Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers

Boston Saint · 11-29-2022, 11:15 AM

Originally Posted by Sinner

All this talk about "punching the ball out" of the Star Running Back's hands, being a perfectly executed defensive play, and no fault of the Ball Carrier, or the COACHING of the Ball Carrier... Nah. Way back in the day, we had Coach punching the ball so hard, we would puke. That was fundamental stuff. We were COACHED to HOLD THE DAMN BALL.

Yeah, after all a 6 year All-pro with over 1,000 carries has to be told not to fumble 🙄.

AsylumGuido · 11-29-2022, 11:29 AM

Sinner · 11-29-2022, 11:54 AM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

Yeah, after all a 6 year All-pro with over 1,000 carries has to be told not to fumble 🙄.

Um... YEAH. He does. Or haven't you noticed?

Boston Saint · 11-29-2022, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by Sinner

Um... YEAH. He does. Or haven't you noticed?

It’s called personal responsibility. Something lacking from these players and society in general.

Sinner · 11-29-2022, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

It’s called personal responsibility. Something lacking from these players and society in general.

Well, That's something that the COACH is legally and ethically responsible for MANAGING (these players, not society in general). You just proved my point. Thanks.

K Major · 11-29-2022, 11:37 AM

Not sure why Pete Carmichael waited so long to start utilizing a "threat" in Shaheed.

Interesting stat line on Rashid in the Niners game :

"Shaheed converted a first down on all three of his touches against the San Francisco 49ers last Sunday. He caught a 35-yard reception on 2nd-and-6, followed by an 18-yard pickup on 3rd-and-3. And he also took a carry off the left end for a 6-yard gain on 2nd-and-5. He’s touched the ball 10 times on offense and either converted a first down or scored a touchdown on 8 of them."

Weber St finest!

Again, get your playmakers more involved Pete.

Deonte Harty is gone in 2023.

Papa Voodoo · 11-29-2022, 02:24 PM

Much like 2010 when Garrett Hartley missed a chip-shot field goal in overtime that led to a 27-24 Atlanta win and changed the course of the entire season, Mark Ingram's fumble against Tampa earlier this year did the same thing: "On the drive after Tampa Bay tied the score at 3 with a 47-yard field goal, New Orleans opened its next drive at its 25 following a touchback. And the Saints went about constructing their most balanced and effective drive of the game, a mix of three passes (for 25 yards) and five runs (for 30 yards) that pushed New Orleans to first-and-10 from the Tampa Bay 20-yard line with 1:19 left in the quarter.

But with the Saints in scoring position, and touchdowns scarce among the two combatants, New Orleans couldn't throw what undoubtedly would have amounted to an offensive haymaker.

Running back Mark Ingram II took the handoff off left guard, manipulated his way through heavy traffic and as he anticipated contact, covered the football with both hands.

It wasn't enough.

As safety Logan Ryan and linebacker Lavonte David converged for the tackle, Ryan attacked the ball and executed a perfect punch-out at the 11-yard line. When linebacker Carl Nassib recovered at the 10, New Orleans went from the possibility of a lead-taking field goal and, perhaps, backbreaking touchdown, to an empty red zone trip and a score that remained 3-3."

dizzle88 · 11-29-2022, 03:12 PM

Remember when Ingram fumbled vs the Hawks in 2016?
Payton benched him for the whole game and ran Tim Hightower 30 plus times.

Our players are playing poorly, that's granted, but the coaches aren't showing them any consequences. It's not like this is a new thing, we are -12 in the turnover margin. This hasnt just started, the skill position players have been messing up all year and the coaches still haven't rectified it.

Does that mean Alvin sucks? Nope, because he hasn't really had this issue before, which surely comes down to coaching to be upfront and honest with him and say he needs to protect the ball better or pull him from the game if he's being a detriment to success.

In Payton's world, no one was too big.

Dennis I don't think has the guts to do that, to make a statement and hold the players accountable for their mishaps.

