agreeing with his post.

You didn't agree with Iceshack lol. Iceshack shared it as Deuce Windham's perspective, whom like your self has never played the game. If you look up Mr. Windham you might pause before you share his insights as gospel lol. Iceshack said the perspective might be worth considering and felt dirty doing it, your plagiaristic azz stated it and are defending it, as a known fact.

That is where we differ, I do not have to 'hear about it', I played for years. OG/OT/DT and the QB "utilizing the pocket, has nothing to do with an OT knowing where he is, all any lineman knows is that the QB is behind them until they see either the ball or QB go past them lol. A QB release time is generally under 3 seconds from snap which gives no one time to even consider where he is, a lineman's first step is back/back left/back right/to their gap, after that its full on war lol. QBs drop back in a general direction but that is nothing more than a basic idea of where the play is going at start, the QB doesn't have a specific place to be and scrambles to where there is daylight.... After the snap on a pass, its bam.bam.bam with 250-300+lbs of walrus in your face for an offensive lineman.

Ill tell you how a play goes whether in practice or on the field. The ball is snapped, the OL takes a 1/2 to full step back and braces for someone to be in his face until the whistle blows, a natural static pocket is created behind them. The QB either throws from the pocket, scrambles within the picked, the pocket collapses, or the QB leaves the pocket. Never from snap to whistle does a lineman turn around to have a f***ing clue as to where the QB is.

A little more since you haven't a clue. Man: Everyone blocks a specific person. Zone: they step to the gap and block whom ever enters the gap. Form: After that 1/2 step back an OLineman cocks his arms to load his hands then uncoils to shove the defenders pads up under his face-mask to get him on his heals, most holding calls are because the lineman's hands slide to the outside of the chest area of the shoulder pads and he is just trying to hang on. Once hands slide outside, flags are thrown.

If you couldn't get your head wrapped around that I will give you the short of it... From snap to release a QB is scrambling for his life, there is no one place he is expected to be lol.

What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line.

Keep rolling your eyes, it suits your nature.

AsylumGuido · 08-18-2022, 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

You didn't agree with Iceshack lol. Iceshack shared it as Deuce Windham's perspective, whom like your self has never played the game. If you look up Mr. Windham you might pause before you share his insights as gospel lol. Iceshack said the perspective might be worth considering and felt dirty doing it, your plagiaristic azz stated it and are defending it, as a known fact.

That is where we differ, I do not have to 'hear about it', I played for years. OG/OT/DT and the QB "utilizing the pocket, has nothing to do with an OT knowing where he is, all any lineman knows is that the QB is behind them until they see either the ball or QB go past them lol. A QB release time is generally under 3 seconds from snap which gives no one time to even consider where he is, a lineman's first step is back/back left/back right/to their gap, after that its full on war lol. QBs drop back in a general direction but that is nothing more than a basic idea of where the play is going at start, the QB doesn't have a specific place to be and scrambles to where there is daylight.... After the snap on a pass, its bam.bam.bam with 250-300+lbs of walrus in your face for an offensive lineman.

Ill tell you how a play goes whether in practice or on the field. The ball is snapped, the OL takes a 1/2 to full step back and braces for someone to be in his face until the whistle blows, a natural static pocket is created behind them. The QB either throws from the pocket, scrambles within the picked, the pocket collapses, or the QB leaves the pocket. Never from snap to whistle does a lineman turn around to have a f***ing clue as to where the QB is.

A little more since you haven't a clue. Man: Everyone blocks a specific person. Zone: they step to the gap and block whom ever enters the gap. Form: After that 1/2 step back an OLineman cocks his arms to load his hands then uncoils to shove the defenders pads up under his face-mask to get him on his heals, most holding calls are because the lineman's hands slide to the outside of the chest area of the shoulder pads and he is just trying to hang on. Once hands slide outside, flags are thrown.

If you couldn't get your head wrapped around that I will give you the short of it... From snap to release a QB is scrambling for his life, there is no one place he is expected to be lol.

What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line.

Keep rolling your eyes, it suits your nature.

Thank you for your insight, Oak!

Oh, and your calling me a "plagiaristic azz" makes you a "libelous azz". I have never knowingly presented anyone else's work or ideas as my own. I can easily say that 99% of what I know about football has come from others. I have opinions, of course, that have been based upon what I have read and heard over the past half a century. I respect the fact that you have played the game. But that doesn't mean that you know everything and anyone else's opinions and thoughts are not important and can be rightfully demeaned.

K Major · 08-18-2022, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line.

^^^^^ This right here.

Book lacks pocket presence & this could get him cut or on the practice squad. If you lack this trait as an NFL QB, you're toast.

AsylumGuido · 08-18-2022, 10:22 AM

Originally Posted by TheOak

What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line.

That does NOT have zero to do with the line. A QB that does not have pocket presence does not take advantage of the line and it inaccurately puts the blame on the line. That's all I was trying to convey. I don't know how many times over the years while watching games I have heard the analyst (who absolutely played the game at the highest level) say something along the lines of "that sack should be on the QB, not on the lineman" for one reason or another ... like retreating too far out of the back of the pocket.

