Reggie Bush

blacksaint · 10-10-2007, 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by JOESAM2002

I agree that running behind Karney will slow his roll and make him wait for the hole to open up. Plus it will give Brees another blocker, giving him more time and give the receivers more time to get open. My question is this. If we can see it, why can't Payton see it?

The only problem I can see is Payton coaches a west coast style offense and they typically don't use a bruising style FB. Karney is a prototype, smash mouth, throwback style of FB that is great at cracking skulls and busting lips but he's not fluid enough to be featured in the passing game, but I do think he's great in the passing game on third down and short and up to eight or nine yards and he's always great in goal line situations. I think Coach Payton should alter his playbook a little to include more two back sets, because it don't make sense to have one of the best blocking FBs in the league and not and not get full usage out of him.

blacksaint · 10-10-2007, 07:31 PM

Perhaps Payton can't see the forest for the trees. He sees these guys everyday and has developed relationships that may blurrrrrr or taint what he is seeing on the field - and on the films.

That might explain why Simoneau is still the starting MLB.

JOESAM2002 · 10-10-2007, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by blacksaint

The only problem I can see is Payton coaches a west coast style offense and they typically don't use a bruising style FB. Karney is a prototype, smash mouth, throwback style of FB that is great at cracking skulls and busting lips but he's not fluid enough to be featured in the passing game, but I do think he's great in the passing game on third down and short and up to eight or nine yards and he's always great in goal line situations. I think Coach Payton should alter his playbook a little to include more two back sets, because it don't make sense to have one of the best blocking FBs in the league and not and not get full usage out of him.

You know, there always a first time for everything. It's obvious that things aren't working the way they are. All I'm saying is it's time to try something new. God know the few times we did use him as a blocker it worked, or at least better than without him. After all we don't have our bruising running back in there, at least until we see what Branch can do, if that's how they choose to use him.

I believe that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. But, it's definitly broke right now, so let's at least try and fix it.

dasaints26 · 10-10-2007, 09:36 PM

There is no exact sceince to judging talent and predicting how it will translate to the NFL. Every year they have 1st round busts and some years top 5 busts. Most people had Bush as the #1 talent in last years draft and if he is a bust alot of people were wrong. Alot of people who do that for a living judging talent and projecting it to the NFL. Most people agree Houston made a mistake especially after the season we had improving that much in one year. This year is not over and I dont think most people would call Bush a bust just yet. I think our oline who has been underachieving will get rolling and our offense will get back to where we were last year. We still are explosive and have alot of talent on that side of the ball. We will get rolling and Sunday is a good day to start it. After leading the league in offense all last year we will look back to these 4 games as underachieving and the rest of our 12 games as who we really are.

Euphoria · 10-10-2007, 11:59 PM

Originally Posted by dasaints26

There is no exact sceince to judging talent and predicting how it will translate to the NFL. Every year they have 1st round busts and some years top 5 busts. Most people had Bush as the #1 talent in last years draft and if he is a bust alot of people were wrong. Alot of people who do that for a living judging talent and projecting it to the NFL. Most people agree Houston made a mistake especially after the season we had improving that much in one year. This year is not over and I dont think most people would call Bush a bust just yet. I think our oline who has been underachieving will get rolling and our offense will get back to where we were last year. We still are explosive and have alot of talent on that side of the ball. We will get rolling and Sunday is a good day to start it. After leading the league in offense all last year we will look back to these 4 games as underachieving and the rest of our 12 games as who we really are.

"UNDERACHIEVING" -underachieving??? U-N-D-E-R-A-C-H-I-E-V-I-N-G? The Saints offensive line UNDERACHIEVING... you're kidding right?

blacksaint · 10-11-2007, 12:36 AM

Originally Posted by JOESAM2002

You know, there always a first time for everything. It's obvious that things aren't working the way they are. All I'm saying is it's time to try something new. God know the few times we did use him as a blocker it worked, or at least better than without him. After all we don't have our bruising running back in there, at least until we see what Branch can do, if that's how they choose to use him.

I believe that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. But, it's definitly broke right now, so let's at least try and fix it.