Boston Saint · 11-29-2022, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by dizzle88

Remember when Ingram fumbled vs the Hawks in 2016?
Payton benched him for the whole game and ran Tim Hightower 30 plus times.

Our players are playing poorly, that's granted, but the coaches aren't showing them any consequences. It's not like this is a new thing, we are -12 in the turnover margin. This hasnt just started, the skill position players have been messing up all year and the coaches still haven't rectified it.

Does that mean Alvin sucks? Nope, because he hasn't really had this issue before, which surely comes down to coaching to be upfront and honest with him and say he needs to protect the ball better or pull him from the game if he's being a detriment to success.

In Payton's world, no one was too big.

Dennis I don't think has the guts to do that, to make a statement and hold the players accountable for their mishaps.

Or is it the ability? He didn’t put this team together. Who in reality would he bench Kamara for? Payton took time to get to that point. And again, why let Kamara off the hook for fumbling? Because he was “scared” of being benched? Well, Payton could bench him before he got a big contract. Allen can’t.

dizzle88 · 11-29-2022, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by Boston Saint

Or is it the ability? He didn’t put this team together. Who in reality would he bench Kamara for? Payton took time to get to that point. And again, why let Kamara off the hook for fumbling? Because he was “scared” of being benched? Well, Payton could bench him before he got a big contract. Allen can’t.

Honestly, I think people would have more respect for Allen, if he made a move like that, to show that no one is without accountability.

What's the worst they could do, fire him? Thats likely going to happen if the team doesn't show improvement anyway, go for broke, make the team realise that no one is too good to not get an earful.

11-29-2022, 11:15 AM	#1
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Sinner All this talk about "punching the ball out" of the Star Running Back's hands, being a perfectly executed defensive play, and no fault of the Ball Carrier, or the COACHING of the Ball Carrier... Nah. Way back in the day, we had Coach punching the ball so hard, we would puke. That was fundamental stuff. We were COACHED to HOLD THE DAMN BALL. Yeah, after all a 6 year All-pro with over 1,000 carries has to be told not to fumble 🙄.

11-29-2022, 11:29 AM	#2
AsylumGuido 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bossier City, LA Posts: 26,622	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Twitter Twitter

11-29-2022, 11:54 AM	#3
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Boston Saint Yeah, after all a 6 year All-pro with over 1,000 carries has to be told not to fumble 🙄. Um... YEAH. He does. Or haven't you noticed?
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068

11-29-2022, 11:56 AM	#4
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Sinner Um... YEAH. He does. Or haven't you noticed? It’s called personal responsibility. Something lacking from these players and society in general. jnormand likes this.

11-29-2022, 11:58 AM	#5
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Boston Saint It’s called personal responsibility. Something lacking from these players and society in general. Well, That's something that the COACH is legally and ethically responsible for MANAGING (these players, not society in general). You just proved my point. Thanks.
Sinner 1000 Posts + Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 4,068	Last edited by Sinner; 11-29-2022 at 12:24 PM..

11-29-2022, 11:37 AM	#6
K Major Site Donor 2019 Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Bedford, TX Posts: 24,831 Blog Entries: 3	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Not sure why Pete Carmichael waited so long to start utilizing a "threat" in Shaheed. Interesting stat line on Rashid in the Niners game : "Shaheed converted a first down on all three of his touches against the San Francisco 49ers last Sunday. He caught a 35-yard reception on 2nd-and-6, followed by an 18-yard pickup on 3rd-and-3. And he also took a carry off the left end for a 6-yard gain on 2nd-and-5. He’s touched the ball 10 times on offense and either converted a first down or scored a touchdown on 8 of them." Weber St finest! Again, get your playmakers more involved Pete. Deonte Harty is gone in 2023. SmashMouth and shawnkytonk like this.