08-18-2022, 09:18 AM	#1
TheOak 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Cypress Tx. Posts: 19,039	Re: Observations from the Saints preseason loss to the Texans Originally Posted by AsylumGuido I know EXACTLY what I am talking about, Oak. Part of the OT's job is to keep the pocket intact from the outside. When the QB leaves the security of the pocket (ie. dropping back too far) the OT cannot see behind him that the QB is too far back and what would normally be herding the rusher around the back of the pocket can lead the rusher directly to the out of place QB. I don't know how many times I have heard about inexperienced QB's not properly utilizing the pocket. It's hard to imagine you haven't heard the same with your extensive knowledge. Besides, iceshack was the one that pointed this out first if you would have taken the time to read the posts. My reply was just agreeing with his post. You didn't agree with Iceshack lol. Iceshack shared it as Deuce Windham's perspective, whom like your self has never played the game. If you look up Mr. Windham you might pause before you share his insights as gospel lol. Iceshack said the perspective might be worth considering and felt dirty doing it, your plagiaristic azz stated it and are defending it, as a known fact. That is where we differ, I do not have to 'hear about it', I played for years. OG/OT/DT and the QB "utilizing the pocket, has nothing to do with an OT knowing where he is, all any lineman knows is that the QB is behind them until they see either the ball or QB go past them lol. A QB release time is generally under 3 seconds from snap which gives no one time to even consider where he is, a lineman's first step is back/back left/back right/to their gap, after that its full on war lol. QBs drop back in a general direction but that is nothing more than a basic idea of where the play is going at start, the QB doesn't have a specific place to be and scrambles to where there is daylight.... After the snap on a pass, its bam.bam.bam with 250-300+lbs of walrus in your face for an offensive lineman. Ill tell you how a play goes whether in practice or on the field. The ball is snapped, the OL takes a 1/2 to full step back and braces for someone to be in his face until the whistle blows, a natural static pocket is created behind them. The QB either throws from the pocket, scrambles within the picked, the pocket collapses, or the QB leaves the pocket. Never from snap to whistle does a lineman turn around to have a f***ing clue as to where the QB is. A little more since you haven't a clue. Man: Everyone blocks a specific person. Zone: they step to the gap and block whom ever enters the gap. Form: After that 1/2 step back an OLineman cocks his arms to load his hands then uncoils to shove the defenders pads up under his face-mask to get him on his heals, most holding calls are because the lineman's hands slide to the outside of the chest area of the shoulder pads and he is just trying to hang on. Once hands slide outside, flags are thrown. If you couldn't get your head wrapped around that I will give you the short of it... From snap to release a QB is scrambling for his life, there is no one place he is expected to be lol. What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line. Keep rolling your eyes, it suits your nature. AsylumGuido likes this.
	It's not what you look at that matters, it's what you see. ~ Henry David Thoreau

08-18-2022, 09:56 AM	#2
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,505	Re: Observations from the Saints preseason loss to the Texans Originally Posted by TheOak You didn't agree with Iceshack lol. Iceshack shared it as Deuce Windham's perspective, whom like your self has never played the game. If you look up Mr. Windham you might pause before you share his insights as gospel lol. Iceshack said the perspective might be worth considering and felt dirty doing it, your plagiaristic azz stated it and are defending it, as a known fact. That is where we differ, I do not have to 'hear about it', I played for years. OG/OT/DT and the QB "utilizing the pocket, has nothing to do with an OT knowing where he is, all any lineman knows is that the QB is behind them until they see either the ball or QB go past them lol. A QB release time is generally under 3 seconds from snap which gives no one time to even consider where he is, a lineman's first step is back/back left/back right/to their gap, after that its full on war lol. QBs drop back in a general direction but that is nothing more than a basic idea of where the play is going at start, the QB doesn't have a specific place to be and scrambles to where there is daylight.... After the snap on a pass, its bam.bam.bam with 250-300+lbs of walrus in your face for an offensive lineman. Ill tell you how a play goes whether in practice or on the field. The ball is snapped, the OL takes a 1/2 to full step back and braces for someone to be in his face until the whistle blows, a natural static pocket is created behind them. The QB either throws from the pocket, scrambles within the picked, the pocket collapses, or the QB leaves the pocket. Never from snap to whistle does a lineman turn around to have a f***ing clue as to where the QB is. A little more since you haven't a clue. Man: Everyone blocks a specific person. Zone: they step to the gap and block whom ever enters the gap. Form: After that 1/2 step back an OLineman cocks his arms to load his hands then uncoils to shove the defenders pads up under his face-mask to get him on his heals, most holding calls are because the lineman's hands slide to the outside of the chest area of the shoulder pads and he is just trying to hang on. Once hands slide outside, flags are thrown. If you couldn't get your head wrapped around that I will give you the short of it... From snap to release a QB is scrambling for his life, there is no one place he is expected to be lol. What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line. Keep rolling your eyes, it suits your nature. Thank you for your insight, Oak! Oh, and your calling me a "plagiaristic azz" makes you a "libelous azz". I have never knowingly presented anyone else's work or ideas as my own. I can easily say that 99% of what I know about football has come from others. I have opinions, of course, that have been based upon what I have read and heard over the past half a century. I respect the fact that you have played the game. But that doesn't mean that you know everything and anyone else's opinions and thoughts are not important and can be rightfully demeaned.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill

08-18-2022, 10:11 AM	#3
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,749 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Observations from the Saints preseason loss to the Texans Originally Posted by TheOak What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line. ^^^^^ This right here. Book lacks pocket presence & this could get him cut or on the practice squad. If you lack this trait as an NFL QB, you're toast. AsylumGuido likes this.

08-18-2022, 10:22 AM	#4
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,505	Re: Observations from the Saints preseason loss to the Texans Originally Posted by TheOak What you have heard is that some QBs do not have pocket awareness but that has zero to do with the line. That does NOT have zero to do with the line. A QB that does not have pocket presence does not take advantage of the line and it inaccurately puts the blame on the line. That's all I was trying to convey. I don't know how many times over the years while watching games I have heard the analyst (who absolutely played the game at the highest level) say something along the lines of "that sack should be on the QB, not on the lineman" for one reason or another ... like retreating too far out of the back of the pocket.
	“The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.” — Winston Churchill