Don't get me wrong Joe, I totally agree that he should be played more, a lot more. I think Reggie would have a better chance of breaking a big one with Karney leading the way. I just think he's not fluid enough to be used extensively in a west coast style passing offense, now as a traditional blocking FB, Payton should play him 100% of the time, everytime he lines Reggie up in the eye, Karney should be right along with him. And if he have to put Reggie in a single eye formation, than put Karney at one of the TE positions, he's a better blocker than all of our TEs.

WhoDat205 · 10-11-2007, 09:49 AM

Originally Posted by Euphoria

"UNDERACHIEVING" -underachieving??? U-N-D-E-R-A-C-H-I-E-V-I-N-G? The Saints offensive line UNDERACHIEVING... you're kidding right?

I'm really not trying to pile on here, but what are you talking about? Are you saying you expected an 0-4 start? You expected Brees to have 9ints to 1 TD? You expected to be dead last in essentially ever major statistical category? You expected to be the laughing stock of the league?

Originally Posted by blacksaint

Don't get me wrong Joe, I totally agree that he should be played more, a lot more. I think Reggie would have a better chance of breaking a big one with Karney leading the way. I just think he's not fluid enough to be used extensively in a west coast style passing offense, now as a traditional blocking FB, Payton should play him 100% of the time, everytime he lines Reggie up in the eye, Karney should be right along with him. And if he have to put Reggie in a single eye formation, than put Karney at one of the TE positions, he's a better blocker than all of our TEs.

I think Karney can fill the role of a West Coast FB. He may be big, but he's got good hands and some speed. He and EJ are being under utilized

JOESAM2002 · 10-11-2007, 09:54 AM

Originally Posted by WhoDat205

I'm really not trying to pile on here, but what are you talking about? Are you saying you expected an 0-4 start? You expected Brees to have 9ints to 1 TD? You expected to be dead last in essentially ever major statistical category? You expected to be the laughing stock of the league?

I think Karney can fill the role of a West Coast FB. He may be big, but he's got good hands and some speed. He and EJ are being under utilized

So very true. Without Deuce we should be making use of both of these guys. Either one or both could add so much to our offense. Please Coach Payton, see the better part of your offense, use these guys. They can help us win.

Euphoria · 10-11-2007, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by WhoDat205

I'm really not trying to pile on here, but what are you talking about? Are you saying you expected an 0-4 start? You expected Brees to have 9ints to 1 TD? You expected to be dead last in essentially ever major statistical category? You expected to be the laughing stock of the league?

I think Karney can fill the role of a West Coast FB. He may be big, but he's got good hands and some speed. He and EJ are being under utilized

I actually suspected us being 1-3 maybe 0-4. The teams we opened with all have good lines... those good lines will keep you in more games than not. You really have to go back and evaluate the games we lost last year and see it was only a matter of time before reality showed up. I have already posted my prediction of being 0-5 after this coming week. Our lines and team over achieved last year to get us 2 games above 500 thats it, nothing more only 2 games above 500. When we played a team with Dominate lines we got blown out... that was not a mistake there was a reason for that.

DeadmaN · 10-17-2007, 11:33 AM

yes I'm gigging up this thread once again
because it needs to be

I guess that last weeks game should Say it all
Reggie can handle the starting position and I think he proved that point

ahhh the bitter taste of irony

but I'm sure his critics’ will say...
"it's only one game and you can't base your assumptions on one game"

I say to them...
"you can't base your assumptions on a season that has not given him the chance to prove if he is good enough and maybe (yes I know this is a big maybe) you can't see potential if it smacked you in the face"

10-10-2007, 07:28 PM	#61
blacksaint DARE TO ENTER Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Home Sweet Home, NEW ORLEANS, La. Posts: 1,154	Re: Reggie Bush Originally Posted by JOESAM2002 I agree that running behind Karney will slow his roll and make him wait for the hole to open up. Plus it will give Brees another blocker, giving him more time and give the receivers more time to get open. My question is this. If we can see it, why can't Payton see it? The only problem I can see is Payton coaches a west coast style offense and they typically don't use a bruising style FB. Karney is a prototype, smash mouth, throwback style of FB that is great at cracking skulls and busting lips but he's not fluid enough to be featured in the passing game, but I do think he's great in the passing game on third down and short and up to eight or nine yards and he's always great in goal line situations. I think Coach Payton should alter his playbook a little to include more two back sets, because it don't make sense to have one of the best blocking FBs in the league and not and not get full usage out of him.
	saint4life (504)

10-10-2007, 07:31 PM	#62
blacksaint DARE TO ENTER Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Home Sweet Home, NEW ORLEANS, La. Posts: 1,154	Re: Reggie Bush Perhaps Payton can't see the forest for the trees. He sees these guys everyday and has developed relationships that may blurrrrrr or taint what he is seeing on the field - and on the films. That might explain why Simoneau is still the starting MLB.