11-29-2022, 02:24 PM	#7
Papa Voodoo 1000 Posts + Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,634	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Much like 2010 when Garrett Hartley missed a chip-shot field goal in overtime that led to a 27-24 Atlanta win and changed the course of the entire season, Mark Ingram's fumble against Tampa earlier this year did the same thing: "On the drive after Tampa Bay tied the score at 3 with a 47-yard field goal, New Orleans opened its next drive at its 25 following a touchback. And the Saints went about constructing their most balanced and effective drive of the game, a mix of three passes (for 25 yards) and five runs (for 30 yards) that pushed New Orleans to first-and-10 from the Tampa Bay 20-yard line with 1:19 left in the quarter. But with the Saints in scoring position, and touchdowns scarce among the two combatants, New Orleans couldn't throw what undoubtedly would have amounted to an offensive haymaker. Running back Mark Ingram II took the handoff off left guard, manipulated his way through heavy traffic and as he anticipated contact, covered the football with both hands. It wasn't enough. As safety Logan Ryan and linebacker Lavonte David converged for the tackle, Ryan attacked the ball and executed a perfect punch-out at the 11-yard line. When linebacker Carl Nassib recovered at the 10, New Orleans went from the possibility of a lead-taking field goal and, perhaps, backbreaking touchdown, to an empty red zone trip and a score that remained 3-3." AsylumGuido likes this.

11-29-2022, 03:12 PM	#8
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,534	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Remember when Ingram fumbled vs the Hawks in 2016? Payton benched him for the whole game and ran Tim Hightower 30 plus times. Our players are playing poorly, that's granted, but the coaches aren't showing them any consequences. It's not like this is a new thing, we are -12 in the turnover margin. This hasnt just started, the skill position players have been messing up all year and the coaches still haven't rectified it. Does that mean Alvin sucks? Nope, because he hasn't really had this issue before, which surely comes down to coaching to be upfront and honest with him and say he needs to protect the ball better or pull him from the game if he's being a detriment to success. In Payton's world, no one was too big. Dennis I don't think has the guts to do that, to make a statement and hold the players accountable for their mishaps. Sinner and Boston Saint like this.
	Your bonehead creator picked a fine chapter to omit from your memory bank....let me ask you, does a machine like yourself ever experience fear? - Vegeta, DBZ

11-29-2022, 03:23 PM	#9
Boston Saint 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 5,137	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by dizzle88 Remember when Ingram fumbled vs the Hawks in 2016? Payton benched him for the whole game and ran Tim Hightower 30 plus times. Our players are playing poorly, that's granted, but the coaches aren't showing them any consequences. It's not like this is a new thing, we are -12 in the turnover margin. This hasnt just started, the skill position players have been messing up all year and the coaches still haven't rectified it. Does that mean Alvin sucks? Nope, because he hasn't really had this issue before, which surely comes down to coaching to be upfront and honest with him and say he needs to protect the ball better or pull him from the game if he's being a detriment to success. In Payton's world, no one was too big. Dennis I don't think has the guts to do that, to make a statement and hold the players accountable for their mishaps. Or is it the ability? He didn’t put this team together. Who in reality would he bench Kamara for? Payton took time to get to that point. And again, why let Kamara off the hook for fumbling? Because he was “scared” of being benched? Well, Payton could bench him before he got a big contract. Allen can’t.

11-29-2022, 03:29 PM	#10
dizzle88 10000 POST CLUB Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 11,534	Re: Observations from the saints Loss to the 49ers Originally Posted by Boston Saint Or is it the ability? He didn’t put this team together. Who in reality would he bench Kamara for? Payton took time to get to that point. And again, why let Kamara off the hook for fumbling? Because he was “scared” of being benched? Well, Payton could bench him before he got a big contract. Allen can’t. Honestly, I think people would have more respect for Allen, if he made a move like that, to show that no one is without accountability. What's the worst they could do, fire him? Thats likely going to happen if the team doesn't show improvement anyway, go for broke, make the team realise that no one is too good to not get an earful. Sinner likes this.