10-10-2007, 07:40 PM	#63
JOESAM2002 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: CRYSTAL BEACH TEXAS Posts: 4,100	Re: Reggie Bush Originally Posted by blacksaint The only problem I can see is Payton coaches a west coast style offense and they typically don't use a bruising style FB. Karney is a prototype, smash mouth, throwback style of FB that is great at cracking skulls and busting lips but he's not fluid enough to be featured in the passing game, but I do think he's great in the passing game on third down and short and up to eight or nine yards and he's always great in goal line situations. I think Coach Payton should alter his playbook a little to include more two back sets, because it don't make sense to have one of the best blocking FBs in the league and not and not get full usage out of him. You know, there always a first time for everything. It's obvious that things aren't working the way they are. All I'm saying is it's time to try something new. God know the few times we did use him as a blocker it worked, or at least better than without him. After all we don't have our bruising running back in there, at least until we see what Branch can do, if that's how they choose to use him. I believe that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. But, it's definitly broke right now, so let's at least try and fix it.
	Sometimes it's better to keep your mouth shut and be thought an idiot, than to open it and remove all doubt!!!!! "Every time you think, you weaken the nation!" Moe Howard...The Three Stooges.

10-10-2007, 09:36 PM	#64
dasaints26 100th Post Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 167	Re: Reggie Bush There is no exact sceince to judging talent and predicting how it will translate to the NFL. Every year they have 1st round busts and some years top 5 busts. Most people had Bush as the #1 talent in last years draft and if he is a bust alot of people were wrong. Alot of people who do that for a living judging talent and projecting it to the NFL. Most people agree Houston made a mistake especially after the season we had improving that much in one year. This year is not over and I dont think most people would call Bush a bust just yet. I think our oline who has been underachieving will get rolling and our offense will get back to where we were last year. We still are explosive and have alot of talent on that side of the ball. We will get rolling and Sunday is a good day to start it. After leading the league in offense all last year we will look back to these 4 games as underachieving and the rest of our 12 games as who we really are.
dasaints26 100th Post Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 167

10-10-2007, 11:59 PM	#65
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Re: Reggie Bush Originally Posted by dasaints26 There is no exact sceince to judging talent and predicting how it will translate to the NFL. Every year they have 1st round busts and some years top 5 busts. Most people had Bush as the #1 talent in last years draft and if he is a bust alot of people were wrong. Alot of people who do that for a living judging talent and projecting it to the NFL. Most people agree Houston made a mistake especially after the season we had improving that much in one year. This year is not over and I dont think most people would call Bush a bust just yet. I think our oline who has been underachieving will get rolling and our offense will get back to where we were last year. We still are explosive and have alot of talent on that side of the ball. We will get rolling and Sunday is a good day to start it. After leading the league in offense all last year we will look back to these 4 games as underachieving and the rest of our 12 games as who we really are. "UNDERACHIEVING" -underachieving??? U-N-D-E-R-A-C-H-I-E-V-I-N-G? The Saints offensive line UNDERACHIEVING... you're kidding right?

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10-11-2007, 12:36 AM	#66
blacksaint DARE TO ENTER Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Home Sweet Home, NEW ORLEANS, La. Posts: 1,154	Re: Reggie Bush Originally Posted by JOESAM2002 You know, there always a first time for everything. It's obvious that things aren't working the way they are. All I'm saying is it's time to try something new. God know the few times we did use him as a blocker it worked, or at least better than without him. After all we don't have our bruising running back in there, at least until we see what Branch can do, if that's how they choose to use him. I believe that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. But, it's definitly broke right now, so let's at least try and fix it. Don't get me wrong Joe, I totally agree that he should be played more, a lot more. I think Reggie would have a better chance of breaking a big one with Karney leading the way. I just think he's not fluid enough to be used extensively in a west coast style passing offense, now as a traditional blocking FB, Payton should play him 100% of the time, everytime he lines Reggie up in the eye, Karney should be right along with him. And if he have to put Reggie in a single eye formation, than put Karney at one of the TE positions, he's a better blocker than all of our TEs.
	saint4life (504)

10-11-2007, 09:49 AM	#67
WhoDat205 Prediction Pain Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Birmingham, AL Posts: 1,082 Blog Entries: 2	Re: Reggie Bush Originally Posted by Euphoria "UNDERACHIEVING" -underachieving??? U-N-D-E-R-A-C-H-I-E-V-I-N-G? The Saints offensive line UNDERACHIEVING... you're kidding right? I'm really not trying to pile on here, but what are you talking about? Are you saying you expected an 0-4 start? You expected Brees to have 9ints to 1 TD? You expected to be dead last in essentially ever major statistical category? You expected to be the laughing stock of the league? Originally Posted by blacksaint Don't get me wrong Joe, I totally agree that he should be played more, a lot more. I think Reggie would have a better chance of breaking a big one with Karney leading the way. I just think he's not fluid enough to be used extensively in a west coast style passing offense, now as a traditional blocking FB, Payton should play him 100% of the time, everytime he lines Reggie up in the eye, Karney should be right along with him. And if he have to put Reggie in a single eye formation, than put Karney at one of the TE positions, he's a better blocker than all of our TEs. I think Karney can fill the role of a West Coast FB. He may be big, but he's got good hands and some speed. He and EJ are being under utilized

10-11-2007, 09:54 AM	#68
JOESAM2002 1000 Posts + Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: CRYSTAL BEACH TEXAS Posts: 4,100	Re: Reggie Bush Originally Posted by WhoDat205 I'm really not trying to pile on here, but what are you talking about? Are you saying you expected an 0-4 start? You expected Brees to have 9ints to 1 TD? You expected to be dead last in essentially ever major statistical category? You expected to be the laughing stock of the league? I think Karney can fill the role of a West Coast FB. He may be big, but he's got good hands and some speed. He and EJ are being under utilized So very true. Without Deuce we should be making use of both of these guys. Either one or both could add so much to our offense. Please Coach Payton, see the better part of your offense, use these guys. They can help us win.

10-11-2007, 12:19 PM	#69
Euphoria 5000 POSTS! + Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 7,601 Blog Entries: 5	Re: Reggie Bush Originally Posted by WhoDat205 I'm really not trying to pile on here, but what are you talking about? Are you saying you expected an 0-4 start? You expected Brees to have 9ints to 1 TD? You expected to be dead last in essentially ever major statistical category? You expected to be the laughing stock of the league? I think Karney can fill the role of a West Coast FB. He may be big, but he's got good hands and some speed. He and EJ are being under utilized I actually suspected us being 1-3 maybe 0-4. The teams we opened with all have good lines... those good lines will keep you in more games than not. You really have to go back and evaluate the games we lost last year and see it was only a matter of time before reality showed up. I have already posted my prediction of being 0-5 after this coming week. Our lines and team over achieved last year to get us 2 games above 500 thats it, nothing more only 2 games above 500. When we played a team with Dominate lines we got blown out... that was not a mistake there was a reason for that.

10-17-2007, 11:33 AM	#70
DeadmaN Saints Junky Join Date: May 2007 Location: Metairie Originally now a Houston transplant Posts: 672	Re: Reggie Bush yes I'm gigging up this thread once again because it needs to be I guess that last weeks game should Say it all Reggie can handle the starting position and I think he proved that point ahhh the bitter taste of irony but I'm sure his critics’ will say... "it's only one game and you can't base your assumptions on one game" I say to them... "you can't base your assumptions on a season that has not given him the chance to prove if he is good enough and maybe (yes I know this is a big maybe) you can't see potential if it smacked you in the face"
	http://blackandgold.com/members/dead...1t-saints3.gif Last edited by DeadmaN; 10-17-2007 at 11:39 AM..